How will religious people explain aliens, if we ever meet any? Watch

-Liberty
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#41
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#41
(Original post by mangatardallys)
If we were to come into contact with other life, how would religion explain it?
There are more than five religions. There are religions that believe aliens exist you know?
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feenicks89
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#42
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#42
(Original post by -Liberty)
There are more than five religions. There are religions that believe aliens exist you know?
Scientology lol


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Three Mile Sprint
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#43
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Most of them would be just fine, Hindus have insisted for millennia that there is life on other planets.
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callum9999
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#44
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(Original post by Farm_Ecology)
It wouldnt. Its because of relativity and the way speed affects space and time. If you were to speed up relative to an observer, the time that passes for you, would be less than that of the observer.


If you imagine a transparent spaceship, and the observer watches it travel by at near the speed of light. If a torch were to be shone inside the spaceship towards the front, the observer would only see the photons of the light beam (theoretically) travel at the speed of light relative to the observer, which would only be a fraction faster than the spaceship itself. To the observer the photons would appear to travel at the speed of light minus the speed of the spaceship (relative to the observer), making it travel at (lets say) 1m/h. From the perspective of the spaceship however, the torch would appear travel at the speed of light. So less time has passed for the spaceship than the observer for the photons to reach the end of the spaceship. So less time passes from the perspective of spaceship, than the observer when a spaceship travels from point A to B, when moving at a fast speed relative to an observer.

Of course, in that situation, moving at the speeds would be nigh impossible, but the principles remain at slower speeds.

I'm no physicist so feel free for someone to correct me if I've misunderstood something.
Still don't get it! Surely you are just describing "illusions" and tricks of perspective. If the person on another planet started measuring from the time the ship left Earth till the time it reached them, I fail to see how it could possibly be any different to us measuring it (assuming we had a way to know the exact times it leaves and arrives).
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Farm_Ecology
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#45
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(Original post by callum9999)
Still don't get it! Surely you are just describing "illusions" and tricks of perspective. If the person on another planet started measuring from the time the ship left Earth till the time it reached them, I fail to see how it could possibly be any different to us measuring it (assuming we had a way to know the exact times it leaves and arrives).
Its because there is no such thing as absolute time. A person at the destination would likely describe a similar time as those on earth, but it would still be slightly different. The time at which time moves is dependent on the speed your moving relative to something else. If an astronaut takes an atomic clock on board a space ship, orbits the planet a few times while doing experiments, less time would have passed than an atomic clock left on earth.

Basically, it isn't a trick of perspective or an illusion (although you might be able to describe it as such), but space-time warps, and the amount of time which passes for the spaceship will be less then that of certain observers.
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Kaiser MacCleg
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#46
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(Original post by callum9999)
I don't get it? Surely the length of the trip would be exactly the same from their perspective as it is from our perspective?

(As in, if it takes a year of "our time" to get there, from their perspective it will take whatever their equivalent of one of our years is)
No. It's an observed fact that time passes at different speeds in different places, and this effect is also caused by differences in relative velocity. This effect is called time dilation, and is caused by the mass -and therefore the graitational pull- of an object distorting spacetime.



Time dilation can be observed in the differences between atomic clocks orbiting the Earth and those fixed to its surface: time travels faster in space than it does on the Earth. This is because the Earth's distorting effect on spacetime grows less as you travel away from it. This should, in theory, mean that astronauts in the ISS age faster than those on the ground. In fact, they age slower. This is because of the effect velocity has on time dilation. The ISS is travelling at something like 7km/s around the Earth, and this causes time to pass slower for the astronauts than it does for those in mission control. Increase the velocity you're travelling at, and that effect becomes more profound.

EDIT: Again, no physicist, so my explanation is almost certainly inadequate.
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Innominate
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#47
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#47
(Original post by mangatardallys)
If we were to come into contact with other life, how would religion explain it?
If you were to come in contact with God, how would you explain it?
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Kaiser MacCleg
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#48
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(Original post by Sai4)
If you were to come in contact with God, how would you explain it?
If it were proven beyond reasonable doubt that it was God we were speaking to, I would explain it by saying we are speaking to God.

Evidence. 'Tis a wonderful thing.
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-Liberty
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#49
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(Original post by feenicks89)
Scientology lol


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Ah lol I wasn't even thinking of them!
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callum9999
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#50
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(Original post by Kaiser MacCleg)
No. It's an observed fact that time passes at different speeds in different places, and this effect is also caused by differences in relative velocity. This effect is called time dilation, and is caused by the mass -and therefore the graitational pull- of an object distorting spacetime.



Time dilation can be observed in the differences between atomic clocks orbiting the Earth and those fixed to its surface: time travels faster in space than it does on the Earth. This is because the Earth's distorting effect on spacetime grows less as you travel away from it. This should, in theory, mean that astronauts in the ISS age faster than those on the ground. In fact, they age slower. This is because of the effect velocity has on time dilation. The ISS is travelling at something like 7km/s around the Earth, and this causes time to pass slower for the astronauts than it does for those in mission control. Increase the velocity you're travelling at, and that effect becomes more profound.

EDIT: Again, no physicist, so my explanation is almost certainly inadequate.

(Original post by Farm_Ecology)
Its because there is no such thing as absolute time. A person at the destination would likely describe a similar time as those on earth, but it would still be slightly different. The time at which time moves is dependent on the speed your moving relative to something else. If an astronaut takes an atomic clock on board a space ship, orbits the planet a few times while doing experiments, less time would have passed than an atomic clock left on earth.

Basically, it isn't a trick of perspective or an illusion (although you might be able to describe it as such), but space-time warps, and the amount of time which passes for the spaceship will be less then that of certain observers.
But we aren't talking about 2 separate events happening in 2 different areas, we're talking about 1 object moving between the 2 different areas. I'm sure I know less about this than both of you do, but I can't comprehend how 1 object moving a set distance can simultaneously take 2 different amounts of time to travel it. (To me) that's like saying this train is moving at 10mph and 20mph at the same time!
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Farm_Ecology
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(Original post by callum9999)
But we aren't talking about 2 separate events happening in 2 different areas, we're talking about 1 object moving between the 2 different areas. I'm sure I know less about this than both of you do, but I can't comprehend how 1 object moving a set distance can simultaneously take 2 different amounts of time to travel it. (To me) that's like saying this train is moving at 10mph and 20mph at the same time!
Its because there is no such thing as absolute time. An hour will be different from two different perspectives.
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Kaiser MacCleg
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#52
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(Original post by callum9999)
But we aren't talking about 2 separate events happening in 2 different areas, we're talking about 1 object moving between the 2 different areas. I'm sure I know less about this than both of you do, but I can't comprehend how 1 object moving a set distance can simultaneously take 2 different amounts of time to travel it. (To me) that's like saying this train is moving at 10mph and 20mph at the same time!
What is conducive to common sense doesn't matter. Fact is, if you stick a clock on an object that's moving sufficiently quickly and move it around for long enough, there will be an appreciable difference between the time that clock is reporting and the time shown by another clock that's remained stationary. I agree that it doesn't make sense, but the universe doesn't give a **** about what we think.
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SoNottingH
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#53
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(Original post by Three Mile Sprint)
Most of them would be just fine, Hindus have insisted for millennia that there is life on other planets.
Is that right, did they specify "other planets"? I thought the idea that there might be other worlds out there is a modern thing, other than perhaps in mystical-type language.
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Telecaster Steak
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#54
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(Original post by ash92:))
Does any religion explicitly state that this could not be the case?
Traditionally, yes, most religions have said that the Earth is the center of the universe and that the stars are just lights that God put in the sky etc.

However, religion tends to evolve as science and society progress and so few of them still state this.

I'm sure there are people in the bible belt that still believe such things.
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Mycroft Holmes
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#55
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#55
How will atheists explain angels, if we ever meet any?
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CJKay
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#56
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#56
(Original post by Perseveranze)
So much ignorance on this topic. Some people seem to have this dislexia whenever they try to talk about Islam.


(Original post by Mycroft Holmes)
How will atheists explain angels, if we ever meet any?
Same way we'd explain unicorns if we ever met any: "should probably wake up now".
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Three Mile Sprint
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#57
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(Original post by SoNottingH)
Is that right, did they specify "other planets"? I thought the idea that there might be other worlds out there is a modern thing, other than perhaps in mystical-type language.
Pretty cut and clear from all the Vedic text's ive read, Hinduism is very clear that the universe is billions of years old, that there are millions of forms of life, millions of different planets and life living on them as well.

Google is your friend if you need to verify any of it.
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Kaiser MacCleg
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#58
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#58
(Original post by Mycroft Holmes)
How will atheists explain angels, if we ever meet any?
Easy.
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SoNottingH
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#59
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(Original post by Three Mile Sprint)
Pretty cut and clear from all the Vedic text's ive read, Hinduism is very clear that the universe is billions of years old, that there are millions of forms of life, millions of different planets and life living on them as well.

Google is your friend if you need to verify any of it.
Hmmm.... Google shows a lot of links to quite dodgy-sounding contemporary alternative pages, like David Eicke's sites. It sounds very unlikely that the ancient Vedas accurately described this, didn't they have an astrology based on only five planets? It would be great to know which bits of text you are relying on, I can't quickly find anything definitive on the topic.

EDIT Are you by any chance talking about the "Lokas"? These are plainly not meant to be literal descriptions of other planets, they refer to mystical states of being or something like that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loka
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Farm_Ecology
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(Original post by SoNottingH)
Hmmm.... Google shows a lot of links to quite dodgy-sounding contemporary alternative pages, like David Eicke's sites. It sounds very unlikely that the ancient Vedas accurately described this, didn't they have an astrology based on only five planets? It would be great to know which bits of text you are relying on, I can't quickly find anything definitive on the topic.

EDIT Are you by any chance talking about the "Lokas"? These are plainly not meant to be literal descriptions of other planets, they refer to mystical states of being or something like that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loka
Although I don't know much about Hinduism cosmology, I do know that hinduism as a religion is concerned with enlightenment, as is Buddhism. The beliefs change with time, and new sects arise and fall as new knowledge is garnered. In otherwords, the cosomology isn't essential the idea of Hinduism, but the idea that earth and humanity isnt the central point of creation means the idea of aliens on other planets fits very well with their philosophy.
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