Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Students. You have nothing to worry about. Watch

    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Matthew_Lowson)
    I dont mind FAIR fees - which is what I see at the moment, we pay our fair share if we decide to go to Uni - and we quite rightly pay it back when we earn a set wage. FAIR fees I dont have a problem with!!!
    Ah, wait. I misunderstood you on that.
    My point still stands though - would you rather have a free NHS, or for tuition fees to be kept to £3000 / year?
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    What I am wondering is if students would be happy if instead of having to pay higher fees, the government asked(not mandated) them to donate a small percentage of their yearly salaries to their university. Given just how little British universities get from their alumni compared to their American counterparts and the benefits a degree brings them, I find it amazing that university alumni here have so little involvement with the institute that played such a big role in shaping their lives.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Students will keep making a fuss because they are gullible sheep who do anything their power hungry, mp wannabe union leaders tell them
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Matthew_Lowson)
    I dont mind FAIR fees - which is what I see at the moment, we pay our fair share if we decide to go to Uni - and we quite rightly pay it back when we earn a set wage. FAIR fees I dont have a problem with!!!
    The average degree costs 7-9k an year per undergrad. How is contributing less than half that amount in any way "fair"? Why do you think universities have been talking up the idea for higher fees or graduate contributions for over an year now?
    • Offline

      13
      (Original post by ish90an)
      What I am wondering is if students would be happy if instead of having to pay higher fees, the government asked(not mandated) them to donate a small percentage of their yearly salaries to their university. Given just how little British universities get from their alumni compared to their American counterparts and the benefits a degree brings them, I find it amazing that university alumni here have so little involvement with the institute that played such a big role in shaping their lives.
      Thats Like a Grad Tax what Labour are proposing. - Given the choice of two I'd pay the Grad Tax until I'd paid the equivalent of a student debt off -

      Its the figures that I am angry about - the most I'd accept fees at would be £4500 - or 40% more on the premise of the Threshold being raised by 40% but thats the only way I'd accept the rise.
      • Offline

        13
        (Original post by ish90an)
        The average degree costs 7-9k an year per undergrad. How is contributing less than half that amount in any way "fair"? Why do you think universities have been talking up the idea for higher fees or graduate contributions for over an year now?
        They'd pay the loans off like they do currently now - THAT IS FAIR!
        Offline

        17
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by Martyn*)
        I'm getting tired of seeing and hearing about these tuition fee cuts and student protests.

        THERE ARE BIGGER THINGS GOING ON IN THE WORLD

        Yes. There are.

        Ok. Granted that this is a student forum, but look:

        You won't have to pay any of the debt unless when you leave University, you start top earn over £21,000 per annum.

        It's not that bad. How many of these students are going to be earning that amount when they find that upon leaving their education they'll be tossing burgers at a fast food chain, pulling pints at the local, or sat behind a till in T.J.Hughes? Or even unemployed?

        How many?

        Even if you do get that kind of salary, it's only £7 per month. Granted for a long time, but that debt can be written off, apparently.
        Seriously Martyn, just because you're unable to get a job doesn't mean a large proportion don't earn over 21k coming out of uni.

        How do you get £7/month? On 21k you'd pay back nothing...
        Offline

        17
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by Matthew_Lowson)
        Its the figures that I am angry about - the most I'd accept fees at would be £4500 - or 40% more on the premise of the Threshold being raised by 40% but thats the only way I'd accept the rise.
        So you won't be applying for uni then?
        Offline

        4
        ReputationRep:
        People protest about a lot less than £27k There are millions of cases in small claims courts (up to £5k only) each year.
        Offline

        17
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by Matthew_Lowson)
        Whats so important that means Government GREED can take precedence.
        You don't have to go you know...
        Offline

        2
        ReputationRep:
        From what I've observed, the students are doing a damn good job of widening the issues beyond fees but to the wider cuts & tax avoidance/evasion issues.

        Even readers of the Daily Mail are backing the anti-avoidance protests - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ens-taxes.html

        It may have started off about fees, but it's exploded into something much much bigger than that. The tax avoidance/evasion issue is a tricky one for thd political classes and the corporate media to handle because:

        - Of the scale of the problem already aclnowledged by the public
        - The fact that no one can be seen to be "backing crime"
        - The repeated line of "We're all in this together" being inconsistent with the high-level tax avoidance - ie the offshore stuff
        - The grassroots nature of the movement making "leaders" very hard to target - because there aren't any.

        The fact that UKuncut has adopted the brand "Big Society Revenue & Customs" - & taking the Coalition's mantra of stepping in where the state cannot or will not take action, is taking "Big Society" in a totally different direction - none which any of us policy-wonks saw coming. Ditto with the pathetic attempts by the "Taxpayers' "Show us who's funding you" Alliance's attempts to recreate a "teaparty" movement against high taxes. They've got the movement - only it's around the issue of tax avoidance & tax evasion. The "other" Taxpayers' Alliance have been in stitches all afternoon.
        Offline

        2
        ReputationRep:
        Managers don't toss burgers, pillock. :rolleyes:

        (Nevertheless, the minimum salary is still below £21,000 and the maximum isn't much over.)
        Offline

        0
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by jismith1989)
        Managers don't toss burgers, pillock. :rolleyes:

        (Nevertheless, the minimum salary is still below £21,000 and the maximum isn't much over.)
        Good grief; do you know anything about how McDonald's operates? My brother was a manager in a branch for about 2 years and I can assure you, he did plenty of 'tossing'.
        Offline

        2
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by D.R.E)
        Good grief; do you know anything about how McDonald's operates? My brother was a manager in a branch for about 2 years and I can assure you, he did plenty of 'tossing'.
        Fair enough -- though obviously that surely wasn't his primary job, since he wouldn't have been paid more than everyone else, if he weren't doing much different than them. This is how the website describes the role: "You'll be setting targets, managing budgets, controlling stock as well as recruiting, training and inspiring your employees."

        My second point still stands anyway. And sorry for calling you a pillock: I'm in an unusually aggressive mood today.
        Offline

        0
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by jismith1989)
        Fair enough -- though obviously that surely wasn't his primary job, since he wouldn't have been paid more than everyone else, if he weren't doing much different than them. This is how the website describes the role: "You'll be setting targets, managing budgets, controlling stock as well as recruiting, training and inspiring your employees."

        My second point still stands anyway. And sorry for calling you a pillock: I'm in an unusually aggressive mood today.
        No problem. As for the job description, that's certainly what they say; but there is a lot more involved in store management than just filling in forms and such. You actually need to know what each of the roles that your employees are doing is about, so usually they start off your training at the bottom; doing that menial work that the normal employees do, and then move you up gradually till you're running a shop on your own.

        Even then though, you do need to get involved in some of the work on the floor on busy days - it's a fun job IMO.
        • Offline

          13
          (Original post by Quady)
          You don't have to go you know...
          Granted - I'm already there - and dont hit the line 'well why the **** are you interested?' - People arent forced to go, - but Greed shouldnt be used to deter students. - Can the government justify 27 grand degrees? - Can you?
          Offline

          17
          ReputationRep:
          (Original post by Matthew_Lowson)
          Granted - I'm already there - and dont hit the line 'well why the **** are you interested?' - People arent forced to go, - but Greed shouldnt be used to deter students. - Can the government justify 27 grand degrees? - Can you?
          Its justified if people sign up to going (which is why I asked if you weren't now going to go).

          People said before topup fees that applications would reduce, they haven't.

          What are you using for your basis that £4,500/year would be good value but above that wouldn't be?

          If students can't justify paying their fees to themselevs how can the Govt justify paying them?
          Offline

          0
          ReputationRep:
          (Original post by Martyn*)
          Take into consideration that I'm not earning a wage.
          OP.. I do empathise with your situation, HOWEVER it is the situation that by going into higher education for three or more years instead of straight into work the student protestors are hoping to avoid. So that effort then to end up 'flipping workers' or on JSA as yourself PLUS in debt would be something of a triple whammy.

          May I ask did you go uni or just left college/made redundant from post college job?
          You seem unusually bitter about students from someone of presumably a similar age group.
          • Offline

            13
            (Original post by Quady)
            Its justified if people sign up to going (which is why I asked if you weren't now going to go).

            People said before topup fees that applications would reduce, they haven't.

            What are you using for your basis that £4,500/year would be good value but above that wouldn't be?

            If students can't justify paying their fees to themselevs how can the Govt justify paying them?
            Its frightening - some folk clearly aint safe to walk the streets.

            JUSTIFY GREED - SIMPLE - COME ON, JUSTIFY THE GREED OF A GOVERNMENT MAKING THEIR OWN SAVING

            We are not going to get any higher standard are we? So why should students pay 9 grand? When they can expect the same standards as someone paying 3 GRAND?

            A simple polite request, JUSTIFY GREED, and then I think everyone will fall behind you. -

            The only reason I'd say £4500 would be decent is because of the rise of the barrier by 40% - That is the only concession I would make - TO ENSURE STUDENTS HAVE A FAIR DEAL. -

            Justify the greed of the government - I urge you
            Offline

            17
            ReputationRep:
            (Original post by Matthew_Lowson)
            Its frightening - some folk clearly aint safe to walk the streets.

            JUSTIFY GREED - SIMPLE - COME ON, JUSTIFY THE GREED OF A GOVERNMENT MAKING THEIR OWN SAVING

            We are not going to get any higher standard are we? So why should students pay 9 grand? When they can expect the same standards as someone paying 3 GRAND?

            A simple polite request, JUSTIFY GREED, and then I think everyone will fall behind you. -

            The only reason I'd say £4500 would be decent is because of the rise of the barrier by 40% - That is the only concession I would make - TO ENSURE STUDENTS HAVE A FAIR DEAL. -

            Justify the greed of the government - I urge you
            What greed? Surely its greedy of potential students to expect the country to pay £9-10k/year for a degree they would not themselves to be prepared to pay £7k/year for.

            Secondly your £4,500 figure makes no sense, the threshold remained the same when fees went up from £12,50 to £3,000 so by that logic you shouldn't have gone due to the Govts greed.

            Students have a choice, either they think its worth it and go, or don't so don't go.

            How is it unfair or greedy since there is a simple choice?

            (btw just to clarrify, it wasn't me that negged you so that much be someone else who thought that was a rubbish post)
           
           
           
        • See more of what you like on The Student Room

          You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

        • Poll
          Did TEF Bronze Award affect your UCAS choices?
          Useful resources

          Groups associated with this forum:

          View associated groups
        • See more of what you like on The Student Room

          You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

        • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

          Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

          Quick reply
          Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.