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    equality, no?

    did no-one see that inbetweeners episode? disabled people can be ****ers
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    (Original post by FyreFight)
    I'd assumed you were referring to this:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48wgxhSfQk8#t=0m43s
    Maybe next time you should bother to watch the video that's linked to in the very second post in the thread before commenting?
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    (Original post by RawJoh1)
    Maybe next time you should bother to watch the video that's linked to in the very second post in the thread before commenting?
    I prefer to assume people discussing current events threads have knowledge of what they're talking about without needing a specific video to discuss.

    If you weren't aware of the incident I was talking about then more fool you for trying to discuss it.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    No. I'm not being sarcastic. As I have indicated, the British Police are only less brutal than the Chinese because the law prevents them from being so. At heart, the British pigs are no better. If you armed them and directed them to use their own judgment the streets of London would be running red with the blood of history undergraduates.
    I doubt that, thats quite a generalisation to make about an entire workforce of people.

    At the first tuition fee protest when the rioters trashed tory HQ, they did pretty much nothing, just stood there and let them get on with it. What happens, the media cries 'police sit by and do nothing etc etc.'

    Now when they start to react to try and contain riots the media comes out with all these isolated stories of 'police brutality'.

    They are more or less in a lose lose situation and I don't envy them.
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    It isn't a surprise that the majority of the media, being vehemently anti-students at the moment haven't been keen to highlight this.
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    (Original post by FyreFight)
    I prefer to assume people discussing current events threads have knowledge of what they're talking about without needing a specific video to discuss.

    If you weren't aware of the incident I was talking about then more fool you for trying to discuss it.
    But evidently you didn't have knowledge of what you were talking about, seeing as everyone else in the thread was talking about the second incident between McIntyre and the Police, not the first. :banghead:
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    (Original post by Square)
    I doubt that, thats quite a generalisation to make about an entire workforce of people.

    At the first tuition fee protest when the rioters trashed tory HQ, they did pretty much nothing, just stood there and let them get on with it. What happens, the media cries 'police sit by and do nothing etc etc.'

    Now when they start to react to try and contain riots the media comes out with all these isolated stories of 'police brutality'.

    They are more or less in a lose lose situation and I don't envy them.
    Anyone would think that there was some sort of middle ground between "permitting criminal damage" and "dragging a disabled man who isn't a threat to either people or property from his wheelchair, when there was clearly no operational justification for that level of force" :eek:
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    (Original post by planetearth)
    It isn't a surprise that the majority of the media, being vehemently anti-students at the moment haven't been keen to highlight this.
    because its a bit of a nonstory.

    All the info i have seen about it has come from pro-student/anti establishment blogs.

    What I see in the video is someone in a wheelchair being arrested, not being beat **** out of by police with batons as you all say.
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    (Original post by RawJoh1)
    Anyone would think that there was some sort of middle ground between "permitting criminal damage" and "dragging a disabled man who isn't a threat to either people or property from his wheelchair, when there was clearly no operational justification for that level of force" :eek:
    Well this at best, could be considered an isolated case of 'police brutality'. I refuse to believe that police presence always stirs up violence, there was very little police at the millbank protest but plenty of vandalism and violence.

    its not like in cuba, where police break up student protests armed with assault rifles with fixed bayonets.
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    (Original post by Square)
    because its a bit of a nonstory.

    All the info i have seen about it has come from pro-student/anti establishment blogs.

    What I see in the video is someone in a wheelchair being arrested, not being beat **** out of by police with batons as you all say.
    Watch the video linked in the second post in the thread, and earlier by me. McIntyre isn't arrested. The Police drag him out of his wheelchair, drag him across the floor and then run off when confronted by other protesters.
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    (Original post by Square)
    Well this at best, could be considered an isolated case of 'police brutality'. I refuse to believe that police presence always stirs up violence, there was very little police at the millbank protest but plenty of vandalism and violence.

    its not like in cuba, where police break up student protests armed with assault rifles with fixed bayonets.
    I don't think that police presence always stirs up violence. I was just taking issue with your silly claim that the police are damned if they do, damned if they don't. If they conduct themselves properly I've no problem with them, they do a difficult job. But the ones that shame the uniform should feel the full force of the law. Far too often that doesn't happen.
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    (Original post by RawJoh1)
    I don't think that police presence always stirs up violence. I was just taking issue with your silly claim that the police are damned if they do, damned if they don't. If they conduct themselves properly I've no problem with them, they do a difficult job. But the ones that shame the uniform should feel the full force of the law. Far too often that doesn't happen.
    How do you think they should deal with such scale protests that turn ugly then? They can't just sit back and do nothing obviously some action needs to be taken to contain and disperse.

    The same thing seems to happen, protesters spend hours winding up the police, throwing missiles, shouting, trying to break police lines, then when the police react, they turn on the cameras, someone gets a bash to the head, or a graze from falling over and they go crying to the guardian.

    Like I say, I think you will be struggling to find a police force anywhere else in the world that has to deal with such protests and does so with such restraint. (In France during the pension riots police were armed with pump action shotguns, side arms and flash grenades, NI they use water cannons, America? Russia? Any far east/eastern european country? I wouldn't bet on it.)
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    (Original post by Square)
    How do you think they should deal with such scale protests that turn ugly then? They can't just sit back and do nothing obviously some action needs to be taken to contain and disperse.

    The same thing seems to happen, protesters spend hours winding up the police, throwing missiles, shouting, trying to break police lines, then when the police react, they turn on the cameras, someone gets a bash to the head, or a graze from falling over and they go crying to the guardian.

    Like I say, I think you will be struggling to find a police force anywhere else in the world that has to deal with such protests and does so with such restraint. (In France during the pension riots police were armed with pump action shotguns, side arms and flash grenades, NI they use water cannons, America? Russia? Any far east/eastern european country? I wouldn't bet on it.)
    I don't have a problem with the broad way that they deal with it now (I am unsure about kettling, though I don't have any strong views on it either way). The police can use reasonable force to protect people and property. All that is fine and dandy, I do have a problem with the way some particular officers conduct themselves, and how the police establishment routinely fails to bring these officers to justice.

    Look, this thread is about what happened to Jody McIntyre in particular. Do you agree that in the second incident, he was clearly handled with disproportionate force?
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    (Original post by RawJoh1)
    I don't have a problem with the broad way that they deal with it now (I am unsure about kettling, though I don't have any strong views on it either way). The police can use reasonable force to protect people and property. All that is fine and dandy, I do have a problem with the way some particular officers conduct themselves, and how the police establishment routinely fails to bring these officers to justice.

    Look, this thread is about what happened to Jody McIntyre in particular. Do you agree that in the second incident, he was clearly handled with disproportionate force?
    Well, given we don't know what he was doing before the incident I dont think we can really say. Just because hes disabled doesnt make him immune from arrest etc. I've heard some people saying he was asked to move out of the way so police horses could get past etc. if he refused/his brother refused to move him several times, then I would say it was appropriate. If they did it for no reason then obviously it wasn't appropriate.

    Given that he has still to launch a formal complaint I find it slightly fishy, this happened a good few days ago now, so surely if he was so innocent he would be persuing this?

    I have to say his BBC interview imo made him come across as a bit of a prat, the question from the interviewer was pretty neutral to be honest, and managing to drop in the age old mythical BBC israel bias as well.
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    (Original post by Square)
    Well, given we don't know what he was doing before the incident I dont think we can really say. Just because hes disabled doesnt make him immune from arrest etc. I've heard some people saying he was asked to move out of the way so police horses could get past etc. if he refused/his brother refused to move him several times, then I would say it was appropriate. If they did it for no reason then obviously it wasn't appropriate.
    Appropriate action would not be to drag him away. Appropriate action would be to try to wheel him away. If for whatever reason this proves impossible then and only then it might be permissable for the Police to act how they acted.

    Given that he has still to launch a formal complaint I find it slightly fishy, this happened a good few days ago now, so surely if he was so innocent he would be persuing this?
    He's apparently taking legal advice. We'll see what come of it (I suspect he's got the same amount of faith that most people have in internal police reviews, ie. no faith at all)
    I have to say his BBC interview imo made him come across as a bit of a prat, the question from the interviewer was pretty neutral to be honest, and managing to drop in the age old mythical BBC israel bias as well.
    Disagree here, if we're talking about the Ben Brown interview. I think he handled himself brilliantly, though I agree that mentioning Israel/Palestine was tactically foolish.

    He was completely right to point out that he posed absolutely zero threat to officers, and that nothing he did justified his treatment. Brown looked like an idiot pursuing that line in my view.
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    (Original post by FyreFight)
    You're showing your inexperience there. Obviously, you've never been at the front of a protest. It's the most dangerous of all possible places to be in a crowd, particularly regarding trampling. When the crowd surges, which direction does it surge toward?

    He wasn't physically abused. He was removed - albeit forcefully - from a very dangerous situation and one where the police were responsible for his safety. He suffered no injury at the hands of the police and the fact that he came away from the day in one piece could potentially be heavily attributed to them.
    Have you even looked at the video? There was no crowd being kettled and thus no surging forward.

    So you think that pulling a 'cripple' out of his wheechair and dragging him face down along the road is a sign of a caring police force?

    People who try to defend the indefensible by the use of sophistry make me want to puke, if truth be known. :mad:

    What is this country coming to when we have a government that cannot protect the vulnerable because they're too busy giving vent to their bully-boy instincts?

    Originally Posted by Aj12
    Wow two incidents? Wow thats enough evidence to make a judgement about the entire police force and how they would gun down crowds of people.
    There was another incident reported on TV tonight that evidences the pervading attitude of the police force that they can do whatever they like, regardless of the consequences, and not be called to account for it.

    A police man driving an unmarked police car was travelling at 57mph with no excuse on a two lane road. A car in heavy traffic coming from the opposite direction was hit by the police car and the woman was killed leaving two children motherless.

    The witnesses said that the woman driver was within the land marking for her side of the road and that the approaching police car was straddling the lane causing the resultant impact.

    Despite the policeman having no witnesses to corroborate his story that the other driver veered across the lane causing the impact, he was found not guilty.

    Where is the justice when several witnesses accounts relate the same story and they are ignored in favour of the accused with no witnesses? There isn't any...police are literally getting away with murder and subsequently are losing all respect from fair-minded citizens.

    One can cite innumerable cases on a local basis where this sort of abuse of power occurs daily. Unfortunately, they are not isolated incidents.

    Originally Posted by Ministerdonut
    That is what you would expect of a government broadcasting service? The government could at anytime stop the BBC's monopoly by having an american system of networks and advertising (Which I would prefer being a huge fox fan and because of the liberal left bias of the state),

    So the BBC has to essentially be very careful about criticising state organs. I guarantee if we have television networks you would get certain networks being far more open minded about the actions of the police and protestors.

    I have no idea why the left like the BBC so much, it is controlled by the government and they like to bring the heavys in if you don't sign up to their licensing scam. Have your cake and eat it in my opinion.
    I'm not entirely convinced that the 'left' like the BBC any more than the 'right' do.

    Irregardless, all this ^ and yet the government and the BBC vehemently deny partisanship and claim total independence...although I must admit that even a right-wing Sky News is more impartial than the BBCwhen it comes to this particular incident.

    I really think that Theresa May should resign immediately since she has no control over the Police force.
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    (Original post by Square)
    because its a bit of a nonstory.

    All the info i have seen about it has come from pro-student/anti establishment blogs.

    What I see in the video is someone in a wheelchair being arrested, not being beat **** out of by police with batons as you all say.
    Would you say that police putting a man's head through a glass door is a form of being arrested?
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    the Police around westminster are nothing but hired goons for the political elite. I have personal experience of their disgusting attitude. I was threatened with arrest outside the houses of parliament, and when I enquired what for the goon said he'd make something up on the way!

    They don't want people protesting, they don't want people holding them to account, they don't want you to exercise your democratic right!

    They want the power all for themselves!
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    Interesting that one of my posts earlier in the thread has been deleted with no explanation, despite the fact I didn't say anything that was either unreasonable or (to my knowledge) in violation of site terms of service.

    In any case, I said the following:
    (Original post by RawJoh1)
    Maybe if the Police establishment didn't repeatedly close ranks and lie about its operations (eg. claiming that de Menezes was running away when he just boarded a tube train like a normal person. Or claiming that Ian Tomlinson had had no contact with the Police, when in fact he had been brutally assaulted by them), people wouldn't be so quick to think badly of them.

    Just a thought, y'know ...
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    If he had been asked to leave, and refused to do so, this was probably the best option available to the police. If they had simply wheeled him away, they would have been accused of insulting his dignity - and I would imagine they would not be too happy about pushing a man in a wheelchair through a crowd, when any metal object can potentially become a weapon. Much safer to drag him out like they would any other person and then reunite him with his wheelchair.


    Very difficult to comment until we hear the justification anyway
 
 
 
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