Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by zippyRN)
    ah the libertarian dream as viewed by the middle class children who predominate on TSR

    rather different prospect if you have a chronic condition, are unfortunate enough to sustain a serious or life changing injury

    also rather different when the bank of mum and dad won;t be able to bail you out ...
    If collectivism was such a great model the USSR would have prospered and New Labour -Britain's biggest left-wing party- wouldn't have dropped clause 4 back in the 1990's.

    Time to wake up and smell the coffee, Marx was wrong and the 20th Century is littered with the humanitarian fallout of his childish ideology. Lets not suffer this injustice any longer - privatise the NHS!
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chefdave)
    We could say this about anything though.

    Why don't we socialise food?

    Food is incredibly important, in fact much more so than healthcare because we'd quickly become ill and die without it. So why don't we subsidise or collectivise food production to make sure the poor and vulnerable can get their hands on the meals they need?

    Because we accept that both in theory and in practice the private sector is more efficient at distributing resources sensibly and in a cost-efficient manner.

    This principle would work exactly the same with healthcare, but we havn't applied it because of an over emotional post-WW2 attachment to 'R NHS'.

    The trap you're falling into is a belief that if the state doesn't do something nobody else will, but the highstreet and the internet is a living, breathing example of what can be achieved if only the state would get out of the way.

    This isn't any different when it comes to nurses and doctors and medicine.
    It's interesting you mention the Internet, which would have been impossible without public R&D funding. And the high street? Have shops not been closing where you live?

    You're ok with how we get our
    Cheap clothes? Over a billion people on this planet live on under $1.21 a day. Many work in sweatshops for the Arcadia group, or Nike making shareholders millions, which neither you, nor I, nor anyone less fortunate than us see.

    So spare me the private sector validity diatribe.

    You're correct. Food is provided through private markets.

    The NHS is a curative model that can do little to prevent diseases, a lot of which are caused by poor diets.

    Because private industry profits from drug treatments, and private industry profits from foods with preservatives and additives, people get sick/remain sick and cost the NHS millions.

    You're thinking 'it's people's choices what to eat, they should eat healthier'.

    Completely ignoring epiphenomena and cultural norms such as smoking and drinking.

    Well if it's that easy why don't they?

    Because we live in an unequal society where children are born into ignorance. Where health inequalities persist (Black Report, Acheson Report, Marmot Report) and the resources and wealth produced by the nation are poorly distributed.

    You can mouth all you want about leftist conspiracy theories and wishy washy liberal doctrine, as long as someone profits from ill health, it will continue.

    At least with public healthcare we keep control away from the very speculators who would profit from it.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jordan-James)
    Ahahaha this made me laugh oh so hard, You believe UKIP has time to allocate people to spread their views on a student forum? Do you think that we're being paid to spread their views?

    Wow.
    Actually, yes, I can easily imagine they would take an interest in the forum. There have also been lots of discussions on Mumsnet (my Mum is a member!) on the same phenomenon there. There does appear to be a coordinated campaign - not a bad idea actually, given that Obama won his elections via the web.
    Offline

    8
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    It must get confusing when you have lots of accounts to look after.
    Ill have you know im certainly not dj1105

    If you love conspiracy theories try looking into JFK assassination, or Zionism or 9/11 etc etc, i think theyre more interesting than something to do with a section of a forum lol/
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    The problem I have with the left is that they never put forward any solutions to the problems we face today, in fact they are the reason we have so many problems.
    Back in the sixties they all shouted about how we should love our neighbors so they flooded this country with immigrants, hoping that in the process they would destroy the true nationalists and create a country of serfs, when all they did was make us stronger.

    'Let us have a dagger between our teeth, a bomb in our hands, and an infinite scorn in our hearts'.
    Offline

    8
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Actually, yes, I can easily imagine they would take an interest in the forum. There have also been lots of discussions on Mumsnet (my Mum is a member!) on the same phenomenon there. There does appear to be a coordinated campaign - not a bad idea actually, given that Obama won his elections via the web.
    Ahaha, this is hilarious. Im 17 years old probably not old enough to join the bloody party!

    Or am i?

    Edit: I guess Socialism runs in your family then Will let you off for that one haha
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Kibalchich)
    This would place Keynes and one nation Toryism on the left and Kropotkin, Durutti and the CNT on the right. Patently absurd.
    Yeah, I'd be better running it as a separate scale of economic authoritarianism to libertarianism.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    You don't think the global financial crisis might have had something to do with it? Or the need to lend £50bn of taxpayer's cash to the banks?
    as I said naive socialist is naive

    If 'prudence' Brown had lived up to his nickname, and not 'abolished boom and bust' or over inflated the UK property market then the UK's exposure would have been considerably smaller and the consequent bubble burst may have been smaller or at a somewhat slower rate of deflation ...
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by robbmann)
    The problem I have with the left is that they never put forward any solutions to the problems we face today, in fact they are the reason we have so many problems.
    Back in the sixties they all shouted about how we should love our neighbors so they flooded this country with immigrants, hoping that in the process they would destroy the true nationalists and create a country of serfs, when all they did was make us stronger.

    'Let us have a dagger between our teeth, a bomb in our hands, and an infinite scorn in our hearts'.
    It was Enoch Powell, as Minister of Health in the early 1960s Conservative government who first pushed hard for mass inward migration from the Commonwealth to staff the NHS. A very successful policy, as it turned out, which was later copied for transport and other industrial sectors with labour shortages. Just putting the facts straight! It wasn't the left who invented mass immigration. They accurately spotted that the new immigrants would vote for them if they were good to them, which they were and did. That's a different thing to inventing the policy.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jordan-James)
    Ill have you know im certainly not dj1105

    Double post again, sorry everyone.....
    Offline

    8
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Actually, yes, I can easily imagine they would take an interest in the forum. There have also been lots of discussions on Mumsnet (my Mum is a member!) on the same phenomenon there. There does appear to be a coordinated campaign - not a bad idea actually, given that Obama won his elections via the web.
    What's your dexterity, im sure there's at least SOMETHING right about you!
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Right now we have massive government attacks on the poor and the Tories are using the police as a tool to brutally suppress protest.
    ... What utter bull.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by zippyRN)
    as I said naive socialist is naive

    If 'prudence' Brown had lived up to his nickname, and not 'abolished boom and bust' or over inflated the UK property market then the UK's exposure would have been considerably smaller and the consequent bubble burst may have been smaller or at a somewhat slower rate of deflation ...
    You think the UK housing market caused the global financial crash?

    UK government borrowing was not high by historical standards before the crash, although the level of structural deficit was concerning. However, to give them credit, New Labour were trying to modernise Britain's shockingly poor infrastructure and public facilities, including hospitals and schools. The real shame was that they did this via the private sector which was hugely more expensive than it needed to be, just to keep it off the government lending books. (A policy now being restarted by Osborne, despite bitter criticism of it by him in opposition)

    The property market is primarily inflated because of huge supply shortages, caused by the Thatcher and post-Thatcher drastic cut in new builds of social housing. Property price inflation appears to be a favourite of all Tory governments as it is a vote winner in the middle class - they are now trying to restart another house price boom.
    Offline

    8
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by dj1015)
    Double post again, sorry everyone.....
    Oh see! I even spelt his bloomin name wrong!
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by The Mad Dog)
    That isn't how fascism works. If you think any extremist ideology is fascist, you're silly.

    fascism; Noun
    An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.
    (in general use) Extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice.

    How exactly can the complete opposite of fascism, in extreme-individualist Libertarianism, be fascist?



    :fyi: This is an internet forum where anyone can intervene when they feel like they've got something worth saying or even if they don't.
    The complete opposite.

    On a left/right wing scale.

    Which is almost impossible to place fascism on.

    A simple google search of the word will provide you with dozens of scholarly articles debating the conventional attribution of fascism to right wing ideology.

    And don't forget that YOU quoted ME with obvious ignorance of the context in which I was speaking.

    I have a dictionary too by the way.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by dj1015)
    Double post again, sorry everyone.....
    Lol, are the one of you getting confused about which two of you the one is pretending to be?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jordan-James)

    Edit: I guess Socialism runs in your family then Will let you off for that one haha
    Have you looked at Mumsnet? It's anything but socialist!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    It was Enoch Powell, as Minister of Health in the early 1960s Conservative government who first pushed hard for mass inward migration from the Commonwealth to staff the NHS. A very successful policy, as it turned out, which was later copied for transport and other industrial sectors with labour shortages. Just putting the facts straight! It wasn't the left who invented mass immigration. They accurately spotted that the new immigrants would vote for them if they were good to them, which they were and did. That's a different thing to inventing the policy.
    That may be true, but Powell quickly realized the error, these people are not British, will never be and can never be.
    Why is it right that these people get jobs will hard working British people have to linger on the bread line. It is time for repatriation, and to allow true British nationalists to rise up and fill the vacancies that will be left.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Lol, are the one of you getting confused about which two of you the one is pretending to be?
    Just two?
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jordan-James)
    Oh see! I even spelt his bloomin name wrong!
    I do spell my own name wrong when talking to my self on regular occasions.
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Have you ever participated in a Secret Santa?
    Useful resources

    Groups associated with this forum:

    View associated groups
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.