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    They never should have been banned in the first place.
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    (Original post by Edminzodo)
    Really happy. I got into grammar schools and think the system is fantastic, a real-life changing opportunity.

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    Now think about how it is for people who don't get in.
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    (Original post by Abstract_Prism)
    Now think about how it is for people who don't get in.
    The thing is compared to other countries our school standards are slipping and why should intelligent students be held back by less able students. For instance if their were more grammar schools my local one wouldn't be quite so harsh on requirements to get in.
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    (Original post by niteninja1)
    The thing is compared to other countries our school standards are slipping and why should intelligent students be held back by less able students. For instance if their were more grammar schools my local one wouldn't be quite so harsh on requirements to get in.
    It's quite the opposite, in fact. If there are more grammar schools, less able students - or at least the ones who couldn't pay for or get into a grammar school - will be held back by those who can get in, in the job markets and in social standing.

    Grammar school will not lower their requirements if there is more demand. That doesn't make sense. You are speculating.
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    Fair enough. Pretty sure if the ban is lifted its not like people will jump to establish hundreds of such schools & it would enable more students to attend such schools if a few more opened.

    The only issue I see with them is the price tag.

    A year at a grammar school in tuition fees + any other fees is on average more than a year at uni. That's pretty ridiculous if you ask me. Not every single bright and very clever student comes from a family that can possibly afford that. So something should be done about that. Whether the fees are in place or not, the schools are still competitive due to the tests. It's the money that sometimes locks out the ones who cannot afford it.
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    (Original post by Abstract_Prism)
    Fill me in guys, how can there have been a ban on grammar schools when grammar school obviously still exist?
    It only exists in the Berkshire and Buckinghamshire area only! There are about 5 grammar schools in my area.
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    (Original post by katherine9609)
    Fair enough. Pretty sure if the ban is lifted its not like people will jump to establish hundreds of such schools & it would enable more students to attend such schools if a few more opened.

    The only issue I see with them is the price tag.

    A year at a grammar school in tuition fees + any other fees is on average more than a year at uni. That's pretty ridiculous if you ask me. Not every single bright and very clever student comes from a family that can possibly afford that. So something should be done about that. Whether the fees are in place or not, the schools are still competitive due to the tests. It's the money that sometimes locks out the ones who cannot afford it.
    The point of Grammar Schools is that they were meant to be free education for the cleverest pupils, many only became private schools when Harold Wilson tried to close them all down.


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    Good. Grammar schools are fab
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    (Original post by katherine9609)
    Fair enough. Pretty sure if the ban is lifted its not like people will jump to establish hundreds of such schools & it would enable more students to attend such schools if a few more opened.

    The only issue I see with them is the price tag.

    A year at a grammar school in tuition fees + any other fees is on average more than a year at uni. That's pretty ridiculous if you ask me. Not every single bright and very clever student comes from a family that can possibly afford that. So something should be done about that. Whether the fees are in place or not, the schools are still competitive due to the tests. It's the money that sometimes locks out the ones who cannot afford it.
    You are thinking of independent grammar schools.

    State owned grammar school such as TOrbay girls grammar school or Torbay boys grammar school are free.
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    (Original post by Workangel_24)
    It only exists in the Berkshire and Buckinghamshire area only! There are about 5 grammar schools in my area.
    The ban was preventing new schools from opening
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    (Original post by niteninja1)
    Theresa May is set to remove the ban on grammar schools.

    http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews...xT1?li=BBoPRmx

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    I'm glad to see May's government focusing on higher standards in education; however by bringing grammar schools this will lead to social mobility and more problems over school places as students will have to sit entrance exams. Only the very best will get selected, now what happens to those who haven't been selected. How are we going to provide places for those who are considered less academically able?
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    (Original post by Abstract_Prism)
    Now think about how it is for people who don't get in.
    But by that logic universities shouldn't be allowed to be selective. 'Think about all those people who get rejected by Oxbridge and how they feel, it just isn't fair'.
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    (Original post by katherine9609)
    The only issue I see with them is the price tag.

    (Original post by 1010marina)
    Heya. The grammar "near" me is an independent one with a £10.5k/year price tag. It's a joke - and all I can see is eventually a similar situation.
    Then there's no reason to be opposed to this. You don't have a problem with grammar schools specifically. Your issue is with private schools. And tbh i don't mind private schools either. If i was rich I'd probably send my kids there too. But whatever, that's a seperate issue.
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    (Original post by 1010marina)
    Heya. The grammar "near" me is an independent one with a £10.5k/year price tag. It's a joke - and all I can see is eventually a similar situation.

    I got the top results in my state primary, and later the top female results in my state high school. I had a boring miserable time, same as you, surrounded by people of mixed abilities and with teachers that didn't push me. So I really understand where you're coming from, but seeing all these changes surrounding academies etc, it just makes me think we'll end up with a load more fee charging schools that grossly limit access. If they can absolutely guarantee that any new school will remain 100% free forever then sure I'm behind it. Otherwise it'll just exacerbate the problem
    If it's fee paying its not a grammar school.


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    Now watch the pushy middle/upper middle parents flock near to the new grammar schools when they open so their little darlings can go to a school without chavs for free...

    Hardly social mobility
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    Education is just too complex to be allocated into binary constructs such as, 'comprehensives are failing our children'. Indeed, it is true, for example, that 62% (and 65% in Maths) of pupils at non-selective secondary schools who got Level 5 in their English Sats did not get an A* or A grade in this subject at GCSE in 2012. These are statistics issued by Ofsted and somebody may use them as an argument for the revitalisation of grammar schools - i.e. a means by which to reduce the influence of 'deadbeats' on those able students who get left behind come GCSE time.

    But the ultimate problem lies in the management and abuse of schools by government. Teachers have it rough in state schools and the simplistic targets they are required to meet - for example a certain % of A-C grades at GCSE - are the ultimate problem in all of this. In this context, it's easy to see why teachers simply must prioritise the education of the less able - a much more difficult task than motivating someone who already has a certain level of intelligence. They have to prioritise the C boundary much more than those who are most able.
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    I go to a grammar school (non fee-paying), its co-educational and its great to be in an environment with others of my academic ability.
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    Why should an A grade student be forced into a class of C grade students.

    For instance my sister who gets FSM goes to our local grammar and all of the people their are highly intelligent and because of this they all have similar goals and aspirations.

    However I am an A-b grade student C at English so I didn't get in (still going Uni btw) and my school life was hell.

    For instance my IT teacher got us all marked down two grades as she tried to lie so the less able students could pass.

    Also bullying was a major problem with the more intelligent students being bullied by the less able students.

    For instance when sat in the library at break or lunch time to revise the less able students chose to spend their time running in and out of the library
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    (Original post by Abstract_Prism)
    Fill me in guys, how can there have been a ban on grammar schools when grammar school obviously still exist?
    They now only exist in name. The people in them are not the most intelligent or a select few, it's anyone who applies and there is space for. E.g. under old grammar schools you had an exam to decide whether you went to a grammar school with other high achievers (e.g. pupils predicted mainly A* to B grades) or lower performing pupils (predicted mostly lower than B grades.) This was useful to help the higher achieving students achieve their maximum potential whilst non-grammar schools were for less able students and were better at helping them achieve these grades. It's a bit like maths sets in school so you have groups of people with similar abilities learning together so no-one feels left out because they don't understand the topic or already know it. The ban also prevented new grammar schools from being opened.
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    (Original post by BobSausage)
    They now only exist in name. The people in them are not the most intelligent or a select few, it's anyone who applies and there is space for. E.g. under old grammar schools you had an exam to decide whether you went to a grammar school with other high achievers (e.g. pupils predicted mainly A* to B grades) or lower performing pupils (predicted mostly lower than B grades.) This was useful to help the higher achieving students achieve their maximum potential whilst non-grammar schools were for less able students and were better at helping them achieve these grades. It's a bit like maths sets in school so you have groups of people with similar abilities learning together so no-one feels left out because they don't understand the topic or already know it. The ban also prevented new grammar schools from being opened.
    That's not true, I know quite a few people who went to grammar schools and had to take an entrance exam


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    (Original post by BobSausage)
    They now only exist in name. The people in them are not the most intelligent or a select few, it's anyone who applies and there is space for. E.g. under old grammar schools you had an exam to decide whether you went to a grammar school with other high achievers (e.g. pupils predicted mainly A* to B grades) or lower performing pupils (predicted mostly lower than B grades.) This was useful to help the higher achieving students achieve their maximum potential whilst non-grammar schools were for less able students and were better at helping them achieve these grades. It's a bit like maths sets in school so you have groups of people with similar abilities learning together so no-one feels left out because they don't understand the topic or already know it. The ban also prevented new grammar schools from being opened.
    a lot of them still have entrance exams such as the 11+ lol which you have to pass to get in.
    the only flaw with this really is that super high powered richer parents often tutor their sprogs to death and so people end up there that shouldn't really be there but idk how you could avoid this really.
 
 
 
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