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Owen Jones finally slips the knife into Jeremy Corbyn Watch

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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    I'll call concede that. More pragmatic than I had him down as before. I also have to give him credit for fronting up to the Momentum bullies given their distasteful habit of slandering anyone who disagrees with them on anything, especially Corbyn. It's one thing for someone from the PLP to do it as Momentum probably oppose them in the first place anyway and they have the rest of the moderates to side with but Jones risked a lot here and that's quite brave. I always say that the ability to change one's mind is a good trait.

    However I must admit a small part of me considered it a plus point for Corbyn to be attacked by Owen Jones, like a badge of honour *I'll say though that I'm unsure how much damage this'll do to Corbyn, given the personality cult that surrounds him and the fact his supporters are the most blind and dogmatic people in the world. Instead of thinking "hmmm, if even Owen Jones has had enough of him then maybe it's worth reading the article" (and they should as it's actually a very good post hes written there) they'll call Jones a Blairite or some deluded nonsense.

    Still, I've grown a slight bit of respect for Jones.*

    * incredible but unsurprising. I did read it. It's a very good article.* *
    If you read the blog you will know that Owen Jones has not turned against Corbyn, but actually said that he is concerned the left of Labour Party would be badly effected if Corbyn loses badly, which he seems to think is likely. As for attacks on Jones, this is what he had to say about it.
    " Oh, but stop portraying Corbyn supporters as an abusive, intolerant mob. *Loads* are sharing the blog and responding positively. "
    " Barely anybody has called me a Blairite or a Tory, by the way, apart from a few eccentric oddballs. So can we drop that narrative. Cheers! "
    Owen Jones on Twitter
    reposted from earlier post by ChaoticButterfly.
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    The popular choice Owen Smith gives out free ice cream in Liverpool!

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    The unelectable scumbag leftie trot Jeremy Corbyn gets booed out of Liverpool by an angry mob!

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    (Original post by Farm_Ecology)
    My issue with his piece, is that it fails to deal with what is the potential fatal flaw in all of this. Should Corbyn stand down as leader, it is not only going against the principles of the labour party, it is in many ways admitting that the majority of the party simply do not want a socialist government.
    Utter nonsense. The fundamental assumption of your statement is that only Corbyn is a true socialist, which is a slur though a common belief amongst Corbynista who tend to get their information from Twitter propagandists. In fact, claiming that a lawful leadership challenge according to the rules of the party is "against the rules of the party", and that if Corbyn steps down then Labour is effectively over, is the just the kind of personality cult crap we've come to expect from the Corbynista; in their mind, there is no distinction between Corbyn and Labour, they are one and the same and all allegiance is to be rendered to the Great Helmsman. Anyone who doesn't is "not a true socialist / Red Tory / Blairite scum" etc. Or, if we're going by what a Corbynite called Angela Eagle, a "treacherous fat dyke"

    The second error on your part is to make reference to a Corbyn "socialist government"; there will never be a government led by Corbyn. He is unelectable. He is the most unpopular opposition leader since polling began; a majority of Labour *voters* and union members want him to step down. Almost unprecedentedly, Theresa May leads Corbyn as preferred Prime Minister in the 18-24 demographic, something unimaginable prior to the Corbyn disaster. In fact, one third of Labour voters say they prefer May to Corbyn. This level of electoral armageddon and complete breakdown between Labour *voters* and the leadership in the CorbynBunker spells trouble.

    But of course Corbyn, Milne and McDonnell are willing to split the party rather than let a soft-left MP (who is in fact to the left of Miliband) step up to the plate in order to make some effort to salvage this situation.

    Finally, it's unclear how you can call Corbyn a socialist given his repeated betrayal of social values and morals. He accepted up to £20,000 from a regime that murders gay people, paid in order to host programmes on a propaganda network which regularly broadcasts anti-gay and anti-semitic propaganda. In fact, the network itself was directly implicated in being complicit in the torture of a journalist. It seems Corbyn is very happy to appear on Torture TV, but turning up to Channel 4 for a televised leadership debate is too much for his putatively delicate sensibilites.

    This doesn't even get into the expensive gift Corbyn accepted from oil industry lobbyist Ardeshir Naghshineh to help pay for him to go on an energy lobbying trip with Jack Straw and Lord Lamont. Oh and the money Corbyn accepted in payment from Capita, the outsourcing merchants. And of course there's Corbyn's praise as "dedicated to peace and social justice" an organisation whose founding charter calls for all Jews worldwide to be exterminated. And I suppose there's also the man Corbyn honoured and saluted in terms of "You are an honourable man. You represent your people well, and I should like to have tea with you on the terrace"; this man Corbyn was honouring had called Jewish people "loser monkeys".

    And there's Corbyn's utterly immoral support for the IRA, encouraging them to continue a campaign of violence and Corbyn opposing the Anglo-Irish Agreement in parliament. This was at a time when the British government was having back-channel talks with the IRA through MI6 intermediary Michael Oatley; the difference is that when HMG did it, they were always pushing the IRA to agree to a ceasefire and engage in a political process for legitimate democratic participation. When Corbyn spoke to the IRA during this period, it was to egg them on to continue their campaign of bombings and shootings, a campaign which in hindsight was an obscene waste of lives given the IRA ended up accepting partition and a deal that was no more ambitious than what they were offered in 1972. It is worth noting that during this period Corbyn supported the violent Marxist terrorists of the IRA while giving the cold shoulder to the Labour Party's non-violent fraternal centre-left party the SDLP.

    Corbyn is a disgrace. He has behaved corruptly, he has behaved without honour; he has befriended and lauded anti-semites, homophobes and fasicsts. He's enriched himself and filled his pockets with the blood money of regimes that hang gay people, stone women and imprison trade unionists. But I suppose he probably says, "Who cares? I've enjoyed an MP's salary for the last 30 years sitting in a Labour seat that is so safe that it is essentially a job for life. Why should I care what moral people think?". Whenever there was a moral conundrum between speaking out against homophobia, misogyny or anti-semitism on the one hand, and on the other sucking up to and trying to look good in front of hard left or Islamist men with guns, Corbyn always chose the latter.

    That is why I will vote for Owen Smith as Labour leader; that is why Corbyn must go.

    KingBradly KimKallstrom TelAviv Atlas Thugged
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    Utter nonsense. The fundamental assumption of your statement is that only Corbyn is a true socialist, which is a slur though a common belief amongst Corbynista who tend to get their information from Twitter propagandists. In fact, claiming that a lawful leadership challenge according to the rules of the party is "against the rules of the party", and that if Corbyn steps down then Labour is effectively over, is the just the kind of personality cult crap we've come to expect from the Corbynista; in their mind, there is no distinction between Corbyn and Labour, they are one and the same and all allegiance is to be rendered to the Great Helmsman. Anyone who doesn't is "not a true socialist / Red Tory / Blairite scum" etc. Or, if we're going by what a Corbynite called Angela Eagle, a "treacherous fat dyke"

    The second error on your part is to make reference to a Corbyn "socialist government"; there will never be a government led by Corbyn. He is unelectable. He is the most unpopular opposition leader since polling began; a majority of Labour *voters* and union members want him to step down. Almost unprecedentedly, Theresa May leads Corbyn as preferred Prime Minister in the 18-24 demographic, something unimaginable prior to the Corbyn disaster. In fact, one third of Labour voters say they prefer May to Corbyn. This level of electoral armageddon and complete breakdown between Labour *voters* and the leadership in the CorbynBunker spells trouble.

    But of course Corbyn, Milne and McDonnell are willing to split the party rather than let a soft-left MP (who is in fact to the left of Miliband) step up to the plate in order to make some effort to salvage this situation.

    Finally, it's unclear how you can call Corbyn a socialist given his repeated betrayal of social values and morals. He accepted up to £20,000 from a regime that murders gay people, paid in order to host programmes on a propaganda network which regularly broadcasts anti-gay and anti-semitic propaganda. In fact, the network itself was directly implicated in being complicit in the torture of a journalist. It seems Corbyn is very happy to appear on Torture TV, but turning up to Channel 4 for a televised leadership debate is too much for his putatively delicate sensibilites.

    This doesn't even get into the expensive gift Corbyn accepted from oil industry lobbyist Ardeshir Naghshineh to help pay for him to go on an energy lobbying trip with Jack Straw and Lord Lamont. Oh and the money Corbyn accepted in payment from Capita, the outsourcing merchants. And of course there's Corbyn's praise as "dedicated to peace and social justice" an organisation whose founding charter calls for all Jews worldwide to be exterminated. And I suppose there's also the man Corbyn honoured and saluted in terms of "You are an honourable man. You represent your people well, and I should like to have tea with you on the terrace"; this man Corbyn was honouring had called Jewish people "loser monkeys".

    And there's Corbyn's utterly immoral support for the IRA, encouraging them to continue a campaign of violence and Corbyn opposing the Anglo-Irish Agreement in parliament. This was at a time when the British government was having back-channel talks with the IRA through MI6 intermediary Michael Oatley; the difference is that when HMG did it, they were always pushing the IRA to agree to a ceasefire and engage in a political process for legitimate democratic participation. When Corbyn spoke to the IRA during this period, it was to egg them on to continue their campaign of bombings and shootings, a campaign which in hindsight was an obscene waste of lives given the IRA ended up accepting partition and a deal that was no more ambitious than what they were offered in 1972. It is worth noting that during this period Corbyn supported the violent Marxist terrorists of the IRA while giving the cold shoulder to the Labour Party's non-violent fraternal centre-left party the SDLP.

    Corbyn is a disgrace. He has behaved corruptly, he has behaved without honour; he has befriended and lauded anti-semites, homophobes and fasicsts. He's enriched himself and filled his pockets with the blood money of regimes that hang gay people, stone women and imprison trade unionists. But I suppose he probably says, "Who cares? I've enjoyed an MP's salary for the last 30 years sitting in a Labour seat that is so safe that it is essentially a job for life. Why should I care what moral people think?". Whenever there was a moral conundrum between speaking out against homophobia, misogyny or anti-semitism on the one hand, and on the other sucking up to and trying to look good in front of hard left or Islamist men with guns, Corbyn always chose the latter.

    That is why I will vote for Owen Smith as Labour leader; that is why Corbyn must go.

    KingBradly KimKallstrom TelAviv Atlas Thugged
    Hear, hear.

    Labour are heading of a cliff as things stand and we're doomed to the Tories forever.

    I suspect he refused a TV debate with Owen Smith due to the risk of being called out on this.
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    What do you expect from this little CUCK

    Look at him what a pathetic wimpy looking ****, of course he's a Marxist
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    Utter nonsense. The fundamental assumption of your statement is that only Corbyn is a true socialist, which is a slur though a common belief amongst Corbynista who tend to get their information from Twitter propagandists. In fact, claiming that a lawful leadership challenge according to the rules of the party is "against the rules of the party", and that if Corbyn steps down then Labour is effectively over, is the just the kind of personality cult crap we've come to expect from the Corbynista; in their mind, there is no distinction between Corbyn and Labour, they are one and the same and all allegiance is to be rendered to the Great Helmsman. Anyone who doesn't is "not a true socialist / Red Tory / Blairite scum" etc. Or, if we're going by what a Corbynite called Angela Eagle, a "treacherous fat dyke"

    The second error on your part is to make reference to a Corbyn "socialist government"; there will never be a government led by Corbyn. He is unelectable. He is the most unpopular opposition leader since polling began; a majority of Labour *voters* and union members want him to step down. Almost unprecedentedly, Theresa May leads Corbyn as preferred Prime Minister in the 18-24 demographic, something unimaginable prior to the Corbyn disaster. In fact, one third of Labour voters say they prefer May to Corbyn. This level of electoral armageddon and complete breakdown between Labour *voters* and the leadership in the CorbynBunker spells trouble.

    But of course Corbyn, Milne and McDonnell are willing to split the party rather than let a soft-left MP (who is in fact to the left of Miliband) step up to the plate in order to make some effort to salvage this situation.

    Finally, it's unclear how you can call Corbyn a socialist given his repeated betrayal of social values and morals. He accepted up to £20,000 from a regime that murders gay people, paid in order to host programmes on a propaganda network which regularly broadcasts anti-gay and anti-semitic propaganda. In fact, the network itself was directly implicated in being complicit in the torture of a journalist. It seems Corbyn is very happy to appear on Torture TV, but turning up to Channel 4 for a televised leadership debate is too much for his putatively delicate sensibilites.

    This doesn't even get into the expensive gift Corbyn accepted from oil industry lobbyist Ardeshir Naghshineh to help pay for him to go on an energy lobbying trip with Jack Straw and Lord Lamont. Oh and the money Corbyn accepted in payment from Capita, the outsourcing merchants. And of course there's Corbyn's praise as "dedicated to peace and social justice" an organisation whose founding charter calls for all Jews worldwide to be exterminated. And I suppose there's also the man Corbyn honoured and saluted in terms of "You are an honourable man. You represent your people well, and I should like to have tea with you on the terrace"; this man Corbyn was honouring had called Jewish people "loser monkeys".

    And there's Corbyn's utterly immoral support for the IRA, encouraging them to continue a campaign of violence and Corbyn opposing the Anglo-Irish Agreement in parliament. This was at a time when the British government was having back-channel talks with the IRA through MI6 intermediary Michael Oatley; the difference is that when HMG did it, they were always pushing the IRA to agree to a ceasefire and engage in a political process for legitimate democratic participation. When Corbyn spoke to the IRA during this period, it was to egg them on to continue their campaign of bombings and shootings, a campaign which in hindsight was an obscene waste of lives given the IRA ended up accepting partition and a deal that was no more ambitious than what they were offered in 1972. It is worth noting that during this period Corbyn supported the violent Marxist terrorists of the IRA while giving the cold shoulder to the Labour Party's non-violent fraternal centre-left party the SDLP.

    Corbyn is a disgrace. He has behaved corruptly, he has behaved without honour; he has befriended and lauded anti-semites, homophobes and fasicsts. He's enriched himself and filled his pockets with the blood money of regimes that hang gay people, stone women and imprison trade unionists. But I suppose he probably says, "Who cares? I've enjoyed an MP's salary for the last 30 years sitting in a Labour seat that is so safe that it is essentially a job for life. Why should I care what moral people think?". Whenever there was a moral conundrum between speaking out against homophobia, misogyny or anti-semitism on the one hand, and on the other sucking up to and trying to look good in front of hard left or Islamist men with guns, Corbyn always chose the latter.

    That is why I will vote for Owen Smith as Labour leader; that is why Corbyn must go.

    KingBradly KimKallstrom TelAviv Atlas Thugged
    I agree with every criticism you have made of Corbyn, for me the foremost problem is not that he's a socialist or whatever, it's that far from being the pure politician who can't be bought, he is owned by some of the nastiest most anti-Western regimes in the world, his morals are more bankrupt than his economic policy.


    I however cannot for one moment support Owen Smith either because whilst I agree he is a step up from Corbyn, he still tips his hat to this damaging notion that the Blairite era of the Labour party was somehow a disgrace to be ashamed of in spite of all the real achievements it brought about in terms of sustainable social justice. I voted for Ed Miliband over Cameron, but the day he lost to his brother, I knew the Labour party was heading for some really bad years.
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    (Original post by JamesN88)
    I suspect he refused a TV debate with Owen Smith due to the risk of being called out on this.
    The debate was scheduled for Monday when he was already due to speak in Liverpool. He is in debate with Owen Smith tomorrow in Cardiff. If you look on the Labour party Facebook page they are having five debates ahead of the leadership election.
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    Utter nonsense. The fundamental assumption of your statement is that only Corbyn is a true socialist, which is a slur though a common belief amongst Corbynista who tend to get their information from Twitter propagandists. In fact, claiming that a lawful leadership challenge according to the rules of the party is "against the rules of the party", and that if Corbyn steps down then Labour is effectively over, is the just the kind of personality cult crap we've come to expect from the Corbynista; in their mind, there is no distinction between Corbyn and Labour, they are one and the same and all allegiance is to be rendered to the Great Helmsman. Anyone who doesn't is "not a true socialist / Red Tory / Blairite scum" etc. Or, if we're going by what a Corbynite called Angela Eagle, a "treacherous fat dyke"

    The second error on your part is to make reference to a Corbyn "socialist government"; there will never be a government led by Corbyn. He is unelectable. He is the most unpopular opposition leader since polling began; a majority of Labour *voters* and union members want him to step down. Almost unprecedentedly, Theresa May leads Corbyn as preferred Prime Minister in the 18-24 demographic, something unimaginable prior to the Corbyn disaster. In fact, one third of Labour voters say they prefer May to Corbyn. This level of electoral armageddon and complete breakdown between Labour *voters* and the leadership in the CorbynBunker spells trouble.

    But of course Corbyn, Milne and McDonnell are willing to split the party rather than let a soft-left MP (who is in fact to the left of Miliband) step up to the plate in order to make some effort to salvage this situation.

    Finally, it's unclear how you can call Corbyn a socialist given his repeated betrayal of social values and morals. He accepted up to £20,000 from a regime that murders gay people, paid in order to host programmes on a propaganda network which regularly broadcasts anti-gay and anti-semitic propaganda. In fact, the network itself was directly implicated in being complicit in the torture of a journalist. It seems Corbyn is very happy to appear on Torture TV, but turning up to Channel 4 for a televised leadership debate is too much for his putatively delicate sensibilites.

    This doesn't even get into the expensive gift Corbyn accepted from oil industry lobbyist Ardeshir Naghshineh to help pay for him to go on an energy lobbying trip with Jack Straw and Lord Lamont. Oh and the money Corbyn accepted in payment from Capita, the outsourcing merchants. And of course there's Corbyn's praise as "dedicated to peace and social justice" an organisation whose founding charter calls for all Jews worldwide to be exterminated. And I suppose there's also the man Corbyn honoured and saluted in terms of "You are an honourable man. You represent your people well, and I should like to have tea with you on the terrace"; this man Corbyn was honouring had called Jewish people "loser monkeys".

    And there's Corbyn's utterly immoral support for the IRA, encouraging them to continue a campaign of violence and Corbyn opposing the Anglo-Irish Agreement in parliament. This was at a time when the British government was having back-channel talks with the IRA through MI6 intermediary Michael Oatley; the difference is that when HMG did it, they were always pushing the IRA to agree to a ceasefire and engage in a political process for legitimate democratic participation. When Corbyn spoke to the IRA during this period, it was to egg them on to continue their campaign of bombings and shootings, a campaign which in hindsight was an obscene waste of lives given the IRA ended up accepting partition and a deal that was no more ambitious than what they were offered in 1972. It is worth noting that during this period Corbyn supported the violent Marxist terrorists of the IRA while giving the cold shoulder to the Labour Party's non-violent fraternal centre-left party the SDLP.

    Corbyn is a disgrace. He has behaved corruptly, he has behaved without honour; he has befriended and lauded anti-semites, homophobes and fasicsts. He's enriched himself and filled his pockets with the blood money of regimes that hang gay people, stone women and imprison trade unionists. But I suppose he probably says, "Who cares? I've enjoyed an MP's salary for the last 30 years sitting in a Labour seat that is so safe that it is essentially a job for life. Why should I care what moral people think?". Whenever there was a moral conundrum between speaking out against homophobia, misogyny or anti-semitism on the one hand, and on the other sucking up to and trying to look good in front of hard left or Islamist men with guns, Corbyn always chose the latter.

    That is why I will vote for Owen Smith as Labour leader; that is why Corbyn must go.
    I don't know why you bother with this great long rant, why not just call him a racist, sexist, anti-semite, Marxist, Trot, who wants to bring down the world with all his terrorist friends. This is obviously your opinion, but absolutely nothing to do with his leadership skills, which is why the PLP say they don't want him. Presumably they have known all these things from day one, so why did they wait 9 months to try to get rid of him?
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    This is a reply to Owen Jones article by Manuel Cortes General Secretary of TSSA, the union for people working in all sections of the transport industry

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/manu..._11303870.html
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    [QUOTE=Aliccam;66732866]I don't know why you bother with this great long rant [/QUOTE]



    When you get your teeth into a 'debate' you personally go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on albeit split by other peeps' posts.
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    Utter nonsense. The fundamental assumption of your statement is that only Corbyn is a true socialist, which is a slur though a common belief amongst Corbynista who tend to get their information from Twitter propagandists. In fact, claiming that a lawful leadership challenge according to the rules of the party is "against the rules of the party", and that if Corbyn steps down then Labour is effectively over, is the just the kind of personality cult crap we've come to expect from the Corbynista; in their mind, there is no distinction between Corbyn and Labour, they are one and the same and all allegiance is to be rendered to the Great Helmsman. Anyone who doesn't is "not a true socialist / Red Tory / Blairite scum" etc. Or, if we're going by what a Corbynite called Angela Eagle, a "treacherous fat dyke"

    The second error on your part is to make reference to a Corbyn "socialist government"; there will never be a government led by Corbyn. He is unelectable. He is the most unpopular opposition leader since polling began; a majority of Labour *voters* and union members want him to step down. Almost unprecedentedly, Theresa May leads Corbyn as preferred Prime Minister in the 18-24 demographic, something unimaginable prior to the Corbyn disaster. In fact, one third of Labour voters say they prefer May to Corbyn. This level of electoral armageddon and complete breakdown between Labour *voters* and the leadership in the CorbynBunker spells trouble.

    But of course Corbyn, Milne and McDonnell are willing to split the party rather than let a soft-left MP (who is in fact to the left of Miliband) step up to the plate in order to make some effort to salvage this situation.

    Finally, it's unclear how you can call Corbyn a socialist given his repeated betrayal of social values and morals. He accepted up to £20,000 from a regime that murders gay people, paid in order to host programmes on a propaganda network which regularly broadcasts anti-gay and anti-semitic propaganda. In fact, the network itself was directly implicated in being complicit in the torture of a journalist. It seems Corbyn is very happy to appear on Torture TV, but turning up to Channel 4 for a televised leadership debate is too much for his putatively delicate sensibilites.

    This doesn't even get into the expensive gift Corbyn accepted from oil industry lobbyist Ardeshir Naghshineh to help pay for him to go on an energy lobbying trip with Jack Straw and Lord Lamont. Oh and the money Corbyn accepted in payment from Capita, the outsourcing merchants. And of course there's Corbyn's praise as "dedicated to peace and social justice" an organisation whose founding charter calls for all Jews worldwide to be exterminated. And I suppose there's also the man Corbyn honoured and saluted in terms of "You are an honourable man. You represent your people well, and I should like to have tea with you on the terrace"; this man Corbyn was honouring had called Jewish people "loser monkeys".

    And there's Corbyn's utterly immoral support for the IRA, encouraging them to continue a campaign of violence and Corbyn opposing the Anglo-Irish Agreement in parliament. This was at a time when the British government was having back-channel talks with the IRA through MI6 intermediary Michael Oatley; the difference is that when HMG did it, they were always pushing the IRA to agree to a ceasefire and engage in a political process for legitimate democratic participation. When Corbyn spoke to the IRA during this period, it was to egg them on to continue their campaign of bombings and shootings, a campaign which in hindsight was an obscene waste of lives given the IRA ended up accepting partition and a deal that was no more ambitious than what they were offered in 1972. It is worth noting that during this period Corbyn supported the violent Marxist terrorists of the IRA while giving the cold shoulder to the Labour Party's non-violent fraternal centre-left party the SDLP.

    Corbyn is a disgrace. He has behaved corruptly, he has behaved without honour; he has befriended and lauded anti-semites, homophobes and fasicsts. He's enriched himself and filled his pockets with the blood money of regimes that hang gay people, stone women and imprison trade unionists. But I suppose he probably says, "Who cares? I've enjoyed an MP's salary for the last 30 years sitting in a Labour seat that is so safe that it is essentially a job for life. Why should I care what moral people think?". Whenever there was a moral conundrum between speaking out against homophobia, misogyny or anti-semitism on the one hand, and on the other sucking up to and trying to look good in front of hard left or Islamist men with guns, Corbyn always chose the latter.

    That is why I will vote for Owen Smith as Labour leader; that is why Corbyn must go.

    KingBradly KimKallstrom TelAviv Atlas Thugged
    Nailed it. It's little surprise how most of ha supporters didn't even know who he was two years ago, while those who did - the PLP - can't stand him.

    As for the media thing and his "right to not appear for a hostile organisation", perhaps he'd feel more at home dealing with the Morning Star, who he was writing for when they were applauding the IRA Brighton bombing for killing Tories and cracking jokes about the Conservative MP's wife who was left permanently disabled from it....*
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    (Original post by Atlas Thugged)
    I agree with every criticism you have made of Corbyn, for me the foremost problem is not that he's a socialist or whatever, it's that far from being the pure politician who can't be bought, he is owned by some of the nastiest most anti-Western regimes in the world, his morals are more bankrupt than his economic policy.


    I however cannot for one moment support Owen Smith either because whilst I agree he is a step up from Corbyn, he still tips his hat to this damaging notion that the Blairite era of the Labour party was somehow a disgrace to be ashamed of in spite of all the real achievements it brought about in terms of sustainable social justice. I voted for Ed Miliband over Cameron, but the day he lost to his brother, I knew the Labour party was heading for some really bad years.
    My thoughts exactly. Repped*
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Shows he is a lot more nuanced than given credit for.
    He actually is. For one, he's come to at least one Conservative conference and had a bit of banter with the young Tories. He's pretty left-wing but he's not mad with it, or inclined to routinely vilify his opponents.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    He actually is. For one, he's come to at least one Conservative conference and had a bit of banter with the young Tories. He's pretty left-wing but he's not mad with it, or inclined to routinely vilify his opponents.
    On his YouTube channel he interviews people from all across the political spectrum including tories and ukip and he always respects them, let's them speak and doesn't interrupt them or try to make them feel bad.

    People may fundamentally disagree with what he stands for, but he's a thoroughly decent individual.

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    (Original post by Atlas Thugged)
    I agree with every criticism you have made of Corbyn, for me the foremost problem is not that he's a socialist or whatever, it's that far from being the pure politician who can't be bought, he is owned by some of the nastiest most anti-Western regimes in the world, his morals are more bankrupt than his economic policy.


    I however cannot for one moment support Owen Smith either because whilst I agree he is a step up from Corbyn, he still tips his hat to this damaging notion that the Blairite era of the Labour party was somehow a disgrace to be ashamed of in spite of all the real achievements it brought about in terms of sustainable social justice. I voted for Ed Miliband over Cameron, but the day he lost to his brother, I knew the Labour party was heading for some really bad years.
    Smith is appealing to a left wing membership though and blairism is toxic to them. He has to try and tack to the left to win their votes.

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    (Original post by Atlas Thugged)
    I agree with every criticism you have made of Corbyn, for me the foremost problem is not that he's a socialist or whatever, it's that far from being the pure politician who can't be bought, he is owned by some of the nastiest most anti-Western regimes in the world, his morals are more bankrupt than his economic policy.

    I however cannot for one moment support Owen Smith either because whilst I agree he is a step up from Corbyn, he still tips his hat to this damaging notion that the Blairite era of the Labour party was somehow a disgrace to be ashamed of in spite of all the real achievements it brought about in terms of sustainable social justice. I voted for Ed Miliband over Cameron, but the day he lost to his brother, I knew the Labour party was heading for some really bad years.
    I too would prefer someone of a more centrist disposition, but Owen Smith is just a transitional leader so we can get rid of the personality cult and purge the Momental hysterics from the party apparatus.

    Then, at the appropriate moment, someone like Dan Jarvis or Sir Keir Starmer can challenge for the leadership
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    (Original post by Aliccam)
    The debate was scheduled for Monday when he was already due to speak in Liverpool. He is in debate with Owen Smith tomorrow in Cardiff. If you look on the Labour party Facebook page they are having five debates ahead of the leadership election.
    Actually the Channel 4 debate had been mooted since early July. Of course Corbyn would rather go bask in the adulation of a thousand Momentum members who are going to vote for him no matter what rather than front up to a television studio where he could be judged by an audience of millions. This is classic Corbyn; preaching to the converted rather than reaching out to people who disagree with him.

    As for the five debates, all of them will only be streamed through the Labour Party website, thus ensuring a much smaller audience. But that is what Corbyn is counting on; he knows he'll get trounced by Smith and wants to ensure as few people as possible see it.

    I wouldn't be surprised if Corbyn's office refuses to allow broadcast media to use any of the footage either.
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    (Original post by Aliccam)
    I don't know why you bother with this great long rant, why not just call him a racist, sexist, anti-semite, Marxist, Trot, who wants to bring down the world with all his terrorist friends
    If you find longer comments a strain on your delicate brain, then perhaps you should absent yourself from this debate. It might be beyond your intellectual capacities.

    As for the length, it's called being comprehensive; pointing out why he's not the only democratic socialist in the party, pointing out why he's unelectable, pointing out his corrupt acts and his friendship with homophobic murderers. You seem to be okay with the murder of gay people; I'm not.

    Presumably they have known all these things from day one, so why did they wait 9 months to try to get rid of him?
    You clearly don't understand Labour politics. It was only a Blairite core of 40 or so MPs (out of 230) he refused to work with him from the start. Most MPs did try to make it work. It was after seeing the utter incompetence of the last 9 months, the complete policy vacuum, the bunker mentality, the lack of leadership, that another 130 MPs decided something had to be done.

    This even includes close Corbyn allies like Lisa Nandy, though no doubt you will claim she's a Blairite now like the good little brainwashed Corbynista you are
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Smith is appealing to a left wing membership though and blairism is toxic to them. He has to try and tack to the left to win their votes.
    Smith has always been on the soft left of the party. You shouldn't be so gullible in believing Momental propaganda claiming he's some kind of Blairite chameleon.
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    Owen Jones just published an incredible post on Medium explaining why Corbyn is unelectable and essentially calling for him to step down.

    It's a very interesting read, quite heartfelt and very revealing. It's a devastating critique of the insularity and arrogance of this in the CorbynBunker

    https://medium.com/@OwenJones84/ques...ed3#.txqbm71w3
    :backstab:
 
 
 
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