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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Never said Islam is a race
    but, in your post, you attacked those

    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    bigoted racists who want to blame their petty problems on a foreign culture
    there is a huge difference between being anti-Islam and being racist

    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    And I don't think a religion with 1.6 billion active followers is a 'failed religion'
    Islam is a failed religion. It has failed to produce viable political and social models (at least, in the last 500 years or so)

    It is riven by sectarian warfare, continuous civil war, oppression of minorities and continuous fitnah

    numbers, by the way, are irrelevant - it is not quantity, but quality that counts

    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    and no, you can't blame it for terrorist attacks
    why not ? of course you can. Read the Quran and Sunnah
    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    when clearly they are almost all done in response to political unrest or are done to achieve a specific political purpose, not because the perpetrators want to 'defend Islam'.
    this is absurd . The terrorist attacks are, primarily, the responsibility of those who perpetrate them. Excuses are cheap (it's the fault of the CIA, the Zionists, the rafidhi, the Illuminati, the Cambodian secret services etc etc) . All this is pathetic

    the terrorist attacks are inspired, quite simply, by a literal interpretation of Quran and Sunnah. If the Quran and hadith did not contain so many violent, murderous incitements, it would be difficult or even impossible for the Salafi Jihadis to use Islam as their justification

    In any case, Islam is , by its essence, a political religion, not some kind of world-removed mystical philosophy : so Jihadis acting for political purposes are very much in the tradition of Islamic history. Islam, all during its history, has aimed at "making the word of Allah reign supreme" : by peaceful means, if possible, by violent means, if necessary

    There is of course, luckily, also "modernist", peaceful Islam, and also a purely personal, "mystical" Islam, but that's another issue

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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    You can link any poll you want, but discriminating against people because of their beliefs fundamentally goes against democracy.
    No.

    A democracy has a right to be intolerant against intolerance, to protect itself from evil, dangerous ideologies.
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    (Original post by Seelowe)
    Comparing the IRA to Islamic terror is fairly ridiculous. To start with, the IRA generally attacked military targets, and if it attacked a civilian target it would give an hours warning. Secondly, the IRA were primarily concerned with a unified Ireland, whereas the goals of Islamic fundamentalists are varying, with one common connector. They are all done in the name of Islam, in the name of Jihad, in the name of Muhammad and in the name of martyrdom. Without the violent teachings of the Koran, the number of these terror attacks would be slashed.

    Not only that, but the violent beliefs promoted in the Koran lend themselves to such activity.

    Three weeks ago, when a priest had his throat slit in Normandy, and his murderers gave a lecture on Islam and Sharia law, what were their motives? We could try and go into depth, claiming socio-economic issues or we could perhaps claim they were covert revolutionaries who were actually well versed in middle eastern affairs. However, the most likely answer is that they were motivated by a most violent religion into committing a most violent act.
    Lol what? I never compared the IRA to ISIS, I just said that they would deploy bombs instead of sending suicide attackers, LIKE the IRA.

    Secondly, in contrary to your point, ISIS want a caliphate of all Muslims, so your point there isn't strong.

    The Quran also forbids aggressive warfare, forbids killing female/child hostages, forbids using terror for political gain. ISIS do all of these, so your point is also refuted there.

    They were not motivated by religion, take case studies of any modern terror attacker, and a 'heart-filled desire to help Islam' is never in their biography. They always do it because their lives go south and their hateful feelings which derive from this misery are concentrated by radical groups like ISIS.
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    but, in your post, you attacked those

    there is a huge difference between being anti-Islam and being racist

    Islam is a failed religion. It has failed to produce viable political and social models (at least, in the last 500 years or so)

    It is riven by sectarian warfare, continuous civil war, oppression of minorities and continuous fitnah

    numbers, by the way, are irrelevant - it is not quantity, but quality that counts

    why not ? of course you can. Read the Quran and Sunnah this is absurd . The terrorist attacks are, primarily, the responsibility of those who perpetrate them. Excuses are cheap (it's the fault of the CIA, the Zionists, the rafidhi, the Illuminati, the Cambodian secret services etc etc) . All this is pathetic

    the terrorist attacks are inspired, quite simply, by a literal interpretation of Quran and Sunnah. If the Quran and hadith did not contain so many violent, murderous incitements, it would be difficult or even impossible for the Salafi Jihadis to use Islam as their justification

    In any case, Islam is , by its essence, a political religion, not some kind of world-removed mystical philosophy : so Jihadis acting for political purposes are very much in the tradition of Islamic history. Islam, all during its history, has aimed at "making the word of Allah reign supreme" : by peaceful means, if possible, by violent means, if necessary

    There is of course, luckily, also "modernist", peaceful Islam, and also a purely personal, "mystical" Islam, but that's another issue

    best
    Racism and Islamophobia tend to come together. Regardless of whether Islam is a race or not, its still religious discrimination and bigotry.

    the rest of your post is so un-informed and assumptive, its not worth replying to. take ANY case study of terrorism in the last 3 years in Europe, and almost all of them do it for political gain and not to help Islam
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    The Quran also forbids aggressive warfare, forbids killing female/child hostages, forbids using terror for political gain. ISIS do all of these, so your point is also refuted there.
    Why are you lying? I think you know full well that that isn't true. Mohammed himself conquered many lands in aggressive warfare. That is a historical fact...
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    The main question is where you from ?
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    (Original post by inhuman)
    Oh when was this, on a gap yah?

    Please stop protecting a dangerous ideology.

    what are u talking about Islam is not a dangerous ideology
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    The basis for all religion is good, that's a solid fact, but if you look at religious texts like the Qu'uran and (in Christianity) the Bible there'll always be something which radicalists will choose to hang onto. Like if Of Mice and Men was a religious text some people might hang onto the fact that Curley's Wife was killed and choose to kill off every young woman who might flirt with men without a glimpse into the true context of what happened and the time it was written. Kind of went a little off topic but you get the gist 😊

    The fact of the matter is that people (in general) need to show more acceptance to other faiths/people. Why fight radicalism with hatred? Radical people generally become radical due to a lack of acceptance where they come from or a preconceived notion of hatred that's further enflamed by charismatic speakers. I don't know about anyone else but I'd rather offer a smile to everyone that I meet than 'hate' them for their religion/outer appearance.

    Hope everyone has a great day!


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    (Original post by sfairy27)
    The basis for all religion is good,


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    apart from Satanism

    given you are wrong in your very first comment I'll not waste my time with the rest
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    Where ever you get Islam (and religion in general) you'll get complications- except no one hates the Jews or the Chinese....... (probably because they're not blowing everyone up) so go figure.
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    (Original post by BaconandSauce)
    apart from Satanism

    given you are wrong in your very first comment I'll not waste my time with the rest
    http://www.churchofsatan.com/faq-fun...al-beliefs.php

    Have a fab day, ye of little faith (although maybe I should have specified I meant the 'main' religions as it were ?)
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    (Original post by sfairy27)
    http://www.churchofsatan.com/faq-fun...al-beliefs.php

    Have a fab day, ye of little faith (although maybe I should have specified I meant the 'main' religions as it were ?)
    but yes 'Main' would have been better (but it still doesn't include Islam)
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    (Original post by BaconandSauce)
    but yes 'Main' would have been better (but it still doesn't include Islam)
    Okay, 'prevalent' then? I'll keep offering alternatives until it fits
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Racism and Islamophobia tend to come together. Regardless of whether Islam is a race or not, its still religious discrimination and bigotry.
    completely wrong. It has nothing to do with bigotry, or racism

    being anti-Islam is a political/social statement, just like being anti-communist or anti-fascist. It means opposing a political/social agenda, not a purely personal religion, and most surely not a race

    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    the rest of your post is so un-informed and assumptive, its not worth replying to.
    understood, dear friend

    how very, very convenient
    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    take ANY case study of terrorism in the last 3 years in Europe, and almost all of them do it for political gain and not to help Islam
    what is the difference ?

    Salafi/jihadis assume that Islam is now under attack by the "West", by "rafidhi Shias", Zionists, apostates, assorted infidels etc and therefore, by attacking those heinous kuffar, the terrorists are convinced they are helping Islam, as well as spreading the word of Allah, until there is no more fitnah (discord) but worship for him alone

    you should realise that, in Islam, it is next to impossible to separate religion and politics

    best
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    completely wrong. It has nothing to do with bigotry, or racism

    being anti-Islam is a political/social statement, just like being anti-communist or anti-fascist. It means opposing a political/social agenda, not a purely personal religion, and most surely not a race

    understood, dear friend

    how very, very convenientwhat is the difference ?

    Salafi/jihadis assume that Islam is now under attack by the "West", by "rafidhi Shias", Zionists, apostates, assorted infidels etc and therefore, by attacking those heinous kuffar, the terrorists are convinced they are helping Islam, as well as spreading the word of Allah, until there is no more fitnah (discord) but worship for him alone

    you should realise that, in Islam, it is next to impossible to separate religion and politics

    best
    You've misinterpreted me. People who are racist are very often Islamophobic as well.

    And I think Sadiq Khan being the mayor of London is a direct contradiction to your theory of Islam being inseparable between politics and religion.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    You've misinterpreted me. People who are racist are very often Islamophobic as well.
    they may also speak English, or love spaghetti as well

    by the way "Islamophobic" means next to nothing, if not much more closely defined

    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    And I think Sadiq Khan being the mayor of London is a direct contradiction to your theory of Islam being inseparable between politics and religion.
    huh ?

    Sadiq Khan is, at the same time, a (moderate) Muslim and a politician. How on Earth could he contradict my theory that Islam is inseparable from politics ?

    quite on the contrary, dear friend

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    (Original post by mariachi)
    they may also speak English, or love spaghetti as well

    by the way "Islamophobic" means next to nothing, if not much more closely defined

    huh ?

    Sadiq Khan is, at the same time, a (moderate) Muslim and a politician. How on Earth could he contradict my theory that Islam is inseparable from politics ?

    quite on the contrary, dear friend

    best
    Islamophobic = fear/hatred of Muslims or Islam, its simple

    and it contradicts it because it shows that you can fully integrate with western politics without bringing in Islamic fundamentalist intentions, which is what you implied by your poorly worded response just before.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Islamophobic = fear/hatred of Muslims or Islam, its simple
    it's not simple at all, and you still fail to realise it

    fearing/ hating Islam is not the same as fearing or hating Muslims. Fearing is not the same as hating. Neither are strongly opposing, attacking, criticising, etc etc

    fearing/hating terrorist Jihadis is not the same as fearing/hating average Muslims

    "Islamophobia" is a general label used mostly to stifle any opposition to Islam taking a more important role in our societies

    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    and it contradicts it because it shows that you can fully integrate with western politics without bringing in Islamic fundamentalist intentions, which is what you implied by your poorly worded response just before.
    not at all, dear friend

    my response was very well worded : I said that

    (Original post by mariachi)
    in Islam, it is next to impossible to separate religion and politics
    this does not mean that every Muslim is, par force, a Jihadi fundamentalist : it means, rather, that Islam is not a purely personal belief, it comes with a political/social agenda

    this agenda can, of course be formulated/interpreted in many ways. Some of the formulations/interpretations are perfectly incompatible with our (Western) parliamentary democracies, based on equality between sexes, religious beliefs, classical freedoms etc

    some (usually defined as reformist, modernist etc) aren't

    best
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    it's not simple at all, and you still fail to realise it

    fearing/ hating Islam is not the same as fearing or hating Muslims. Fearing is not the same as hating. Neither are strongly opposing, attacking, criticising, etc etc

    fearing/hating terrorist Jihadis is not the same as fearing/hating average Muslims

    "Islamophobia" is a general label used mostly to stifle any opposition to Islam taking a more important role in our societies

    not at all, dear friend

    my response was very well worded : I said that



    this does not mean that every Muslim is, par force, a Jihadi fundamentalist : it means, rather, that Islam is not a purely personal belief, it comes with a political/social agenda

    this agenda can, of course be formulated/interpreted in many ways. Some of the formulations/interpretations are perfectly incompatible with our (Western) parliamentary democracies, based on equality between sexes, religious beliefs, classical freedoms etc

    some (usually defined as reformist, modernist etc) aren't

    best
    Islamophobia is a collective term which means fear/hating Islam OR Muslims. Not 'and'. :facepalm:
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    OP started off so strong, but has been completely destroyed within this thread. Never see such a finish.
 
 
 
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