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    (Original post by Juichiro)
    Science has practical uses. Art does not. So if the scientific invention becomes famous is generally because it is useful. Artists can't say the same though.
    Art also has practical applications. It can be extremely practical in the sense of typography, the fonts of which you are typing in right now. And also design isn't just art but also problem solving. For example an artist/designer can take advantage of the way that the human brain processes an image and draw attention to details that are intended.

    When you navigate through a website the layouts are designed in a way that the brain can easily process without too much unnecessary confusion. Colours are used so that there is a sense of unity and consistency throughout the site to establish an identity within your head.

    Really art just makes things easier to look at. So that something are fundamental as 'looking' isn't a chore.
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    (Original post by Faberry)
    Google is a great friend, and verifies my point:

    "Imagination, also called the faculty of imagining, is the ability to form new images and sensations that are not perceived through sight, hearing, or other senses"

    Therefore, imagination is creation. Creation stems from creativity (in the form of imagination, for example), which results in art, be it an embryo or painting.
    Let me put it again.

    I can imagine something. But it does not necessarily have to be artistic. Einstein's theory of relativity is science not art.

    Imagination is indeed creation. But this creation is not necessarily art.
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    (Original post by Juichiro)
    Maybe. But most of the scientific inventions have a practical use. Does any artistic invention have a practical use?
    I think you need to explain a bit more just how broadly you're talking here. What do mean by an artist? A person that paints? Or are we lumping in with them designers, fashion designers, photographers, anyone that comes from a background in art?

    I'd say that "artistic inventions" such as the clothes that you wear, the packaging and advertising that persuades you into buying an item, the photos that you look at everyday whilst reading/watching the news, the websites that you use, the films and TV shows that you watch, all serve a useful purpose.
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    (Original post by Kat_woman)
    But you're just saying it without explaining it or backing it up. You're just regurgitating a load of bullet points instead of making it into a debate, or discussion.

    But anyway, art is very important to society. Art helps create and shape the world we live in, and it is a form of self expression. Art is almost magical, it;s the ability to create something out of purely your own head. Science just discovers. Art creates.
    Your initial reply: "Art is self expression and individuality which is just as important to society as science."

    My initial reply:

    "0. Self-expression is important to society. -> Your idea

    1. Art is self-expression. -> Your idea

    2. Self-expression is not necessarily art. -> My idea

    Thus,

    Conclusion: art is not as important to society as science."

    Elaboration in premise 2: I use my body daily to engage in acts of self-expression such as writing comments on Facebook or telling others how I feel. But this is not art. Hence not all self-expression is art.

    "art is very important to society. Art helps create and shape the world we live in" You are being very vague.

    "it;s the ability to create something out of purely your own head." that is imagination not art.

    "Science just discovers. Art creates." both science and art use imagination in different ways. What does "just discovers" mean? It seems dismissive. Art (and especially modern) is dependent on science, just a reminder.
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    (Original post by JimmyCL)
    1- Art also has practical applications. It can be extremely practical in the sense of typography, the fonts of which you are typing in right now. And also design isn't just art but also problem solving. For example an artist/designer can take advantage of the way that the human brain processes an image and draw attention to details that are intended.

    2-When you navigate through a website the layouts are designed in a way that the brain can easily process without too much unnecessary confusion. Colours are used so that there is a sense of unity and consistency throughout the site to establish an identity within your head.

    3-Really art just makes things easier to look at. So that something are fundamental as 'looking' isn't a chore.
    1- I can't see how this helps society.

    2- That sounds like visual cognition (see science).

    3. Good point.
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    (Original post by Cll_ws)
    I think you need to explain a bit more just how broadly you're talking here. What do mean by an artist? A person that paints? Or are we lumping in with them designers, fashion designers, photographers, anyone that comes from a background in art?

    I'd say that "artistic inventions" such as a)the clothes that you wear, b)the packaging and advertising that persuades you into buying an item, c)the photos that you look at everyday whilst reading/watching the news, d)the websites that you use, e)the films and TV shows that you watch, all serve a useful purpose.
    1. By artist I mean anyone that comes from a background in art.

    2. Maybe, but all those forms of art are possible thanks to science.

    a) Mechanical engineering.
    b) Psychology of choice.
    c) Electrical engineering.
    d) Computer science.
    e) Electrical engineering.

    Btw, my point was just for people to state their views on the question "Are artists attention seekers?".
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    (Original post by Juichiro)
    Your initial reply: "Art is self expression and individuality which is just as important to society as science."

    My initial reply:

    "0. Self-expression is important to society.

    1. Art is self-expression. -> Your idea

    2. Self-expression is not necessarily art. -> My idea

    Thus,

    Conclusion: art is not as important to society as science."

    Elaboration in premise 2: I use my body daily to engage in acts of self-expression such as writing comments on Facebook or telling others how I feel. But this is not art. Hence not all self-expression is art.

    "art is very important to society. Art helps create and shape the world we live in" You are being very vague.

    "it;s the ability to create something out of purely your own head." that is imagination not art.

    "Science just discovers. Art creates." both science and art use imagination in different ways. What does "just discovers" mean? It seems dismissive. Art (and especially modern) is dependent on science, just a reminder.
    I didn't say art was the ONLY type of self expression.

    Art can also help people through difficult times. It can be therapeutic and cathartic. Also people express themselves differently. Some of us express ourselves better through art than through writing, for example. So those are some practical uses. Art can inspire people to make changes. Someone seeing an artists work on a particular issue might feel inspires to help the issue.

    The architecture. The clothes we wear. The gardens. The office building. Cars. Art comes into all of it in a way

    I didn't mean to be dismissive, what I meant was art gives you the freedom to completely create something. Also, sometimes art is one of lifes luxuries. Like egyptian cotton sheets or the feeling when you get out of the bath
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    1-To elaborate the typography point. It forms the basis of the way that we're communicating right now, and it is strongly related to linguistics (which I guess you can call science? :P) But what I mean is that if someone wrote an incredibly profound thesis that can redefine the fundamental laws of physics, but it's in completely illegible handwriting then what's the point? Albeit we have computers and word processors nowadays, but who designed the fonts that we used?

    And in the case of designers/artist problem solving. Without it life wouldn't be anywhere near as convenient as it is now. Take example, architecture. Why design a house where the moment that you walk through the door is an open space, a living room? Why no dump a bed in there? It's illogical and very counter-intuitive.

    2- Yeah, it is... I guess art is an application often science/theory then? Making it important?

    3- Thank you

    PS. you come across as being very condescending, this may not be intended but its the vibe that I'm getting.

    EDIT: Btw digressing a bit. But to answer you question whether artists are attention seekers? Yes and no, you get the same kind of people in all fields of subjects. Btw I'm currently an A2 student studying Maths, Art, Physics and Further Maths.
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    personally i am pursuing art as a career, not at all for attention but because i enjoy creating it and want to be able to get by on doing the thing that i love (as well as another job or two to pay the rent, ha).
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    (Original post by Kat_woman)
    I didn't say art was the ONLY type of self expression.

    Art can also help people through difficult times. It can be therapeutic and cathartic. Also people express themselves differently. Some of us express ourselves better through art than through writing, for example. So those are some practical uses. Art can inspire people to make changes. Someone seeing an artists work on a particular issue might feel inspires to help the issue.

    The architecture. The clothes we wear. The gardens. The office building. Cars. Art comes into all of it in a way

    I didn't mean to be dismissive, what I meant was art gives you the freedom to completely create something. Also, sometimes art is one of lifes luxuries. Like egyptian cotton sheets or the feeling when you get out of the bath
    Fair points. Btw, sorry if I came across rude. I just get a little bit too excited when I type.
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    (Original post by JimmyCL)
    1-To elaborate the typography point. It forms the basis of the way that we're communicating right now, and it is strongly related to linguistics (which I guess you can call science? :P) But what I mean is that if someone wrote an incredibly profound thesis that can redefine the fundamental laws of physics, but it's in completely illegible handwriting then what's the point? Albeit we have computers and word processors nowadays, but who designed the fonts that we used?

    And in the case of designers/artist problem solving. Without it life wouldn't be anywhere near as convenient as it is now. Take example, architecture. Why design a house where the moment that you walk through the door is an open space, a living room? Why no dump a bed in there? It's illogical and very counter-intuitive.

    2- Yeah, it is... I guess art is an application often science/theory then? Making it important?

    3- Thank you

    PS. you come across as being very condescending, this may not be intended but its the vibe that I'm getting.
    1- Fair enough.

    Sorry about. I get a bit excited when I type.
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    (Original post by Faberry)
    Science cannot exist without art, especially in the subconscious minds and understanding. Think about that.
    That's so untrue it's funny. You should have seen my old physics teacher's whiteboard drawings.
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    you make it sound like its a bad thing...how dare they

    (Original post by Redolent)
    Pretty much all human beings are attention seekers. It's just that a lot of us are smart enough to not be too obvious and annoying about it.
    this...
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    Yes.

    But here's a thought... attention seeking isn't necessarily a negative thing. Its automatically put in a negative light as people see attention seeking as behaving in a negative way to gain any sort of attention, positive or negative. Everybody seeks attention of some sort to some degree... Attention seeking does not have to equal being a **** as people seem to assume.
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    Those who pretend to be artists are, those who are artists are not. So how to distinguish between art and attention-seeking-crap-a-4-year-old-could-do? The amount of talent it took to do it. If it was little, then it is a statement and not art. If a vast amount of skill, then it is art which might also make a statement.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    Those who pretend to be artists are, those who are artists are not. So how to distinguish between art and attention-seeking-crap-a-4-year-old-could-do? The amount of talent it took to do it. If it was little, then it is a statement and not art. If a vast amount of skill, then it is art which might also make a statement.
    Ever heard of minimalist art? They try to keep it simple.
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    (Original post by Juichiro)
    Maybe. But most of the scientific inventions have a practical use. Does any artistic invention have a practical use?
    Actually, a heck of a lot of science is totally useless as far as 'practical' applications go. In general, science is about understanding the world (universe) around us; it isn't all about engineering which is generally recognised as a separate discipline.

    At some stage you have to question how you interpret practical. I mean, my goals in life aren't just to survive and use convenience products; I also want to enjoy myself and expand my mind. Various art forms have a great 'practical' use for me since books, music, films etc. are tools I use to think and enjoy myself. On the other hand, the theory of say, cosmology isn't of any practical use to me since it doesn't interest me as much as other things.
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    (Original post by Juichiro)
    My point? I just asked people to discuss something. You gave me your opinion and I gave you mine.
    Well actually, you told me to go and read a post which wasn't really relevant.

    From reading your posts to other people, it seems like you're basically trying to prove that art has no purpose/importance and doesn't make a contribution to anything. Which is a completely different subject to that that you invited people to discuss..


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    (Original post by Juichiro)
    Ever heard of minimalist art? They try to keep it simple.
    Yup - bad art at best. Takes little to no skill and a child could do it.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    Yup - bad art at best. Takes little to no skill and a child could do it.
    Is that a fact or just your opinion?
 
 
 
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