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    (Original post by PetrosAC)
    This wouldn't surprise me

    If we vote in, there'll be some form of transfer of power which will trigger another election

    If we vote out, our economy goes downhill (at least temporarily). If it keeps on heading downhill, the government will have to explore all options.
    You greatly overestimate how much our economy would be effected by voting out. We have a massive trade deficit with europe, if they dont let us back into the single market then the eurozone will plummet even further, #we'renotnorway.

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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    You greatly overestimate how much our economy would be effected by voting out. We have a massive trade deficit with europe, if they dont let us back into the single market then the eurozone will plummet even further, #we'renotnorway.

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    Yet it's extremely obvious that we have far greater reliance on the EU than the EU has on us due to relative % of exports. The EU has a massive negotiating advantage, not just with us, but also with any third party. Our trade deals with the EU, and with literally every other country, will be worse outside the EU.
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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    You greatly overestimate how much our economy would be effected by voting out. We have a massive trade deficit with europe, if they dont let us back into the single market then the eurozone will plummet even further, #we'renotnorway.

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    IIRC something like 48% of our exports are with the EU but only 6% of theirs are with the UK. So the EU if it decided to punish us could crippled our entire economy whilst only taking a minor hit in return.
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    Yet it's extremely obvious that we have far greater reliance on the EU than the EU has on us due to relative % of exports. The EU has a massive negotiating advantage, not just with us, but also with any third party. Our trade deals with the EU, and with literally every other country, will be worse outside the EU.
    No doubt, but any new trade deals wouldnt be so devastating that our economy would collapse as remain suggests, what would any party get out of negotiating a trade deal so bad that the other party's economy is destroyed by it? (thus limiting the trade that can happen, creating a lose-lose situation)

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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    No doubt, but any new trade deals wouldnt be so devastating that our economy would collapse as remain suggests, what would any party get out of negotiating a trade deal so bad that the other party's economy is destroyed by it? (thus limiting the trade that can happen, creating a lose-lose situation)

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    Behold the Brexit argument: "We'll be screwed, but not totally screwed!" Yay!
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    Behold the Brexit argument: "We'll be screwed, but not totally screwed!" Yay!
    We would be screwed. It depends on what your priorities are, putting everyone in the country on a ZHC would be great for the economy, but should we do that too?

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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    We would be screwed. It depends on what your priorities are, putting everyone in the country on a ZHC would be great for the economy, but should we do that too?
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    No it wouldn't be. Strong modern economies are founded on consumers with reliable incomes and high productivity.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    Mostly your way. The whole 'project fear' sound bites by the side blathering on about Turkey's imminent membership being one of the most blatant examples.
    As opposed to the end of the world and a revenge budget threatened if the government doesn't get their way?

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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    We would be screwed. It depends on what your priorities are, putting everyone in the country on a ZHC would be great for the economy, but should we do that too?

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    Why do you want to leave?

    Also, from what I understand as we would be a smaller country, we would end up having restrictions on when we could enter the markets of other countries? Like the Switzerland-China deal. China gets free access straight away but Switzerland gets its access staggered because it's smaller. Whereas if we were in the EU we would be the bigger fish. We just need the EU to become more state like.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    As opposed to the end of the world and a revenge budget threatened if the government doesn't get their way?

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    No ones said the world would end.

    The revenge budget is petty but it's a threat not a lie.
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    (Original post by Aph)
    IIRC something like 48% of our exports are with the EU but only 6% of theirs are with the UK. So the EU if it decided to punish us could crippled our entire economy whilst only taking a minor hit in return.
    How much of that is simply due to the newer members? What we want to be looking at is the old crowd, the Germans, the french, the Italians, not to mention that even with our trade with the US included in the EU figures we're still the biggest trade partner. Our trade supports a lot of the high value high skill jobs in western Europe. It's also about 40pc and 8pc last I saw, ours certainly declining, not sure about the 8pc

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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    No doubt, but any new trade deals wouldnt be so devastating that our economy would collapse as remain suggests, what would any party get out of negotiating a trade deal so bad that the other party's economy is destroyed by it? (thus limiting the trade that can happen, creating a lose-lose situation)

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    Oh, sure, but without a shadow of a doubt, the economy will be damaged by a leave vote.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    How much of that is simply due to the newer members? What we want to be looking at is the old crowd, the Germans, the french, the Italians, not to mention that even with our trade with the US included in the EU figures we're still the biggest trade partner. Our trade supports a lot of the high value high skill jobs in western Europe. It's also about 40pc and 8pc last I saw, ours certainly declining, not sure about the 8pc

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    Don't know, and that assumes that we'd get one of those to negotiate with us... You do know that we only get 2 countries to negotiate with which would make it about a 75.7% chance of not getting Italy, France or Germany...
    And the figures I quoted were the last I heard from the remain camp...
    I dint understand what you ment with the US bit...
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    Oh, sure, but without a shadow of a doubt, the economy will be damaged by a leave vote.
    Maybe so, but my life wouldnt be. At least not directly. I would also quite like to be able to buy menthol **** because i dont like to have ashtray breath blowing into peoples faces after ive had a smoke.

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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    No it wouldn't be. Strong modern economies are founded on consumers with reliable incomes and high productivity.
    ZHCs are the most productive contracts a company can offer. If you have a few employees and all of them are on ZHCs you have a very productive workforce, the more people you have on ZHCs the more output you have and the more that your company grows.

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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    Maybe so, but my life wouldnt be. At least not directly. I would also quite like to be able to buy menthol **** because i dont like to have ashtray breath blowing into peoples faces after ive had a smoke.

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    You're naive if you think that your life won't be affected. The gaming industry suffers substantially through an economic downturn.
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    (Original post by Aph)
    Don't know, and that assumes that we'd get one of those to negotiate with us... You do know that we only get 2 countries to negotiate with which would make it about a 75.7% chance of not getting Italy, France or Germany...
    And the figures I quoted were the last I heard from the remain camp...
    I dint understand what you ment with the US bit...
    The US is the biggest trade partner of the EU, if we leave we take that spot by a country mile; even if we still included the UK-US trade the UK-EU trade is significantly greater.

    The question also is whether the 2 are randomly chosen on selected, if selected it will likely be Germany and a minor country Germany can bully

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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    You're naive if you think that your life won't be affected. The gaming industry suffers substantially through an economic downturn.
    If anything that effect will be a "positive" one, post 08 there were loads of new bookies opening up.

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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    If anything that effect will be a "positive" one, post 08 there were loads of new bookies opening up.

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    http://www.investopedia.com/articles...-recession.asp

    "Gambling, with the exception of the truly troubled gamblers, becomes an extravagance and generally declines during recessions."

    http://www.econmatters.com/2015/07/g...-economic.html

    "When there is no money in circulation in an economy, then that means that people’s spending ability is limited. This means that they will have to prioritize on how to spend their money and activities such as gambling are likely to be at the bottom the list.

    According to research, the gambling industry has demonstrated low growth rates during recession periods and high growth rates during expansion periods. This is due to the simple fact that people are willing to risk less during recession, than they would during expansion."

    http://www.horseracingbusiness.com/h...ession-541.htm

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-gam...49525120081006
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    http://www.investopedia.com/articles...-recession.asp

    "Gambling, with the exception of the truly troubled gamblers, becomes an extravagance and generally declines during recessions."

    http://www.econmatters.com/2015/07/g...-economic.html

    "When there is no money in circulation in an economy, then that means that people’s spending ability is limited. This means that they will have to prioritize on how to spend their money and activities such as gambling are likely to be at the bottom the list.

    According to research, the gambling industry has demonstrated low growth rates during recession periods and high growth rates during expansion periods. This is due to the simple fact that people are willing to risk less during recession, than they would during expansion."

    http://www.horseracingbusiness.com/h...ession-541.htm

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-gam...49525120081006
    Touche.

    Low growth rates is still growth nonetheless, i have very little reason to be concerned. Also theres the menthol filters point...

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