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Why isn't Wenger under any real pressure to deliver trophies? Watch

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    (Original post by slawaccess23)
    Wenger's excuses sometimes are laughable and sadly repetitive. He says that they are still young, and then gets even younger players in the starting line-up. His post-match comments are cringeworthy at times.
    Monday was a bad one. The state of the pitch? One only wonders what he'll say after Barcelona
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    (Original post by hass147)
    He is under pressure to deliver trophies. But I could be under pressure and be well up for fighting David Haye, truth is he'd batter the absolute crap out of me. It's easier said than done. His more positive attitude towards the Carling Cup this year was a surprise.


    Wenger maybe, but making out Arsenal fans in general are the same? That's asinine.

    The supporters know it's a results business just as well as anyone.

    Knock the home support as much as you want, it's a poor atmosphere. The away fans however are always in great voice.

    I was mostly joking about the Arsenal support, although there are a disproportionate number of arrogant, entitled types among them, or at least that's what I've noticed in my various interactions.

    And the away fans defence is hideously overdone, and it doesn't excuse a poor home support at all. Admittedly, part of this may be due to the new 'superstadiums' which don't seem to be conducive to a more passionate atmosphere (CoMS as well as the Emirates, awful compared to Maine Road), but it doesn't change the fact that if you listened intently, you could conceivably hear a pigeon fart reverberate around Highbury.
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    Song is an example of idiocy on Wenger's behalf. Despite having the blueprint for a successful team in his hands when creating the invincibles, he decides to get this one legged donkey that forgets his position and gallops upfield. Clichy has also been a player that gets through games with no-one realising the team would be better off with 10 men and that **** back in France. £10 mil for Koscielny + £16 mil for Arshavin is also proof of Wenger's inability to spend big sums properly. For £6 mil you could have had Vidic and for £12 mil you could have had C. Ronaldo.

    But at the end of the day...its jokes watching these pretenders play football, so long may it remain.
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    (Original post by a_t)
    Monday was a bad one. The state of the pitch? One only wonders what he'll say after Barcelona
    'Next year my players will have more experience and maturity.....'
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    (Original post by Kevmeister)
    'Next year my players will have more experience and maturity.....'
    whilst throwing in some of his beloved mental strength statements.
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    (Original post by white_haired_wizard)
    whilst throwing in some of his beloved mental strength statements.
    Those are the classic ones. I wonder where those statements go when push comes to shove.
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    (Original post by Louis.)
    They delude themselves into taking some kind of moral high ground because they keep the ball on the floor and don't spend as much money as other teams, thus making themselves the "moral winners". This, of course, is the most important thing, and in comparison real "success" and "trophies" mean nothing.
    You do make valid comments, to a degree. However, there is an understandable reluctance at some teams to throw loads of money into buying new players, especially when a team like Man City can spend far more and bring in higher quality players to increase their chances of achieving (bought) success.

    Teams like Man United, Arsenal and Liverpool do not have the finances that Chelsea and (especially) Manchester City have - it's therefore a dispiriting set of circumstances really, depending upon who your allegiance is with...

    I also believe Arsenal's players do need to 'man up' more, grow some balls, stop pissing about with the ball and be more ruthless and clinical with possession. Too often they dilly-dally and don't achieve an end product, e.g. they should have beaten Chelsea at The Bridge earlier this season but didn't because of the aforementioned.
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    (Original post by The Great Ali)
    Song is an example of idiocy on Wenger's behalf. Despite having the blueprint for a successful team in his hands when creating the invincibles, he decides to get this one legged donkey that forgets his position and gallops upfield.

    Are you joking? Song is one of the best players we have at Arsenal and helped us out a great deal last season. He's extremely underrated. Only this season has he started to roam forward and that's only because he has been told to do so by Arsene Wenger. Whilst I do think he should stick to defensive, it's not exactly his fault if that's what he is being told to do.

    And you neglect to mention that Wenger only paid £1 million. However bad you perceive Song to be, he is certainly worth more than £1 million now. Hardly idiocy.
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    (Original post by W.H.T)
    Yeah you're absolutely right, if by 'match', you mean where theres only one team playing.
    There's more to playing than attacking, and there's more to a good match than a lot of goals.

    (Original post by white_haired_wizard)
    You do make valid comments, to a degree. However, there is an understandable reluctance at some teams to throw loads of money into buying new players, especially when a team like Man City can spend far more and bring in higher quality players to increase their chances of achieving (bought) success.

    Teams like Man United, Arsenal and Liverpool do not have the finances that Chelsea and (especially) Manchester City have - it's therefore a dispiriting set of circumstances really, depending upon who your allegiance is with...

    I also believe Arsenal's players do need to 'man up' more, grow some balls, stop pissing about with the ball and be more ruthless and clinical with possession. Too often they dilly-dally and don't achieve an end product, e.g. they should have beaten Chelsea at The Bridge earlier this season but didn't because of the aforementioned.
    I don't think you can put our financial power on the same level as Liverpool's and especially Arsenal's, we have spent an awful lot of money in recent seasons. Maybe not as much as Chelsea a few seasons ago and especially City but if you went through our squad it's hardly cheap. It doesn't feel as "manufactured" (don't like the term but it'll do) as Chelsea's was or City's (probably) will be because we've had the likes of Giggs and Scholes play an important role, but the CL winning side and the season just after had Ferdinand, Carrick, Nani, Anderson, Hargreaves, Berbatov, Rooney and the like, all costing the best part of £20mil. I'm under no illusions that a massive factor in our success was spending. It has changed a bit since Ronaldo left though.
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    (Original post by Louis.)
    There's more to playing than attacking, and there's more to a good match than a lot of goals.



    I don't think you can put our financial power on the same level as Liverpool's and especially Arsenal's, we have spent an awful lot of money in recent seasons. Maybe not as much as Chelsea a few seasons ago and especially City but if you went through our squad it's hardly cheap. It doesn't feel as "manufactured" (don't like the term but it'll do) as Chelsea's was or City's (probably) will be because we've had the likes of Giggs and Scholes play an important role, but the CL winning side and the season just after had Ferdinand, Carrick, Nani, Anderson, Hargreaves, Berbatov, Rooney and the like, all costing the best part of £20mil. I'm under no illusions that a massive factor in our success was spending. It has changed a bit since Ronaldo left though.
    I wasn't putting our financial power on the same level as Liverpool and Arsenal's - I was just making the point that these particular teams, recent and/or present title contenders, do not have the same amount of money as Chelsea and especially Manchester City.

    At United, we developed our foundations/success over years and years. Not half as manufactured a success as City's will be - success for them seems almost inevitable, it just won't be especially palatable to some people.
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    (Original post by Louis.)
    There's more to playing than attacking, and there's more to a good match than a lot of goals.
    Well, theres more to football than just camping in your own half.
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    Arsenal will win the Carling cup this year, but I think the board are extremely happy with the way Wenger is managing the club to be fair. He is getting us right near the finals of some competitions, which generates alot.
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    (Original post by W.H.T)
    Well, theres more to football than just camping in your own half.
    Yes, and the best attacking side in the world* attacking the best defensive one* made for an enthralling game.

    *pretty much
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    (Original post by Aodhán)
    Are you joking? Song is one of the best players we have at Arsenal and helped us out a great deal last season. He's extremely underrated. Only this season has he started to roam forward and that's only because he has been told to do so by Arsene Wenger. Whilst I do think he should stick to defensive, it's not exactly his fault if that's what he is being told to do.

    And you neglect to mention that Wenger only paid £1 million. However bad you perceive Song to be, he is certainly worth more than £1 million now. Hardly idiocy.
    I'm sure you'll agree he's not of the quality to be playing for a team with title aspirations. I don't think you can shift all of the blame to Wenger, Song was born stupid. As for Denilson...
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    cos its all about the money baby
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    Wenger is under immense pressure, OP. These last 2 years, since the 07/08 season where we were very close to winning the league, Arsenal fans have been vocal in their criticisms of him. It's a strange situation to be in, a mixture of circumstance and 'stubbornness' in my opinion. I think Wenger's plan was a long-term one in which, from the beginning of the new stadium discussions, he felt that he was no longer going to spend money on established players (to help stadium funding) but rather produce an 'organic' squad whereby his team would grow together and eventually produce results. I think this was his theory and felt he had produced enough domestically to think he could do this. And to be fair to the man, I would say he was very close in achieving this in '08. However, there have clearly been clinks in his plans. I am more than positive, for example, that Wenger didn't foresee Flamini leaving once he produced his best season in his career, and the same could be said of Hleb. There was also the Rosicky injury putting him out for two years. This, I would all put under circumstance. Nonetheless, things get fishy when Wenger says there's no money to spend on new players whilst board members are clearly saying the opposite! And here I think is where Wenger has been blinded by stubbornness. Wenger has become so blinded in this little 'project' - wanting to create a team who were bought for such little amounts (compared to rivals), who grew up together like a 'family' all being on the same wavelength and playing the same way etc - that he's forgotten everything else; he's forgotten the Chelsea's of the world who can buy any player they want, no expenses kept back.

    Wenger is a romantic. He lives in a visionary world of his own. I can understand that of course, who wouldn't want to watch a team built with players from the same age group, all having known each other for years and play amazing football, and eventually winning trophies with such attractive football! It would be historic. Problem is, it's too perfect a world and, in this modern age, it's an impossible task. I think Arsenal fans are split between those wanting Wenger to carry on trying to produce this perfect team, or getting as close to it as possible, thus putting trophies on the backfoot for a while OR those that need a new person to come in and spray some realism back into the club. So, I believe it's a delicate position for most Arsenal fans and perhaps why, although there are people who want Wenger to go, those voices are heavily muffled by those that want him to stay.

    That's my take on it anyway.
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    (Original post by The Great Ali)
    Song is an example of idiocy on Wenger's behalf. Despite having the blueprint for a successful team in his hands when creating the invincibles, he decides to get this one legged donkey that forgets his position and gallops upfield. Clichy has also been a player that gets through games with no-one realising the team would be better off with 10 men and that **** back in France. £10 mil for Koscielny + £16 mil for Arshavin is also proof of Wenger's inability to spend big sums properly. For £6 mil you could have had Vidic and for £12 mil you could have had C. Ronaldo.

    But at the end of the day...its jokes watching these pretenders play football, so long may it remain.
    So you pick out two big name signings, one of which carried Arsenal to the CL 2 years ago when he joined and another who's been at the club for 4 months. For 17m you could have had Hargreaves, for 28m you could have had Veron.

    I like how you blame Song when Wenger has come out and admitted that he instructs Song to go forward, obvious to anyone who has a ****ing clue about football. You think Song suddenly thinks he's Zidane over the summer? lol idiot
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    (Original post by Economist)
    So you pick out two big name signings, one of which carried Arsenal to the CL 2 years ago when he joined and another who's been at the club for 4 months. For 17m you could have had Hargreaves, for 28m you could have had Veron.

    I like how you blame Song when Wenger has come out and admitted that he instructs Song to go forward, obvious to anyone who has a ****ing clue about football. You think Song suddenly thinks he's Zidane over the summer? lol idiot
    What do you mean by 'carried Arsenal to the CL'? Hargreaves actually won the CL with Utd, btw..... Veron won a PL title with Utd, which is more than can be said of any current Arsenal player, but y'know, you get what you pay for.
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    It's worth noting Arsenal took out a lot of debt to build the Emirates and redevelop Highbury, so for a period it was far from certain how that would fair out for the club's finances (it turned out well in the end), plus Wenger was very close to ex-shareholder/chairman David Dein. He also has an Economics background. I guess these have all led to him adopting a more prudent/sustainable spending policy than other managers. But from the shareholders view, he adds a lot of value to the club.
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    Is that how Arsenal play these days? I remember when it was them that were the cynical over-defensive ones everyone hated. I like Wenger's ship but I'm also baffled as to how he's lasted so long. Of course, this is how football should really be; these days the shareholders (and fans) are all about insta-success and if they don't get it it's the manager that takes the rap.
 
 
 
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