Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

That's what she said,Women students experiences of 'lad culture' in higher education Watch

    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by pandabird)
    Really? I disagree, the word 'rape' is thrown around a lot. Listen to yourself, you're so irrational. Why is it so hard to agree that rape jokes are offensive? For both males and females, I've mentioned no gender here, you are completely unjust and wrong in that last line. This is not a gender battle.
    The word rape is thrown around a lot among a certain group of teenaged males. They are certainly not representative of society as a whole...

    I agree that rape jokes are offensive to some people. But I do not believe they encourage rape, and I do not believe we should ban them.

    I'm not wrong in that last line. Feminists exaggerate their points, and have even exaggerated statistics.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Kiss)
    The piece made three huge contradictions which highlight the hypocrisy of those who wish to 'ban lad culture':

    1. Lad Culture is assumed as a culture - The study which Kelly Temple has endeavoured to show is that we live in a multicultural society. This is contradictory to the nature of 'banning' lad culture then, if Temple makes lad culture a cultural difference within our society. And if she seriously expects people

    2. 'Empowering' through censorship- - Temple seems to think that silencing people from making jokes which are 'misogynistic and homophobic' and banning pages such as UniLad on medias is the right way to tackle lad culture, purely to marginalise the freedoms and liberties of those she disagrees with. There is the strong implication that media forms eg. Facebook sites such as UniLad or The Lad Bible should be removed. I think this goes against just about every notion of what freedom of expression means. She is a fascist, a hypocrite and simply cannot stand knowing someone is making a joke. Pages like these exist, but they aren't getting shoved in anyone's faces - if you don't like the humour of it then don't like the page and ignore it, no one is forcing you to look at it.


    3. Women need empowerment - If women need empowerment then this is feminism saying that it is weak. If you truly believe yourself equal to others then don't bring your own negative perceptions of your gender to the table when the chips are down. The whole article revels in the idea that quotas need to be met, but this ignores the idea that men will be marginalised in the process. What the hell ever happened to the idea of 'best person for the job'? By suggesting that employment should be based upon sex, Temple is only furthering sexism and creating a boundary between the sexes that stalls any equality. She is not interested in such an idea anyway.



    Whilst I don't always find the humour of Lad culture, I think the attempts to 'ban' it are pathetic and a poor, straw-man attempt at removing personal liberties and freedom of expression. Trying to remove the websites and Facebook pages is one thing, but the implication that jokes and personal conversations should be reported is incredibly totalitarian.
    Maybe you should actually read the article, it really does seem to take every factor into account. Also the author isn't giving away any of her own opinions, she's just quoting many different sources.

    I just finished the whole article and, when I didn't find any of what you said she said, I went ahead and searched your keywords just to be sure. None of the words "empower", "ban", and "censor" came up with results relevant to what you said.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by pandabird)
    No one mentioned freedoms of speech here. But equally, you have to allow people to be offended by it.
    I never said people shouldn't be allowed to be offended by it, what I object to is their attempts to ban it or otherwise censor humour.
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by pandabird)
    I believe joking about rape does increase a sort of mental tolerance of it. Same with racist jokes.
    Saying 'joking' at the end of a sentence makes it no less offensive. And it's a pathetic attempt at humour.

    But who are way to say such things, if after a survey, the majority of rape victims find it offensive and triggering (which I imagine they will) would you still condone it?
    There are jokes about pushing kids off swings, murder, theft etc. But is there any link between them? No, such thinking suggests that making jokes in a presumably jokey environment makes people more likely to do such actions and more tolerant to it. I've heard plenty of jokes involving punching someone in the face but I lack the resolve to actually do that. Jeez.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by bottled)
    There are jokes about pushing kids off swings, murder, theft etc. But is there any link between them? No, such thinking suggests that making jokes in a presumably jokey environment makes people more likely to do such actions and more tolerant to it. I've heard plenty of jokes involving punching someone in the face but I lack the resolve to actually do that. Jeez.
    No, I don't think rape jokes lead to rape. That's not what I said, or intended.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by insignificant)
    Here is the link to an NUS study into women student experiences at University with regard to the 'lad' culture. It is incredibly insightful, has anyone else read it?
    http://www.nus.org.uk/Global/Campaig...inal%20web.pdf
    This report is ridiculous

    1) Apparently when women doing (ladettes) it is apparently her going against being feminine:rolleyes:. Stupid, stupid report. I think the idea of feminism is to remove "masculine and "feminine" stereotypes, surely?

    2) Then it goes on to say that the sexual liberation is sexist because most women are giving men sexual pleasure by reviving sexual pleasure from men, when they should be doing it with women :facepalm: seriously when I read that, I knew from then on that this book was wrote by a lesbian leading me to believe this text is misandric, seriously.

    3) it then goes on to tell us that child (physical or sexual) abuse against girls is worse because it has a "bigger effect" so it should be focused on more. brilliant report.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by pandabird)
    No, I don't think rape jokes lead to rape. That's not what I said, or intended.
    I re-read your comment, and right you are.
    Although I still disagree. People are simply more tolerant to rape jokes. Not the action of rape.
    Which is why people simply accused of rape face extreme stigma, even if found innocent at times. Some are murdered on jail, people face vigilante justice for simply being accused.

    I see a lack of tolerance to rape
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by miser)
    I have not read the part where it advocates 'banning lad culture'.
    I was speaking broadly about those who aim to ban lad culture indefinitely, but she made several indications that it should be, with one example being in her concluding statements that 'This suggests that the relationship between campus culture and ‘lad culture’ should be cause for concern.' This is taken within the context of the rest of the study, where it isn't just the relationship between lad culture and campus culture that she is concerned with.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by bahjat93)
    What is it with you females! You guys are always demanding equality when the current system is totally in favour of you guys!
    We spend far more money of Breast cancer then prostate cancer.
    We provide more help to single mums then we do to single dads.
    and now you guys want there to be a fairer female to male ratio in board rooms of multinational companies which i just find outrageous!

    The Lad culture at University exists, but have you guys ever thought why this is??
    Maybe because the current male students are unhappy with system!
    You seem to be prejudice in yourself in the fact that you think rape only happens to females, nowhere in any post have I stated that rape only happens to females, I am sticking up for VICTIMS of rape.
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by insignificant)
    You seem to be prejudice in yourself in the fact that you think rape only happens to females, nowhere in any post have I stated that rape only happens to females, I am sticking up for VICTIMS of rape.
    I haven't even mentioned the word Rape! What are you talking about??
    • Section Leader
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    Section Leader
    (Original post by Kiss)
    I was speaking broadly about those who aim to ban lad culture indefinitely, but she made several indications that it should be, with one example being in her concluding statements that 'This suggests that the relationship between campus culture and ‘lad culture’ should be cause for concern.' This is taken within the context of the rest of the study, where it isn't just the relationship between lad culture and campus culture that she is concerned with.
    That doesn't mean they would support banning it (I expect they're not naive enough to think they could do such a thing). Better is to do what this study is doing - i.e., analyse what it is and what its effects are, so that any negative effects may be ameliorated.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    I found that document very interesting! But I do not attend university (yet) and cannot comment on how prevalent this problem is. Although, if the document is accurate then I would be very worried by these sexist attitudes been displayed in the generations that are the future.
    • PS Helper
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    PS Helper
    (Original post by insignificant)
    You seem to be prejudice in yourself in the fact that you think rape only happens to females, nowhere in any post have I stated that rape only happens to females, I am sticking up for VICTIMS of rape.
    Rape is technically defined in UK law as a man forcing himself on a women and only upon a women.

    I am in two minds about this.

    I for one cringe when I hear people make jokes about rape, I don't find them particularly funny and I think that sometimes they are a little bit too disrespectful of the subject matter.
    On the other hand I think that culture is organic, the culture of laddism and initiations and all that stuff has, contrary to what the study says, been around since time immemorial.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by insignificant)
    You seem to be prejudice in yourself in the fact that you think rape only happens to females, nowhere in any post have I stated that rape only happens to females, I am sticking up for VICTIMS of rape.
    You've certainly implied it. But you're post isn't about rape victims, it's about Lad Culture.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    Has it ever occurred to anyone that a significant reason for the humour in rape jokes is to do with the fact that rape is not funny. Making light of very serious things is a key element in a lot of aspects of comedy. Is it possible that the reason rape jokes are jokes at all is because it's subverting the views most people hold about rape, that is, that it's a horrific thing to happen.

    E.g. Jokes about the holocaust. In bad taste yes, but they're found funny because somebody has made light about something very serious. It's our knowledge that this is a serious and horrible thing that makes the joke funny, it's not about people thinking that the holocaust wasn't that bad or anything like that. It's about people being perfectly aware that the holocaust is not a casual topic, it's serious. That is where the humour comes from.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by insignificant)
    Whilst I agree with you that there is the element of freedom of expression, and that this shouldn't be banned per se, I think the culture itself needs to be changed. I have been sexual assaulted twice, so has my best friend, and two of my girl cousins. The statistics of sexual assault are not shocking, and the 'liberalisation' of rape is becoming more and more evident. It's more and more acceptable for guys to talk about girls as if they are raping them, and then it's supposed to be funny. Something needs to be done about that, it's not funny, it's illegal and thats the point where freedom of expression for me, turns to something more sinister.
    It's easy to shout 'sexual assault' for just about any form of contact so what happened to you and your friend and cousins?
    A lad touching your bum? If so then the statistics are hardly shocking, that's hardly a sexual crime and it goes both ways?
    If something more serious than fair play for complaining...

    I hardly think LAD culture is to blame for sexual assaults though. They've happened long before this so called 'culture' existed.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by limetang)
    Has it ever occurred to anyone that a significant reason for the humour in rape jokes is to do with the fact that rape is not funny. Making light of very serious things is a key element in a lot of aspects of comedy. Is it possible that the reason rape jokes are jokes at all is because it's subverting the views most people hold about rape, that is, that it's a horrific thing to happen.

    E.g. Jokes about the holocaust. In bad taste yes, but they're found funny because somebody has made light about something very serious. It's our knowledge that this is a serious and horrible thing that makes the joke funny, it's not about people thinking that the holocaust wasn't that bad or anything like that. It's about people being perfectly aware that the holocaust is not a casual topic, it's serious. That is where the humour comes from.
    In my experience, the ones who usually complain about one specific joke are happy to laugh at or make jokes about something else in bad taste. I once had the unpleasant experience of encountering a radical feminist who seemed to think that jokes against women were unacceptable in all instances, but racist ones were perfectly fine. Now I can't generalise in all scenarios but 9/10 times there will be one topic they laugh at that would offend some other group of people. And when you pull them up about it their go to response is 'Oh get a grip! It's only a joke!'.

    I'd like to think that our society does not endorse double standards, but sadly that isn't the case, and nor will it ever be the case if they get their way in banning laddisms.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by insignificant)
    The statistics of sexual assault are not shocking, and the 'liberalisation' of rape is becoming more and more evident. It's more and more acceptable for guys to talk about girls as if they are raping them, and then it's supposed to be funny. Something needs to be done about that, it's not funny, it's illegal and thats the point where freedom of expression for me, turns to something more sinister.
    Being a lad has nothing to do with rape, this research makes a poor attempt at linking the two. I'll admit I haven't read all 80 pages, I wouldn't give it the time as what I did read was poor.

    This is feminists trying to find a way to reduce 'lad' culture by using the shock tactic of rape. It's on a par with using the race card, when someone had no intention of being racist.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Kiss)
    In my experience, the ones who usually complain about one specific joke are happy to laugh at or make jokes about something else in bad taste. I once had the unpleasant experience of encountering a radical feminist who seemed to think that jokes against women were unacceptable in all instances, but racist ones were perfectly fine. Now I can't generalise in all scenarios but 9/10 times there will be one topic they laugh at that would offend some other group of people. And when you pull them up about it their go to response is 'Oh get a grip! It's only a joke!'.

    I'd like to think that our society does not endorse double standards, but sadly that isn't the case, and nor will it ever be the case if they get their way in banning laddisms.
    To be honest I'd say that's true in a good majority of cases (by no means specific to rad fems). People will be offended by jokes on controversial topic X, but find it perfectly fine to laugh at jokes on controversial topic Y.
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Would you like to hibernate through the winter months?
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.