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    (Original post by The_Great_One)
    Apparently if this vote doesn't go through the next plan is to completely abolish funding to lower degrees such as media studies and business and give all of the money to the likes of science, maths and engineering, What do you think?
    Apart from the fact they are already doing that.
    The cuts which are the reason behind the tuition fee increase mean that only STEM subjects (science, technology, engineering and maths) will get government funding. So what you are saying is the next plan, is actually what is being done anyway.
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    (Original post by Organ)
    You are using an internet that was developed by maths and physics, using electricity developed by maths and physics, you wouldn't be able to watch a film at the cinema without maths or physics. When you get ill you are treated by science graduates, using technology made by science students. Your car, your clothes, your plane ticket to a foreign holiday, lights, bridges, skyscrapers, antibiotics, hoovers, plumbing, sky TV and so on and on and on are down to science and maths. I appreciate the arts as much as the next reasonable guy - but saying science and maths don't touch your life is breathtakingly ignorant - science has shaped the modern world, and will provide solutions to the problems of the future - as well as shaping the future world with it.
    Without the arts nothing would be on TV.
    Without history we would have never understood the history of science and medicine and not learnt it's previous faults.
    Without the media graduates, drama graduates and English graduates there would be no one to act, produce, direct or write the films produced on the cinemas scientists
    Made.

    More off topic: without the English degrees who produced great teachers none of the scientists would be able to read or write. Without the
    Lawyers,who many have originally done degrees in English, history etc there would be no justice. Many of the great politicians in our world would have not been in power had try not done their arts degrees. If, anything science has produced some of the worst politicians and dictators of our time due to their obsession with trying to eliminate history so they could contain control and have an oblivious nation.


    Having said that though, science is more useful from the arts subjects. I understand that, but the two work hand in hand. Without the arts, there would often be no need to for scientists to create some of the things they have. Science is more useful, but that doesn't make it a better thing overall, the two are as old as each other and both work hand in hand.

    Im sorry if there are tons of spelling grammar faults in this, I'm on a bloody iPhone A's it's my only Internet source right now and it has a very annoying spell check.
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    (Original post by tillytots)
    Without the arts nothing would be on TV.
    Without history we would have never understood the history of science and medicine and not learnt it's previous faults.
    Without the media graduates, drama graduates and English graduates there would be no one to act, produce, direct or write the films produced on the cinemas scientists
    Made.

    .
    I don't think many doctors ready history of medicine specifically, the just read the current journals and go to conferences to find out the pros and cons of treatments.

    There were plenty of actors, producers and directors before there were any graduates doing these things. Shakespeare wasn't a graduate and many of his contempories looked down on him for this.

    Acting was considered a very lowly and disreputable occupation until the the second half of the 19th century so very few graduates would have wanted to go on the stage.
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    [QUOTE=tillytots;28733143]More off topic: without the English degrees who produced great teachers none of the scientists would be able to read or write. Without the
    Lawyers,who many have originally done degrees in English, history etc there would be no justice. Many of the great politicians in our world would have not been in power had try not done their arts degrees. If, anything science has produced some of the worst politicians and dictators of our time due to their obsession with trying to eliminate history so they could contain control and have an oblivious nation.


    QUOTE]

    The two worst polticians of the 20th century were Hitler who studied art and Stalin who studied theology.

    Hitler was very keen on history and wanted to build a sort of German version of Imperial Rome with himself as Julius Caesar.
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    I'm not really sure why you have bothered to type this - seeing as I wasn't attempting to discredit the arts in anyway. The world would be a better place if more people understood ancient history and so on. I don't think there is any need for two camps anyway, I love history, theology and philosophy despite studying sciences.

    (Original post by tillytots)
    Without the arts nothing would be on TV.
    Plently of stuff on TV is made by people without degrees, or with non-arts degrees. :confused:

    Without history we would have never understood the history of science and medicine and not learnt it's previous faults.
    Why? Because as a science student I am unable to understand history. Come on! Don't be stupid!

    Without the media graduates, drama graduates and English graduates there would be no one to act, produce, direct or write the films produced on the cinemas scientists
    I don't mean to be pedantic. But you don't really need an English degree to act or produce, or really to write.

    Lawyers,who many have originally done degrees in English, history etc there would be no justice. Many of the great politicians in our world would have not been in power had try not done their arts degrees. If, anything science has produced some of the worst politicians and dictators of our time due to their obsession with trying to eliminate history so they could contain control and have an oblivious nation.
    This is an interesting point - it's not one that I can really think of any examples of. Hitler was a failed art student (literally art not 'arts'), Stalin didn't go to university, Ceausescu didn't go to university, Mao worked in a library, Amin didn't go to university. Thatcher did study Chemistry however - so that's one. I don't understand how you have managed to draw a link between a leader with a scientific education and a desire to elimnate histroy and control people - although I have the impression you haven't really opened a history book in your life. Do you care to enlighten me on this positive correleation bewteen a science degree and becoming a tyrant?

    (Original post by Maker)
    I don't think many doctors ready history of medicine specifically, the just read the current journals and go to conferences to find out the pros and cons of treatments.
    There are quite a few intercalations medical students can take that involve the history or philosophy of medicine.
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    Ah come on, they would never abolish funding for the arts.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    I don't think many doctors ready history of medicine specifically, the just read the current journals and go to conferences to find out the pros and cons of treatments.

    There were plenty of actors, producers and directors before there were any graduates doing these things. Shakespeare wasn't a graduate and many of his contempories looked down on him for this.

    Acting was considered a very lowly and disreputable occupation until the the second half of the 19th century so very few graduates would have wanted to go on the stage.
    I know doctors don't read the history of medicine, my point was, if we had no concept of history, or no historians who had taken a degree in history, there would be no history. So medics and scientists wouldn't be able to evolve and look at previous mistakes, we'd still be stuck with Hippocrates four humours and all believe that blood letting and amputating with household saws had it not been for history showing those mistakes.

    Acting was perceived as being awful and yes Shakespeare was looked down for having No degree, but again arts degrees have allowed us to evolve, much like medicine degrees have, go back to the middle ages and around shakespeares time, medicine wasn't that respected either and most medics were considered absolute barbarians chopping everyone up here and there. There's been lots of times were science has been frowned upon due to religion(which no I don't agree with.) every subject has been shunned upon in in it's time, it doesn't make it bad or useless.
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    (Original post by tillytots)
    I know doctors don't read the history of medicine, my point was, if we had no concept of history, or no historians who had taken a degree in history, there would be no history. So medics and scientists wouldn't be able to evolve and look at previous mistakes, we'd still be stuck with Hippocrates four humours and all believe that blood letting and amputating with household saws had it not been for history showing those mistakes.

    Acting was perceived as being awful and yes Shakespeare was looked down for having No degree, but again arts degrees have allowed us to evolve, much like medicine degrees have, go back to the middle ages and around shakespeares time, medicine wasn't that respected either and most medics were considered absolute barbarians chopping everyone up here and there. There's been lots of times were science has been frowned upon due to religion(which no I don't agree with.) every subject has been shunned upon in in it's time, it doesn't make it bad or useless.
    I don't mean to be horrible but this is really stupid. History didn't result in new scientific discoveries (as wonderful subject history is, you can't possibly claim this) - science did, the actions of scientists and science resulted in new scientific disocveries - namely in the early stages individuals like Harvey. The history of medicine simply documents the history of scientific discover in the medical field - I can't believe anybody would seriously say something like that.
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    I'm applying for a degree in Water treatment studies.

    no it doesn't exist.
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    (Original post by Oswy)
    How many of those very wealthy media presenters, writers, producers and technicians and so on do you think did science and maths degrees? Media is a huge industry in the UK, you do know that?

    And for many UK universities business is the biggest money earning subject.

    Tip: thinking first, typing later.

    Many of them do English History, ect. Very few will actually have a degree in media studies.
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    (Original post by SophiaKeuning)
    Ah come on, they would never abolish funding for the arts.
    I'm hoping you are being sarcastic because that is exactly what they are doing.
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    (Original post by WelshBluebird)
    I'm hoping you are being sarcastic because that is exactly what they are doing.
    Oh. What makes you say that? I haven't seen anything on the news about it.
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    (Original post by SophiaKeuning)
    Oh. What makes you say that? I haven't seen anything on the news about it.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11627843

    Everything but STEM subjects are being cut.
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    [QUOTE=Maker;28733395]
    (Original post by tillytots)
    More off topic: without the English degrees who produced great teachers none of the scientists would be able to read or write. Without the
    Lawyers,who many have originally done degrees in English, history etc there would be no justice. Many of the great politicians in our world would have not been in power had try not done their arts degrees. If, anything science has produced some of the worst politicians and dictators of our time due to their obsession with trying to eliminate history so they could contain control and have an oblivious nation.


    QUOTE]

    The two worst polticians of the 20th century were Hitler who studied art and Stalin who studied theology.

    Hitler was very keen on history and wanted to build a sort of German version of Imperial Rome with himself as Julius Caesar.
    Actually considering what Hitler did politically he was very good politician.
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    (Original post by The_Great_One)
    Think before you type. How many people do you know in that past 5 years that have done a media degree and got a job in TV straight after, none.
    I'm sorry but that's not necessarily true. For one my best friend finished his media degree last year. And now he has quite a well paid job working for the BBC. And I asked him about the rest of his class and the majority of them are working with television companies. They may not exactly be on tv, but they are in broadcasting, show production etc etc.
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    (Original post by tillytots)
    I know doctors don't read the history of medicine, my point was, if we had no concept of history, or no historians who had taken a degree in history, there would be no history. So medics and scientists wouldn't be able to evolve and look at previous mistakes, we'd still be stuck with Hippocrates four humours and all believe that blood letting and amputating with household saws had it not been for history showing those mistakes.

    Acting was perceived as being awful and yes Shakespeare was looked down for having No degree, but again arts degrees have allowed us to evolve, much like medicine degrees have, go back to the middle ages and around shakespeares time, medicine wasn't that respected either and most medics were considered absolute barbarians chopping everyone up here and there. There's been lots of times were science has been frowned upon due to religion(which no I don't agree with.) every subject has been shunned upon in in it's time, it doesn't make it bad or useless.
    I would be surprised and apprehensive if my GP started to look up how people use to have holes drilled in their head if I go to him about a headache. I don't think it happens too fequently these days.

    Actually, medics in the middle ages did not chop people up, surgeons did that. Medicine has always been regarded as a prestigous profession even if medics were a bit useless because they used their brain and were learned while surgeons were considered merely workmen on par with carpenters and blacksmiths because their work was purely mechanical.
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    (Original post by The_Great_One)
    No they don't all artists do is crush a can of coke and say *wow look at this crushed can of coke* and get a million pound for it.
    If it was like that, I dare say the whole world would be full of wealthy artists. Just because you personally dont appreciate something now, doesnt mean other people dont.

    Arts are an expression of humanity. A piece of art can provide inspiration, hope and motivation to those that need it. Taking something at face value and ridiculing it as you have done exhibits an extraordinarily narrow mind.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    The two worst polticians of the 20th century were Hitler who studied art and Stalin who studied theology.

    Hitler was very keen on history and wanted to build a sort of German version of Imperial Rome with himself as Julius Caesar.
    What exactly makes them the "worst" politicians? I would say that someone like Chavez who has taken a relatively sustainable country and is now destroying it or Mr Berisha who instead of encouraging much needed investment into his country prefers to just fire ad hominem after ad hominem at his opponents are more worthy candidates.

    Stalin helped create/maintain a sustainable economy that allowed it to become a competing world super power having been a new and unstable system only a decade before?

    Hitler managed to implement the ideals of many of the far right following the 1st world war and brought a relatively small and insufficient far right party with the same crediilty as the BNP, into the limelight and power.

    If you are going to judge these people for their contribution to horrors of humanity, then fair enough but as far as politics are judged, both these men were able to create world powers and also prevent any internal eff ups. I think Joey Barton is a **** but I wouldnt therefore label him a crap footballer!
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    (Original post by adam_zed)
    What exactly makes them the "worst" politicians? I would say that someone like Chavez who has taken a relatively sustainable country and is now destroying it or Mr Berisha who instead of encouraging much needed investment into his country prefers to just fire ad hominem after ad hominem at his opponents are more worthy candidates.

    Stalin helped create/maintain a sustainable economy that allowed it to become a competing world super power having been a new and unstable system only a decade before?

    Hitler managed to implement the ideals of many of the far right following the 1st world war and brought a relatively small and insufficient far right party with the same crediilty as the BNP, into the limelight and power.

    If you are going to judge these people for their contribution to horrors of humanity, then fair enough but as far as politics are judged, both these men were able to create world powers and also prevent any internal eff ups. I think Joey Barton is a **** but I wouldnt therefore label him a crap footballer!
    I love it when people say Hitler was a great poltician. He was a great politcian if judged by getting to lead a great nation like Germany but rubbish because he destroyed it and lost half of it to the Russians for nearly 40 years.

    Stalin is rubbish because he set up a system that was fated to fail, very slowly but failed never the less.

    By your standard, Chavez is a far better politician than Hitler because Venezuela
    is still whole while Germany was decimated.

    So Robert Mugabe is a great politician right?
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    (Original post by The_Great_One)
    Apparently if this vote doesn't go through the next plan is to completely abolish funding to lower degrees such as media studies and business and give all of the money to the likes of science, maths and engineering, What do you think?
    Makes sense - so long as they can get the money back somehow.

    Media studies is a cop out, and everyone knows it. No one with any potential is interested in 'media studies' over subjects such as art or english.....
 
 
 
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