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An unpleasant truth about Islam and Western culture. Watch

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    (Original post by MoralInversion)
    Any so called muslim that attends a gay pride march is certainly not a true muslim.
    The same can be said for a christian.
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    (Original post by Proximo)
    I highly doubt anyone on here would gladly hurt a homosexual, you shouldn't be so cynical, it's not healthy.
    It's not cynicism; I have debated with people on here.

    I've met one person on here who said a homosexual person on here should be stoned to death, said it to this other user, and from my interactions with her and from what I had seen of her, I believe she was genuine in her remark.

    I've met some truly disgusting people on here; it's not fabricated.

    Do you want me to quote other extreme people? (I can't quote her though; the 500 or 800 post thread was deleted. I'm pretty sure it was 800 posts long though, but it was definitely over 500.)

    And I've met quite a few extremists on here.
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    (Original post by fixup)
    What exactly can we do about a muslim who believes this stuff but doesnt put it into practise? Are we living in a far right, fascist establishment trying to control our thoughts?

    From a legal stance we can despise muslims who believe in stuff like this. But that's it. It's futile to criticise the ideology and start with a practical approach.
    As AA says, before you can solve a problem, first you have to admit that you have one.

    It is not about despising people who hold such views - remember that the majority of them have simply been indoctrinated from childhood. It is more important that Muslims look at Islam through a critical lens, in the context of the rights and expectations of 21st century, secular democracy and intellectual enlightenment. This is something that simply isn't happening, and will not happen if anyone who broaches the subject is shouted down as an Islamophobe or racist.
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    (Original post by fixup)
    The same can be said for a christian.
    The concept of the New Testament abrogating the OT allows for a far more nuanced approach to such matters.
    The immutable infallibility of the Quran does not.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    As AA says, before you can solve a problem, first you have to admit that you have one.

    It is not about despising people who hold such views - remember that the majority of them have simply been indoctrinated from childhood. It is more important that Muslims look at Islam through a critical lens, in the context of the rights and expectations of 21st century, secular democracy and intellectual enlightenment. This is something that simply isn't happening, and will not happen if anyone who broaches the subject is shouted down as an Islamophobe or racist.
    I do admit there is one. I think the authorities do too, they just choose not to say it publicly as such. We, the citizens, are not as important as protecting their own interests.

    So as i said, no one ever comes up with a solution except for Donald Trump. Even then most of these terrorist attacks are homegrown and his proposal is pretty silly for a number of reasons. So really we need to tackle the problem from the inside. That is why i am against blaming and brutalising the muslim community. We can't make them feel isolated and hated. In that way leftist thinking is really giving us a more practical approach to the problem.

    I think it's almost a populist view that there are dangers surrounding islam. And i think anyone has every right to despise those who condone this. It's just all done in vain. Thats really my point.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    The concept of the New Testament abrogating the OT allows for a far more nuanced approach to such matters.
    The immutable infallibility of the Quran does not.
    i literally didnt understand any of that lol
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    (Original post by MoralInversion)
    Any so called muslim that attends a gay pride march is certainly not a true muslim.
    No true Scotsman...
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    True Islamic culture is not compatible with true Secularist culture. True secularism is the belief that religion can play absolutely no role in the affairs of the state. True Islamic doctrine fundamentally opposes this principle. There is no compromise between these ideologies. The expansion of Islam and Muslim immigration into Western nations is exacerbating this conflict. One ideology is going to fundamentally change the other. That is the struggle we witnessing in real time with the recent terror attacks.

    Most Muslims aren’t terrorists, but most Muslims do support Sharia Law. Muslims amongst us who support Sharia Law contribute to this conflict directly, and indirectly. They are a threat to secularist principles. It is not racist, or bigoted to acknowledge that if it is true. Many of us realize that a tipping point is upon us. That is the driving force behind Brexit and the Donald Trump movement. Our society has a choice. Directly oppose the growing influence of an ideology we reject, or compromise our own beliefs to accommodate it. *
    This is simply untrue. One of my best friends has a Jewish mother and a Muslim father - they integrate perfectly. Your impressions of Islamic integration in western society are blatantly just assumptions based on a few media reports.
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    soon the whites will be the minority in the uk with women being made to cover up, and we are just standing back and letting islam take over the country we will be under sharia law in a decade at this rate.
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    Christianity and secularism are completely compatible. *
    The constant running battles in the US over social issues and Christianity would appear to contradict this.

    In your OP you haven't so much offered an argument as simply defined your terms so as to render your argument unfalsifiable. You've essentially just said "Islam is incompatible with secularism because I define 'True Islam' as inherently including opposition to secularism."
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    islam want to wipe the west off the map
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    True Islamic culture is not compatible with true Secularist culture. *
    I think you are setting the bar quite low, even a 'moderate' interpretation of Islam (and by definition every single Muslim) is completely incompatible and should be forcefully deported for preaching an end to our countries and calling for our deaths.

    We can't ban the literature but we should make practicing Islam illegal, throw everyone from here doing it in jail and deport everyone not from here for practicing it. Knock down all Mosques, ban any sort of Islamic attire from all public buildings and arrest anyone seen in the street wearing it.

    I'm not kidding, if a Nazi movement was sweeping across Europe right now I would be hard pressed to wish it to fail, I'd actually considering signing up myself if it were an option. I wonder how many people feel the same way.
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    (Original post by HanSoloLuck)
    I think you are setting the bar quite low, even a 'moderate' interpretation of Islam (and by definition every single Muslim) is completely incompatible and should be forcefully deported for preaching an end to our countries and calling for our deaths.

    We can't ban the literature but we should make practicing Islam illegal, throw everyone from here doing it in jail and deport everyone not from here for practicing it. Knock down all Mosques, ban any sort of Islamic attire from all public buildings and arrest anyone seen in the street wearing it.

    I'm not kidding, if a Nazi movement was sweeping across Europe right now I would be hard pressed to wish it to fail, I'd actually considering signing up myself if it were an option. I wonder how many people feel the same way.
    islam is the new Nazi germany
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    (Original post by fixup)
    i literally didnt understand any of that lol
    He means there are many different interpretations of Christianity, many different denominations. We have seen Christianity change and reform to fit in with it's surroundings, Islam doesn't have the same track record, their adherents are notoriously violently intolerant of reforms and kill anyone for trying.

    Example, there are many different Bibles, all with subtle or extreme differences in their text, there is only one Quran.
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    (Original post by HanSoloLuck)
    He means there are many different interpretations of Christianity, many different denominations. We have seen Christianity change and reform to fit in with it's surroundings, Islam doesn't have the same track record, their adherents are notoriously violently intolerant of reforms and kill anyone for trying.

    Example, there are many different Bibles, all with subtle or extreme differences in their text, there is only one Quran.
    This is an oversimplified, narrow-minded interpretation of Muslim integration. There are so many Muslims I know who integrate perfectly, you are making collective assumptions about the whole Muslim community based on a handful of cases. I voted for Sadiq Khan, who is now the mayor of London - quite obviously he has integrated and so many more have too.
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    The constant running battles in the US over social issues and Christianity would appear to contradict this.

    In your OP you haven't so much offered an argument as simply defined your terms so as to render your argument unfalsifiable. You've essentially just said "Islam is incompatible with secularism because I define 'True Islam' as inherently including opposition to secularism."
    A Muslim saying they don't support Sharia Law is like a Christian saying they don't accept Jesus as their lord a savior. *Start a thread in the Religion forum and see how many Muslims disagree with me. *
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    A Muslim saying they don't support Sharia Law is like a Christian saying they don't accept Jesus as their lord a savior. *Start a thread in the Religion forum and see how many Muslims disagree with me. *


    Marked here in Green are countries with either a Muslim majority or large minority in which Sharia plays no role in the judicial process. This includes some countries that are almost entirely Muslim, like Tunisia and Azerbaijan.
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    True Islamic culture is not compatible with true Secularist culture. True secularism is the belief that religion can play absolutely no role in the affairs of the state.
    Do you realise the UK isn't actually secular?

    (Original post by HanSoloLuck)
    I think you are setting the bar quite low, even a 'moderate' interpretation of Islam (and by definition every single Muslim) is completely incompatible and should be forcefully deported for preaching an end to our countries and calling for our deaths.We can't ban the literature but we should make practicing Islam illegal, throw everyone from here doing it in jail and deport everyone not from here for practicing it. Knock down all Mosques, ban any sort of Islamic attire from all public buildings and arrest anyone seen in the street wearing it.I'm not kidding, if a Nazi movement was sweeping across Europe right now I would be hard pressed to wish it to fail, I'd actually considering signing up myself if it were an option. I wonder how many people feel the same way.
    Of course you would be hard pressed to want a modern Nazi movement to fail. You are one I wish people like you would dam well own their fascistic views and stop dancing around the issue. Stop being a coward.
 
 
 
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