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V1025 – Hallucinogens Research Bill 2016 watch

  • View Poll Results: Should this bill be passed into law?
    As many are of the opinion, Aye
    54.35%
    On the contrary, No
    30.43%
    Abstain
    15.22%

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    (Original post by thehistorybore)
    It will still pass. I would like to stress again that this bill was not written by a Tory.
    Makes the indefensible even worse.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    Makes the indefensible even worse.
    I'm sorry but these are some horribly potent drugs that can cause all sorts of damage, both mentally and physically. The inspiration for writing this Act was after a chap I knew threw himself down the stairs and died after taking a fairly respectable dose of LSD. These sort of drugs are not to be messed around with. They need to be researched thoroughly before they're released to the general public to consume as they will, and we need a better system of control when we do.

    This Act allows for as much research as is needed, without allowing the general population freedom to take enormous doses and do damage to themselves. You may say that they will be able to get them off the black market anyway, however, this Act makes it harder to do so, and we as a Government state our position as opposed to the freedom to misuse powerful drugs.

    When you've seen people die from these sort of things, it's very difficult to take a liberal attitude.
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    (Original post by thehistorybore)
    I'm sorry but these are some horribly potent drugs that can cause all sorts of damage, both mentally and physically. The inspiration for writing this Act was after a chap I knew threw himself down the stairs and died after taking a fairly respectable dose of LSD. These sort of drugs are not to be messed around with. They need to be researched thoroughly before they're released to the general public to consume as they will, and we need a better system of control when we do.

    This Act allows for as much research as is needed, without allowing the general population freedom to take enormous doses and do damage to themselves. You may say that they will be able to get them off the black market anyway, however, this Act makes it harder to do so, and we as a Government state our position as opposed to the freedom to misuse powerful drugs.

    When you've seen people die from these sort of things, it's very difficult to take a liberal attitude.
    When the chap you knew died LSD was illegal. So that means no government intervention in the market and no reasonable education for the public on dosage or potential side effects. This Act makes the black market the only market so it's now a million times easier. Your 'Act' as you so gloatingly italicise will make people less free *and* less safe under the guise of allowing for research that there's already legal provision for. A masterful achievement.

    I'm lucky that the people I know who've been involved in this crap survived. But by God I'd take a government regulated market over a *****y, incredibly easy to access black market any day. So forgive me for not giving a damn about a Liberal's inability to 'take a liberal attitude'. I'll see this undone.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    When the chap you knew died LSD was illegal. So that means no government intervention in the market and no reasonable education for the public on dosage or potential side effects. This Act makes the black market the only market so it's now a million times easier. Your 'Act' as you so gloatingly italicise will make people less free *and* less safe under the guise of allowing for research that there's already legal provision for. A masterful achievement.

    I'm lucky that the people I know who've been involved in this crap survived. But by God I'd take a government regulated market over a *****y, incredibly easy to access black market any day. So forgive me for not giving a damn about a Liberal's inability to 'take a liberal attitude'. I'll see this undone.
    You seem to be suggesting that the only way to educate people about something is to make it legal, should we therefore legalise murder because people clearly don't know the consequence is death and a long prison sentence :rolleyes:

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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    You seem to be suggesting that the only way to educate people about something is to make it legal, should we therefore legalise murder because people clearly don't know the consequence is death and a long prison sentence :rolleyes:

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    That reductio ad absurdum isn't even clever, which you know, so you put 'you seem to be suggesting' and a cutesy emoji so you don't have to look like your weak argument is one you're seriously making.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    That reductio ad absurdum isn't even clever, which you know, so you put 'you seem to be suggesting' and a cutesy emoji so you don't have to look like your weak argument is one you're seriously making.
    Legalisation trivially isn't needed to teach consequences. Do you think meth and coke are bad? I'm going to guess you will say yes and have done neither. Do you know the side effects of both? Again, I wager the answer is yes without them being legal.

    Consequently your argument isn't holding water. Most have done neither and neither is legal yet most know what both do, 'good' and bad.

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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Legalisation trivially isn't needed to teach consequences. Do you think meth and coke are bad? I'm going to guess you will say yes and have done neither. Do you know the side effects of both? Again, I wager the answer is yes without them being legal.

    Consequently your argument isn't holding water. Most have done neither and neither is legal yet most know what both do, 'good' and bad.

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    This bill isn't about meth and coke. It's about less well understood drugs so your 'argument isn't holding water'. And for the record I have no idea what the healthy dosage for methamphetamine is, nor am I well versed in it's short and long term effects. But I imagine I would be a heck of a lot more aware if it was legal. The fact of the matter is your legislation doesn't protect people except in your mind.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    This bill isn't about meth and coke. It's about less well understood drugs so your 'argument isn't holding water'. And for the record I have no idea what the healthy dosage for methamphetamine is, nor am I well versed in it's short and long term effects. But I imagine I would be a heck of a lot more aware if it was legal. The fact of the matter is your legislation doesn't protect people except in your mind.
    Again, you seem to be suggesting that the only way to educate people is legalisation, which is absurd, how do you educate people? You educate them.

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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Again, you seem to be suggesting that the only way to educate people is legalisation, which is absurd, how do you educate people? You educate them.

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    I 'suggested' a lot of things but not that it was the 'only way' so you have to qualify your counter with 'you seem to be suggesting'. Legalisation forces the government to act and to educate - something that should happen anyway. There is nothing stopping you from legislating to educate people though I don't expect this government to pour resources into telling people the correct dosages for illegal drugs. Legalisation also keeps people from the black market, therefore protecting them (as well as their individual liberty).
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    Ayes to the right: 25
    Noes to the left: 14
    Abstentions: 7

    The Ayes have it! The Ayes have it! Unlock!

    Turnout: 92%
 
 
 
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