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    (Original post by Kieran1996)
    No you're not.

    There are skills to be learnt from everyday life.

    You probably gained more skills from the diner than half the other people who just sat in a solicitors for a week pretending to do the job and gain experience.
    lol, thats literally what i'm doing right now.
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    If you want to find out whether you're screwed just answer this question.

    1) Do you live in a Capitalist society?
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    (Original post by jneill)
    So do you know HOW the business works?
    It's partly mine and I was working there before it became mine as a teenager, so yes.

    How to buy stock (quality, price), add value to it, sell it for a profit.
    I'm not McDonald's but clearly I know how to make a profit.

    How to manage limited resources (e.g. table places vs customers at busy times - or what happens when you run out of burgers...).
    "Manage limited resources" sounds like there's a Zombie apocalypse and I'm called upon to prevent a famine. Yes I know how to handle shortages given enough time (nothing will be done at the last minute unless I call friends/acquaintances who work in nearby restaurants and they're nice enough to sell me drinks/buns/whatever. This works both ways which is why they do it.).

    Business relationships with external parties - rent negotiations, council trading licenses, environmental health inspectors, trade bodies, your bank and shareholders...
    Rent negotiations - rent has been stable since the 2008 fiasco. I know the owner pretty well.
    Council trading licenses - there are several licenses depending on what you sell (food, alcohol, etc). Again, nothing impressive here or worth talking about.
    Enviromental health inspectors - it's not exactly a business relationship. As long as you meet the standards and make sure the staff know what they are, you're good to go (experienced workers know them pretty well, especially the kitchen staff so never had a problem there)

    Again, not McDonald's, there are no other shareholders except me and my partner.

    What about the finances? Do you understand a profit & loss, and balance sheet and cashflow. VAT. HMRC. Business forecasts. Audits. Wages, timesheet, staff disciplinary procedures. Hiring / firing...
    Not sure what is there to know about most of those things (VAT? HMRC? what kind of skills does one need to pay taxes?). I don't do business forecasts, I'm not a business analyst (if I knew how well a business would go, I'd buy shares on the market, not run a ****ing diner). Some of those things like "audits" are outsourced to an accountant anyway.

    The point is that I've been working full time for 4 years for a business that has remained stagnant. It has been profitable depending on the year but I've not been particularly successful at it (no expansions, nothing particularly new going on since forever). In part because of my health and studies but also because I'm not passionate about it.

    I don't know how to convey those things without the hiring manager going "yeah, you're not particularly impressive, are ya?"
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    I graduated with a degree in Economics and Politics (high 2:1) from a red brick university this past September at the age of 26. I'm now 27.

    I've had health problems since I was teenager which also affected me during my studies. As a result, I had to drop out at the beginning of my 2nd year and repeat it (although I received full marks due to mit. circumstances). I graduated in 4 years.

    I'm also a co-owner of a diner from which I financed my studies (I'd not have been able to study otherwise). I still make money from it but it's clearly not what I want to do in life (job is boring and offers no challenges).

    Because of my health problems, I gained no work experience during my studies (I've only worked for my own business). I also don't have any UCAS points as I've non-UK high school credentials (some firms have equivalent tables but 95% don't). I didn't know this but a huge number of jobs require specific points for entry.

    Does this mean I'm unemployable?? everyone seems to have had past work experience or be really young which I'm not anymore.
    Cant see what the problem is other than you talking yourself down.
    Depends what jobs you are after, but id just put my equivalents in.

    Own business that turns a profit = very employable.
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    (Original post by SoggyCabbages)
    If you want to find out whether you're screwed just answer this question.

    1) Do you live in a Capitalist society?
    1) I'm a small-time, "petit" capitalist/bourgeois exploiter myself. Worse, I'm a landlord, I own a few rental properties (though the property market has imploded in the European periphery).
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    1) I'm a small-time, "petit" capitalist/bourgeois exploiter myself. Worse, I'm a landlord, I own a few rental properties (though the property market has imploded in the European periphery).
    You seem to have been a product of embourgeoisement.

    I'll refine my questions then:

    1) Are you not a member of the bourgeoisie?
    2) Do you live in a Capitalist society?

    If you answered yes to both of those you are screwed.
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    ......
    You need to change your mindset. I've read CVs that read about five times stronger than what you've written there, and all the kid has done is two terms of Young Enterprise!

    What you have just described is significantly more than most graduates have - if pitched properly.
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    I'd stick to the diner honestly. You've got a good little business running there making you a decent living. If you think that every job is supposed to be fun and exciting, you don't understand how 99% of the planet actually lives. Pursue other things on the side(e.g if you enjoy photography and you're good at it, make it into a business). Degrees these days really do not differentiate you anymore(blame that on governments post 1997 who have a blatant disregard for supply/demand economics and who have a disdain of the trades for some reason). That's just my two cents. And UCAS points are just stupid, what imbecile invented them. Just another way for employers to pass up good talent because candidates don't meet criteria that they sat exams for a decade earlier.
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    It's partly mine and I was working there before it became mine as a teenager, so yes.



    I'm not McDonald's but clearly I know how to make a profit.



    "Manage limited resources" sounds like there's a Zombie apocalypse and I'm called upon to prevent a famine. Yes I know how to handle shortages given enough time (nothing will be done at the last minute unless I call friends/acquaintances who work in nearby restaurants and they're nice enough to sell me drinks/buns/whatever. This works both ways which is why they do it.).



    Rent negotiations - rent has been stable since the 2008 fiasco. I know the owner pretty well.
    Council trading licenses - there are several licenses depending on what you sell (food, alcohol, etc). Again, nothing impressive here or worth talking about.
    Enviromental health inspectors - it's not exactly a business relationship. As long as you meet the standards and make sure the staff know what they are, you're good to go (experienced workers know them pretty well, especially the kitchen staff so never had a problem there)

    Again, not McDonald's, there are no other shareholders except me and my partner.



    Not sure what is there to know about most of those things (VAT? HMRC? what kind of skills does one need to pay taxes?). I don't do business forecasts, I'm not a business analyst (if I knew how well a business would go, I'd buy shares on the market, not run a ****ing diner). Some of those things like "audits" are outsourced to an accountant anyway.

    The point is that I've been working full time for 4 years for a business that has remained stagnant. It has been profitable depending on the year but I've not been particularly successful at it (no expansions, nothing particularly new going on since forever). In part because of my health and studies but also because I'm not passionate about it.

    I don't know how to convey those things without the hiring manager going "yeah, you're not particularly impressive, are ya?"
    If you basically do the opposite of what you're doing right now, you'll have no problem getting a job. Your CV and interview is all about talking yourself UP, not DOWN. You have a good degree in a respectable subject from a good university. On top of that you owned and ran your own business. If you go into a job interview with confidence and talk all that stuff up, emphasise the positives and not the negatives, then 99% of the time you will get the job, trust me. It's all about attitude and posture.
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    Threeportdrift is quite correct. Again. You're ahead of most 'normal' undergraduates coming out of the gate, unless it's a hirer who insists on a certain level of age and inexperience so you can willingly be molded into their vision of an investment banker, or whatever.

    If you don't believe TSR (a prudent starting point, BTW), and can't approach an employer for feedback, consider having someone check you out for depression. You sound down enough to be missing a lot of the good stuff. Alternatively, you could self-medicate [in a good way] by spending a week at the beach, or otherwise escaping gloom for a while.

    Just remember-- you got a good degree that would have been even better if you hadn't had to earn a living by managing 4-6 other people. You did all that through an economic environment that would have destroyed many. :thumbsup:
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    (Original post by marco14196)
    I'd stick to the diner honestly. You've got a good little business running there making you a decent living. If you think that every job is supposed to be fun and exciting, you don't understand how 99% of the planet actually lives. Pursue other things on the side(e.g if you enjoy photography and you're good at it, make it into a business). Degrees these days really do not differentiate you anymore(blame that on governments post 1997 who have a blatant disregard for supply/demand economics and who have a disdain of the trades for some reason). That's just my two cents. And UCAS points are just stupid, what imbecile invented them. Just another way for employers to pass up good talent because candidates don't meet criteria that they sat exams for a decade earlier.
    Perhaps but then you've no idea what running a tiny business of this kind involves. You must be there 7 days a week, 12+ hours a day. Unless you make a huge profit (which I really don't), it's not worth it. It's demoralising and exhausting. If I am absent, someone has to be there in my place. Which means, I'll be losing $$$$$ every hour. I know people who work far less than I do (9 hours/5 days a week) have far less stress and make as much as I do doing things that they're good at and find important and meaningful.

    I don't disagree that degrees are not a particularly good investment.
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    Perhaps but then you've no idea what running a tiny business of this kind involves. You must be there 7 days a week, 12+ hours a day. Unless you make a huge profit (which I really don't), it's not worth it. It's demoralising and exhausting. If I am absent, someone has to be there in my place. Which means, I'll be losing $$$$$ every hour. I know people who work far less than I do (9 hours/5 days a week) have far less stress and make as much as I do doing things that they're good at and find important and meaningful.

    I don't disagree that degrees are not a particularly good investment.
    Ok, fair enough. You didn't really state how successful the business was so maybe that was a bad assumption on my part. The point I was making was that unless you have that dream job you've always wanted, you'll never be satisfied. Jobs aren't meant to be enjoyed, they're there to make a living. If you find enjoyment in it, that's always a plus. Most people work jobs they find boring but they do it for the fiscal reward it brings. That's my view anyway. If you're looking for a fun and enjoyable one that pays well, you'll be looking for a long time
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    (Original post by Camilli)
    Threeportdrift is quite correct. Again. You're ahead of most 'normal' undergraduates coming out of the gate, unless it's a hirer who insists on a certain level of age and inexperience so you can willingly be molded into their vision of an investment banker, or whatever.

    If you don't believe TSR (a prudent starting point, BTW), and can't approach an employer for feedback, consider having someone check you out for depression. You sound down enough to be missing a lot of the good stuff. Alternatively, you could self-medicate [in a good way] by spending a week at the beach, or otherwise escaping gloom for a while.
    I've had depression (on and off) since I was 17. It's one of my problems. In this case however, it's my being supremely unhappy with my progress in this business, it's not unprovoked. I've been meditating for what seems like centuries. I actually live by the beach right now. Those things don't work for me. What will work, I think, is putting myself out there and applying for jobs and actually see progress. I'm really pessimistic though.
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    It's partly mine and I was working there before it became mine as a teenager, so yes.



    I'm not McDonald's but clearly I know how to make a profit.



    "Manage limited resources" sounds like there's a Zombie apocalypse and I'm called upon to prevent a famine. Yes I know how to handle shortages given enough time (nothing will be done at the last minute unless I call friends/acquaintances who work in nearby restaurants and they're nice enough to sell me drinks/buns/whatever. This works both ways which is why they do it.).



    Rent negotiations - rent has been stable since the 2008 fiasco. I know the owner pretty well.
    Council trading licenses - there are several licenses depending on what you sell (food, alcohol, etc). Again, nothing impressive here or worth talking about.
    Enviromental health inspectors - it's not exactly a business relationship. As long as you meet the standards and make sure the staff know what they are, you're good to go (experienced workers know them pretty well, especially the kitchen staff so never had a problem there)

    Again, not McDonald's, there are no other shareholders except me and my partner.



    Not sure what is there to know about most of those things (VAT? HMRC? what kind of skills does one need to pay taxes?). I don't do business forecasts, I'm not a business analyst (if I knew how well a business would go, I'd buy shares on the market, not run a ****ing diner). Some of those things like "audits" are outsourced to an accountant anyway.

    The point is that I've been working full time for 4 years for a business that has remained stagnant. It has been profitable depending on the year but I've not been particularly successful at it (no expansions, nothing particularly new going on since forever). In part because of my health and studies but also because I'm not passionate about it.

    I don't know how to convey those things without the hiring manager going "yeah, you're not particularly impressive, are ya?"
    You are completely missing the point. (And even McDonalds started as a small local diner.)

    Anyway, so what job DO you want to do?

    I hope it's not marketing...
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    I'm really pessimistic though.
    This is your problem, and the only thing that you have described that sounds anything other than highly employable. Have you seen any jobs you want to apply for? I'm happy to help you pick out your skills to highlight in your CV.
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    (Original post by jneill)
    You are completely missing the point. (And even McDonalds started as a small local diner.)

    Anyway, so what job DO you want to do?

    I hope it's not marketing...
    I did not miss the point, I tried to address it here

    The point is that I've been working full time for 4 years for a business that has remained stagnant. It has been profitable depending on the year but I've not been particularly successful at it (no expansions, nothing particularly new going on since forever).
    Clearly not McD's.

    I've narrowed it down to logistics/transport management, supply chain management or planning (media included).

    As to whether I'm good at marketing myself, I'm not trying to sell myself here. I needed a third person opinion on my unorthodox background and development and a cold, hard look on my choices in life so far. It's really nice that some people have been very positive but it's clear I need to talk to the employers themselves directly.
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    (Original post by marco14196)
    Ok, fair enough. You didn't really state how successful the business was so maybe that was a bad assumption on my part. The point I was making was that unless you have that dream job you've always wanted, you'll never be satisfied. Jobs aren't meant to be enjoyed, they're there to make a living. If you find enjoyment in it, that's always a plus. Most people work jobs they find boring but they do it for the fiscal reward it brings. That's my view anyway. If you're looking for a fun and enjoyable one that pays well, you'll be looking for a long time
    Dude, I've been working since I was a child. I started waiting tables when I was 13. I've been working for myself since I was 18. I don't need to be told that life is not all fun and games or that jobs aren't particularly enjoyable for most people. I know it. That doesn't mean I'll stop trying to find a job that's interesting and that I'm good at. I may fail but so far, I've gone with the "a job is something you do to survive" attitude and it's demoralising and unhelpful.
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    (Original post by GreenIceCream)
    I did not miss the point, I tried to address it here



    Clearly not McD's.

    I've narrowed it down to logistics/transport management, supply chain management or planning (media included).

    As to whether I'm good at marketing myself, I'm not trying to sell myself here. I needed a third person opinion on my unorthodox background and development and a cold, hard look on my choices in life so far. It's really nice that some people have been very positive but it's clear I need to talk to the employers themselves directly.
    Media planning? That's my career. If someone with an Economics 2:1 and real world business experience turned up for an entry-level position I'd probably hire them on the spot. (Unfortunately I'm no longer in a hiring role.). Check out the various companies in GroupM for a start - Mediacom, Mindshare, Maxus, MEC, etc.

    You DO have relevant skills, you just need to spin it in a positive way.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    No it does not, might make you less employable than some others but thats it.
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    I've recruited for some of the type of industries/jobs you have stated an interest in with major companies. From what you have said your CV/application form could be far MORE interesting than a fair proportion of the grads I recruited, let alone those who got through to assessment centre/interview. You really have to change your attitude and think what do you bring to the table that other applicants can't. And I suspect there is an awful lot more you can bring compared to someone who graduates this month and has 1-2 weeks of "relevant" work experience.
 
 
 
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