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D-Day - 9th December, London - This is the LAST MARCH before voting! MAKE IT BIG!!!!! Watch

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    (Original post by anoif_)
    As a side point, the fee rises won't even affect you so take your size 20 font and overuse of exclamation marks elsewhere.
    "A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in."
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    (Original post by ANARCHY__)
    Ah, you don't seem so selfish to me. I'm glad we're agreeing on a number of points. It's nice to exchange ideas with another person.

    It is a shame that media basically spin whatever line they want. Well, I'd prefer if there wasn't an overall 'party line' for the journalists to stick but I guess you can't enforce that. The Independent, I think, is closest to achieving it.

    And hey, if you have any more general points about my views or something like that, feel free to ask any of the guys in here: http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/show....php?t=1425337 although the debate does get a little intellectual at times.

    ANARCHY__
    Same. I'm quite happy for someone to disagree with me (as often happens!) but it's much more interesting if we can talk about it

    I'm just grateful we don't have America's politically-influenced TV. And yes, as its name suggests, I think The Independent tends to be the least biased though I'm a lover of The Times - as you may have expected.

    I thought the link to the thread would be 'Ask a Socialist' but you've all got your own version over there! :p: I tend to stick to things I know - anarchism isn't my forte haha, but I'll definitely ask any questions in the future
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    (Original post by anoif_)
    Same. I'm quite happy for someone to disagree with me (as often happens!) but it's much more interesting if we can talk about it

    I'm just grateful we don't have America's politically-influenced TV. And yes, as its name suggests, I think The Independent tends to be the least biased though I'm a lover of The Times - as you may have expected.

    I thought the link to the thread would be 'Ask a Socialist' but you've all got your own version over there! :p: I tend to stick to things I know - anarchism isn't my forte haha, but I'll definitely ask any questions in the future
    Exactly. It's great to just see the other side of the coin.

    In terms of T.V., I'm not sure I'd go quite as far to say there's little political influence; even the BBC partial to it at times but I guess, compared to abc, Fox etc, that's nothing. The real political bias is in, as you state, the newspapers but at least they present their own cases effectively. The Times is ok, I certainly wouldn't rubbish it, but it's not something I'd read often.

    You might find this interesting, just to get an alternative viewpoint to your own; http://www.johnpilger.com/articles/n...tv-in-december

    Ah, don't about anarchy not being your forte. A lot of people just brush it off as a kind of stupid system of living but like you say, if you ever want to delve deeper, feel free to ask a question.

    ANARCHY__
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    (Original post by loosebruce)
    All I have to say is that you are lucky to be born in a wonderful country and the world does NOT owe you a living or a single penny!

    Its sad but true!

    It does owe me things, that's what my taxes are for. I pay taxes and the state agrees to provide certain services to its population such as roads, education, health care etc.. It is quite simple.
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    (Original post by ANARCHY__)
    Exactly. It's great to just see the other side of the coin.

    In terms of T.V., I'm not sure I'd go quite as far to say there's little political influence; even the BBC partial to it at times but I guess, compared to abc, Fox etc, that's nothing. The real political bias is in, as you state, the newspapers but at least they present their own cases effectively. The Times is ok, I certainly wouldn't rubbish it, but it's not something I'd read often.

    You might find this interesting, just to get an alternative viewpoint to your own; http://www.johnpilger.com/articles/n...tv-in-december

    Ah, don't about anarchy not being your forte. A lot of people just brush it off as a kind of stupid system of living but like you say, if you ever want to delve deeper, feel free to ask a question.

    ANARCHY__
    Yeah, I'd agree that we do see it sometimes in the BBC but Fox is just so bad for it, the BBC pales in comparison :p: You're right about the newspapers presenting their cases effectively but my parents read The Daily Mail (and whilst it annoys me when people call it the Fail) sometimes there are just mindless articles!

    That sounds like a really interesting film. Unfortunately I live in Manchester and the closest cinema on that list would be Liverpool I wouldn't brush it off as I don't know enough about it but will look at learning more
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    (Original post by the_13th)
    http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=136567579732280

    Please join the facebook event and come down to London!

    This is the last march that takes place BEFORE voting on education fees!

    Every single person will contribute! Together we will make a difference!

    This time no excuses.

    IT'S SHOWDOWN at PARLIAMENT SQUARE!!!!!

    10:00 AM, DECEMBER 9TH, 2010, PARLIAMENT SQUARE, LONDON



    The government officials are paid for their jobs. And it's their jobs to "come up with a different solution", not ours!

    Yes, it will not affect me because I'm starting my studies next year.
    Think about millions of students in the future, whom it will affect!

    You should not be so selfish. It's not about "me", it's about "us"!


    Everyone should come to this protest!
    Thank you very much for posting this.

    I will be one of those affected by the changes as i will be going to university in 3-4 years.

    On behalf of my generation, i would like to thank you and all other current students for campaigning on behalf of us.

    THANK YOU

    And for those who neg repped this guy.

    Get off the forums?
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    (Original post by anoif_)
    Yeah, I'd agree that we do see it sometimes in the BBC but Fox is just so bad for it, the BBC pales in comparison :p: You're right about the newspapers presenting their cases effectively but my parents read The Daily Mail (and whilst it annoys me when people call it the Fail) sometimes there are just mindless articles!

    That sounds like a really interesting film. Unfortunately I live in Manchester and the closest cinema on that list would be Liverpool I wouldn't brush it off as I don't know enough about it but will look at learning more
    Yeah, I remember wanting to get a different view point once so I went and bought the Daily Mail, not knowing what it would be like. I read through and it was really strange; there were no articles in there really. I mean, sure there were words and headlines but as I was reading through, I couldn't see the substance within it. Maybe it was just me but that just seemed really unhelpful in providing a right wing view point.

    Also, you can watch the film on ITV. It's on the 14th of December at 10.35 PM.
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    Our whole college is going to be striking on the 9th (Thursday), so will make it down to Parliament square with not very non-violent intentions.

    Hope to see loads of people there!
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    (Original post by AndroidLight)
    Our whole college is going to be striking on the 9th (Thursday), so will make it down to Parliament square with not very non-violent intentions.

    Hope to see loads of people there!
    12'000 people "attending" the event on facebook.
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    (Original post by the_13th)
    12'000 people "attending" the event on facebook.
    Many more should be coming, as a lot decide on the day or the day before.

    Btw in regards to your sig, we should also be protesting in support of wikileaks. It kind of feels like everyone's waiting for an effector, like Assange getting arrested.
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    (Original post by ANARCHY__)
    Yeah, I remember wanting to get a different view point once so I went and bought the Daily Mail, not knowing what it would be like. I read through and it was really strange; there were no articles in there really. I mean, sure there were words and headlines but as I was reading through, I couldn't see the substance within it. Maybe it was just me but that just seemed really unhelpful in providing a right wing view point.

    Also, you can watch the film on ITV. It's on the 14th of December at 10.35 PM.
    It's a really random read, that's for sure. Mainly involving 'OMG immigrants are so bad for our country!!!!' and 'Look at all these people claiming benefits!!!!'

    I must have missed that bit - I think I got caught up in the fact there are no Picturehouses near me. I'll set it to record
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    (Original post by anoif_)
    It's a really random read, that's for sure. Mainly involving 'OMG immigrants are so bad for our country!!!!' and 'Look at all these people claiming benefits!!!!'

    I must have missed that bit - I think I got caught up in the fact there are no Picturehouses near me. I'll set it to record
    Cool. On a different note, what do you think of the recent leak?
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    (Original post by the_13th)
    The government officials are paid for their jobs. And it's their jobs to "come up with a different solution", not ours!
    Yes. Both the Coalition and Labour have come up with different solutions, neither of which advocate the real cost of a degree doing anything but rising. :confused: So why do you not accept their alternatives?
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    (Original post by Dec S 92)
    Its not a case of getting somthing for nothing, WTF do the taxes our parents have paid their entire working lives go on?

    The politicians who have got our country in this ****hole benifited from a free education, so why not us? and as even more of a spit in the face why should we pay 3x more, what more are we getting for the extra 6 grand?
    Sure, they did. A lot of them lived through a time when it was illegal to be gay, BT was owned by the government, tax was lower, etc etc. I don't see how this is much different- we can't say that either nothing should change or politicans should pay for something just because the situation is going to be different. I don't think Gordon Brown should repay the deficit, for example.
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    (Original post by the_13th)
    The government officials are paid for their jobs. And it's their jobs to "come up with a different solution", not ours!

    Yes, it will not affect me because I'm starting my studies next year.
    Think about millions of students in the future, whom it will affect!

    You should not be so selfish. It's not about "me", it's about "us"!

    Everyone should come to this protest!
    The fact that so many students are against any form cuts hardly supports your theory of it being about 'us'. And calls that democracy has failed us are just laughable, the government didn't get voted in by the students so have no mandate? Well considering students make up a small percentage of voting population we are hardly the game changers on who wins are we?

    The government has a deficit, are we responsible for this? Not directly, although you could argue by voting in the government we indirectly were. Is it fair that we are the generation that bares the burdens of the cuts? No, but someone has to, the government can't just magically make money.

    And the argument of 'tax the rich' fails under scrutiny, a very small number of people earn enough to make any impact and even then we would have to tax them an insane amount which would probably result in them moving to a more tax friendly country.

    If we don't reduce the deficit we will have to eventually default on loans, and then we will be in a similar situation to Greece, or maybe even worse. The cuts have to be made, and they have to affect everyone, we all live here, we all use the services paid for, not just the rich, in fact often the rich don't even benefit from things like healthcare or education as they go private. So as this is about 'us' and not 'me' we have a duty to contribute.

    Also the argument that the politicians got free education so why should we pay? Well things have to change, sometimes things seem feasible but turn out not to be; the fact that they thought it was feasible doesn't mean we can continue driving ourselves into debt when we realise it isn't just for consistency. And if its preserving what is for the sake of equality then maybe things like state education and free healthcare should be scrapped as the people who introduced them didn't benefit from it so why should we?
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    (Original post by Sithiris)
    The fact that so many students are against any form cuts hardly supports your theory of it being about 'us'. And calls that democracy has failed us are just laughable, the government didn't get voted in by the students so have no mandate? Well considering students make up a small percentage of voting population we are hardly the game changers on who wins are we?

    The government has a deficit, are we responsible for this? Not directly, although you could argue by voting in the government we indirectly were. Is it fair that we are the generation that bares the burdens of the cuts? No, but someone has to, the government can't just magically make money.

    And the argument of 'tax the rich' fails under scrutiny, a very small number of people earn enough to make any impact and even then we would have to tax them an insane amount which would probably result in them moving to a more tax friendly country.

    If we don't reduce the deficit we will have to eventually default on loans, and then we will be in a similar situation to Greece, or maybe even worse. The cuts have to be made, and they have to affect everyone, we all live here, we all use the services paid for, not just the rich, in fact often the rich don't even benefit from things like healthcare or education as they go private. So as this is about 'us' and not 'me' we have a duty to contribute.

    Also the argument that the politicians got free education so why should we pay? Well things have to change, sometimes things seem feasible but turn out not to be; the fact that they thought it was feasible doesn't mean we can continue driving ourselves into debt when we realise it isn't just for consistency. And if its preserving what is for the sake of equality then maybe things like state education and free healthcare should be scrapped as the people who introduced them didn't benefit from it so why should we?
    Rubbish there is £25bn of tax avoided each year by corporations which would more than get rid of the deficit.
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    (Original post by JMG89)
    Rubbish there is £25bn of tax avoided each year by corporations which would more than get rid of the deficit.
    Erm, no. Even if every penny of that £25bn could magically be reclaimed each year without any repercussions, it would still leave a good £150bn of deficit.

    That doesn't mean you shouldn't take action on it, just that you need to be realistic and have a little perspective.
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    (Original post by Flob)
    Erm, no. Even if every penny of that £25bn could magically be reclaimed each year without any repercussions, it would still leave a good £150bn of deficit.

    That doesn't mean you shouldn't take action on it, just that you need to be realistic and have a little perspective.

    The government has announced £83bn of cuts yes? It has increased some taxes to raise the rest of the money, yes? This is all occuring over 5 years as they are saying they want to eradicate the deficit by the next election. it is £25bn a year so 5*25 is £125bn. which is more than the £83bn in cuts.

    The tax doesn't magically appear, the government puts laws in place to make it happen, the UK is a massive market, how many companies will just leave?
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    This'll be interesting.
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    Here's a link to a petition, that will be handed to mp's on thursday.

    http://www.gopetition.com/petition/41174.html

    Feel free to start a new thread solely for this if you feel compelled.
 
 
 
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