Is Scottish independence a 'good or bad' thing? Watch

Poll: Should Scotland be an independent country?
YES (299)
32.12%
NO (632)
67.88%
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Aj12
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#5141
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#5141
(Original post by Choo.choo)
Fiona Hyslop told you the answer: because there are 28 countries who are members of NATO, and only 3 of those 28 have nuclear weapons. That leaves 25 that do not have nuclear weapons. Not difficult to understand.
So you dont see an issue with being against nuclear weapons then joining an alliance bases on nuclear deterrence? It makes the snp look like they want defence but not to lay for it.


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#5142
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#5142
(Original post by Choo.choo)
Fiona Hyslop told you the answer: because there are 28 countries who are members of NATO, and only 3 of those 28 have nuclear weapons. That leaves 25 that do not have nuclear weapons. Not difficult to understand.
In fact nuclear weapons are on the territory of rather more members than you mention. Belgium, Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, and Turkey all have them, and both Canada and Greece have had them.

All members of NATO have to sign up to the first strike doctrine. What is SNP policy on that?

Scotland won't get into NATO unless it reaches agreement with Britain, anyway.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...clear-strategy
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#5143
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#5143
(Original post by Choo.choo)
Lowering corporation tax will encourage inward investment. Obviously, companies are going to go where costs are cheaper. The UK Government has one of the most lax tax systems in the developed world. Paying some tax is better than paying none at all, and when large companies do not contribute to the state, that is when you get all the problems we are experiencing now, as part of the "union".
You do realise that an obvious British response might be to lower its own corporation tax rate, don't you?

How will the Scots get around the problem of companies not paying their tax, when all the major countries are having the same problem? Is there something in the Scottish water?
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FredOrJohn
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#5144
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#5144
(Original post by Good bloke)
You do realise that an obvious British response might be to lower its own corporation tax rate, don't you?

How will the Scots get around the problem of companies not paying their tax, when all the major countries are having the same problem? Is there something in the Scottish water?
About 50% of government income comes from loans. I think lending institutions have already stated SNP scotland would need to pay more... Thus meaning higher income tax to pay for the extra interest charges, or lower state benefits (Which is no bad thing)
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Gordon1985
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#5145
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#5145
(Original post by FredOrJohn)
Normally the people in the political debate also have the vote. It would seem a tad silly to pick someone who has no say - but if you say he should have a say, then logically you are also saying, everyone in the uk should have a say. Eg the referendum should be UK wide.

I don't see why snp voters can't see that - give us all a say or just keep the say to people based in scotland....
The problem with that is that Cameron is clearly taking part in 'the debate' but just won't "debate" live on TV.

Both sides should just stop being so hypocritical about this.
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Gordon1985
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#5146
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#5146
(Original post by MatureStudent36)

it would be like Obama, Hollande or Merkel debating in a general election.
Not really. Cameron is Prime Minister of the UK, which includes Scotland.

If Cameron though it would be to BT's advantage or that he needed to, he would do it.
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Choo.choo
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#5147
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#5147
(Original post by Midlander)
How do you lower taxes and increase spending without losing even more money?


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I said the UK Government has one of the laxest tax systems in the developed world. The UK is basically a device for transferring wealth from the many to the few. In other words, Britain operates for the rich folk. As long as rick folk are all right, it doesnot matter about anyone else. That is how the UK operates.
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Choo.choo
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#5148
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#5148
(Original post by Good bloke)
You do realise that an obvious British response might be to lower its own corporation tax rate, don't you?

How will the Scots get around the problem of companies not paying their tax, when all the major countries are having the same problem? Is there something in the Scottish water?
But big companies don't pay any tax at all, that is the point. No wonder the UK is in such a mess. How is it right that ordinary citizens, such as me and yourself, would get jailed if they didn't pay tax, but it is okay for big companies like Amazon and Starbucks, who have trading in the UK for 20 years, to only have paid about £10million in corporation tax, can get away with that?
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#5149
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#5149
(Original post by Choo.choo)
But big companies don't pay any tax at all, that is the point. No wonder the UK is in such a mess. How is it right that ordinary citizens, such as me and yourself, would get jailed if they didn't pay tax, but it is okay for big companies like Amazon and Starbucks, who have trading in the UK for 20 years, to only have paid about £10million in corporation tax, can get away with that?
You have completely ignored the important point, and my question. The point is that all the major countries are having the same problem (and discussing how to combat it); the question was, how will Scotland deal with it? Feel free to provide an answer.
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Quady
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#5150
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#5150
(Original post by FredOrJohn)
About 50% of government income comes from loans. I think lending institutions have already stated SNP scotland would need to pay more... Thus meaning higher income tax to pay for the extra interest charges, or lower state benefits (Which is no bad thing)
By 50% do you mean 16%? Massive exageration doesn't help your arguement.

Scotland would need to pay 0.2-0.3% more, big deal.

Scotland would have a lower deficit which would more than counteract that.

The issue is the transition cost.
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#5151
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#5151
(Original post by Choo.choo)
I said the UK Government has one of the laxest tax systems in the developed world. The UK is basically a device for transferring wealth from the many to the few. In other words, Britain operates for the rich folk. As long as rick folk are all right, it doesnot matter about anyone else. That is how the UK operates.
I don't see how a tax system transfers wealth to any individual. Surely it transfers money from the people to the government, from where it is spent by the government to further national interest (which includes spending on welfare payments to poor people)? Perhaps you can explain how any individual can receive tax payments, rather than pay them?
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Quady
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#5152
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#5152
(Original post by Good bloke)
You have completely ignored the important point, and my question. The point is that all the major countries are having the same problem (and discussing how to combat it); the question was, how will Scotland deal with it? Feel free to provide an answer.
Haven't the SNP answered that one, they want to do an Ireland and be a tax haven.
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#5153
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#5153
(Original post by Quady)
Haven't the SNP answered that one, they want to do an Ireland and be a tax haven.
Ah! They want to be part of the problem, not part of the solution.
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Quady
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#5154
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#5154
(Original post by Good bloke)
Ah! They want to be part of the problem, not part of the solution.
Yup

Well other people's problem...
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Choo.choo
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#5155
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#5155
(Original post by Good bloke)
You have completely ignored the important point, and my question. The point is that all the major countries are having the same problem (and discussing how to combat it); the question was, how will Scotland deal with it? Feel free to provide an answer.
Close all tax loopholes for a start. Basically, the UK Government sent in a company, for example KPMG, to fill the tax system with many, many loopholes, so that rich folk can avoid paying tax. Why is it that smaller, similar-sized countries to Scotland are not in debt, whereas the bigger countries are? This is an argument consistently put forward by the Better Together campaign, that we should be part of something bigger, which I think is just ludicrous. Why shouldn't countries have self-determination?
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Quady
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#5156
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#5156
(Original post by Choo.choo)
Close all tax loopholes for a start. Basically, the UK Government sent in a company, for example KPMG, to fill the tax system with many, many loopholes, so that rich folk can avoid paying tax. Why is it that smaller, similar-sized countries to Scotland are not in debt, whereas the bigger countries are? This is an argument consistently put forward by the Better Together campaign, that we should be part of something bigger, which I think is just ludicrous? Why shouldn't countries have self-determination?
WTF???? No, no they didn't....

Which smaller countries?
Ireland?
Belgium?
Greece?
Portugal?

Norway for sure, but it has vastly more oil than Scotland and if you go by their model you need to strip out the contribution from oil as they don't spend it on public services.

Better together doesn't say they should. Look at the title, they are just advocating Scotland would be better as part of the UK, not that self determination is invalid, just its not optimal.
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#5157
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#5157
(Original post by Choo.choo)
the UK Government sent in a company, for example KPMG, to fill the tax system with many, many loopholes, so that rich folk can avoid paying tax.
Accountancy firms do not create the tax system.


Why is it that smaller, similar-sized countries to Scotland are not in debt, whereas the bigger countries are?
There is not a single EU country, of any size, that does not have government debt. Where do you get the idea that they don't have debt?
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Choo.choo
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#5158
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#5158
(Original post by Quady)
WTF???? No, no they didn't....

Which smaller countries?
Ireland?
Belgium?
Greece?
Portugal?

Norway for sure, but it has vastly more oil than Scotland and if you go by their model you need to strip out the contribution from oil as they don't spend it on public services.

Better together doesn't say they should. Look at the title, they are just advocating Scotland would be better as part of the UK, not that self determination is invalid, just its not optimal.
Optimal for whom? You?
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Quady
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#5159
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#5159
(Original post by Good bloke)
There is not a single EU country, of any size, that does not have government debt. Where do you get the idea that they don't have debt?
Apart from some who have defaulted recently, I don't think there are any countries without debt....
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#5160
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#5160
(Original post by Quady)
Apart from some who have defaulted recently, I don't think there are any countries without debt....
Well, of course. But those who have defaulted are in a worse position than those with debts, anyway, as they'll be paying a significant premium for years to come..
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