Cameron lectures the plebs from a golden throne Watch

Rational Thinker
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#41
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#41
(Original post by Drewski)
That's no spike... Note it's shape. And the way the tip is also shaped... What you can't see is that it's attached to a mechanism allowing it go up and down...

...now use your imagination.
How utterly depraved.
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Hopple
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#42
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There's still a valid point in there. If you feel benefits are being taken away from those who need them with the reason given being we can't get enough tax money, then Cameron claiming as such whilst surrounded by visibly surplus income does make his words sound hollow.
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gladders
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#43
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(Original post by Hopple)
There's still a valid point in there. If you feel benefits are being taken away from those who need them with the reason given being we can't get enough tax money, then Cameron claiming as such whilst surrounded by visibly surplus income does make his words sound hollow.
I don't think that's entirely what they say - they say it's also because the tax money is not being spent in a worthwhile manner. In any case, he has no control or right to comment over the centuries-old practices of an institution he is annually invited to speak at. I would imagine that the furnishings are so old that they are essentially their personal property and not a drain on taxes.
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Plainview
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#44
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I couldn't care less, frankly. I'm not sure the scrapping of Cameron's furniture would alleviate the plight of the starving millions. I can see Miliband doing something similar.
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MatureStudent36
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#45
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(Original post by Plainview)
I couldn't care less, frankly. I'm not sure the scrapping of Cameron's furniture would alleviate the plight of the starving millions. I can see Miliband doing something similar.
Starving Millions? Emotive words. From the same background of people we have chronic obesity caused by bad diet.
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Hopple
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#46
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(Original post by gladders)
I don't think that's entirely what they say - they say it's also because the tax money is not being spent in a worthwhile manner. In any case, he has no control or right to comment over the centuries-old practices of an institution he is annually invited to speak at. I would imagine that the furnishings are so old that they are essentially their personal property and not a drain on taxes.
Some people believe that the cuts are unduly hurting the more vulnerable, and the real reason the Tories are cutting taxes for the highest earners (or refusing to raise taxes) is because they're buddies or want to move into those industries once they move on from politics so want to be buddies, not that higher taxes would drive away too many people. This example shows the potential of extra tax money that could be collected, and even if you discount the 'thrones' there's still the actual banquet - isn't the point of a banquet to say "I have loads of money lol. Here, I'll throw a load of it around on surplus amounts of needlessly fancy food and drink to show I can spare it"?
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gladders
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#47
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(Original post by Hopple)
Some people believe that the cuts are unduly hurting the more vulnerable, and the real reason the Tories are cutting taxes for the highest earners (or refusing to raise taxes) is because they're buddies or want to move into those industries once they move on from politics so want to be buddies, not that higher taxes would drive away too many people. This example shows the potential of extra tax money that could be collected, and even if you discount the 'thrones' there's still the actual banquet - isn't the point of a banquet to say "I have loads of money lol. Here, I'll throw a load of it around on surplus amounts of needlessly fancy food and drink to show I can spare it"?
You can keep telling yourself that, but the fact is a large chunk of the population voted for them, and they can't all be personal buddies of the rich.

A banquet is not simply a means of showing off wealth (I don't doubt that in the past, that was a boon), but also as a means of getting people together for various functions and meetings. Business and government holds them all the time as means of social lubrication and sealing agreements.
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Hopple
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#48
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(Original post by gladders)
You can keep telling yourself that, but the fact is a large chunk of the population voted for them, and they can't all be personal buddies of the rich.
:confused:

Just because they beat Brown's washed up Labour doesn't mean the public agree with their policies.

A banquet is not simply a means of showing off wealth (I don't doubt that in the past, that was a boon), but also as a means of getting people together for various functions and meetings. Business and government holds them all the time as means of social lubrication and sealing agreements.
Even if that wasn't the intention, it's still evidence of surplus income that could be taxed rather than cutting vital services.
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thunder_chunky
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#49
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(Original post by MostUncivilised)
http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...ic-sector-cuts

Attachment 253256

God, it's like something out of Animal Farm. Who is he to live off our backs, and read us sermons on how to live? He doesn't seem to comprehend the irony of lecturing us about the government having to tighten its belt and cut services, while sitting on a golden throne at a state banquet.
The peasants are revolting.
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gladders
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#50
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(Original post by Hopple)
:confused:

Just because they beat Brown's washed up Labour doesn't mean the public agree with their policies.
So you're saying that people couldn't possibly actually support the Tories, they can only be kicking Labour in?

Sounds a bit like wishful thinking to me.

Even if that wasn't the intention, it's still evidence of surplus income that could be taxed rather than cutting vital services.
Well, this is my point. At the basic level, we can all agree that taxes should be raised to meet justifiable needs and all else should be left to the private individual. There's a not-insignificant portion of the population, rich and poor, however, who contend that there are fewer justifiable needs than, say, you or I would contend.
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Hopple
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#51
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(Original post by gladders)
So you're saying that people couldn't possibly actually support the Tories, they can only be kicking Labour in?

Sounds a bit like wishful thinking to me.
I'm saying that that's a rather large factor so claiming a vote for them means a voter agreeing with their policies is not necessarily true. Heck, even at the best of times voters tend to go with a party that's closest to their political views (among the parties who they feel have a chance of winning), and often disagree with several of that party's policies.



Well, this is my point. At the basic level, we can all agree that taxes should be raised to meet justifiable needs and all else should be left to the private individual. There's a not-insignificant portion of the population, rich and poor, however, who contend that there are fewer justifiable needs than, say, you or I would contend.
The point can still be made though, in reference to this story, that being unwilling to tax the rich does come across as out of touch when he's surrounded by such surplus wealth.
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gladders
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#52
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(Original post by Hopple)
I'm saying that that's a rather large factor so claiming a vote for them means a voter agreeing with their policies is not necessarily true. Heck, even at the best of times voters tend to go with a party that's closest to their political views (among the parties who they feel have a chance of winning), and often disagree with several of that party's policies.
But then are you arguing that you know that nobody who wasn't rich voted in favour of the Tories' spending cut plans? As I have considerable intelligence that this is the opposite of true.

The point can still be made though, in reference to this story, that being unwilling to tax the rich does come across as out of touch when he's surrounded by such surplus wealth.
This is the money funded by the Lord Mayor, whose remit is the City of London, which means the rich is probably taxed for his banquet

I don't think it makes them out of touch at all. They are entirely entitled to spend their own money as they like, up and until the government decides they pay more. Otherwise this is as churlish as those who dig at the so-called 'scroungers' for buying flat-screen TVs.
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Hopple
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#53
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(Original post by gladders)
But then are you arguing that you know that nobody who wasn't rich voted in favour of the Tories' spending cut plans? As I have considerable intelligence that this is the opposite of true.



This is the money funded by the Lord Mayor, whose remit is the City of London, which means the rich is probably taxed for his banquet

I don't think it makes them out of touch at all. They are entirely entitled to spend their own money as they like, up and until the government decides they pay more. Otherwise this is as churlish as those who dig at the so-called 'scroungers' for buying flat-screen TVs.
Put yourself in the mindset of someone who believes the public sector is being cut too much, and that there is plenty of potential tax revenue from the rich available. Now, what do you see when Cameron talks about austerity surrounded by people with huge surpluses of wealth?
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n00
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#54
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(Original post by gladders)
But then are you arguing that you know that nobody who wasn't rich voted in favour of the Tories' spending cut plans? As I have considerable intelligence that this is the opposite of true.
Which MPs or Lords aren't rich?
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gladders
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#55
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(Original post by Hopple)
Put yourself in the mindset of someone who believes the public sector is being cut too much, and that there is plenty of potential tax revenue from the rich available. Now, what do you see when Cameron talks about austerity surrounded by people with huge surpluses of wealth?
I see the same as I did before. I already told you that I dislike their cuts.

(Original post by n00)
Which MPs or Lords aren't rich?
What criteria are we using here? Their built-in salary for being an MP? Or what they were before becoming an MP?

In any case, as less than half the MPs in the Commons and the Lords are Tories, it still doesn't add up.
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Rational Thinker
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#56
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(Original post by Plainview)
I couldn't care less, frankly. I'm not sure the scrapping of Cameron's furniture would alleviate the plight of the starving millions. I can see Miliband doing something similar.
Is the bust in your avatar Cicero?
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n00
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#57
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(Original post by gladders)
In any case, as less than half the MPs in the Commons and the Lords are Tories, it still doesn't add up.
What doesn't add up? Are only the Tory MPs rich?
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Plainview
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#58
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#58
(Original post by Rational Thinker)
Is the bust in your avatar Cicero?
Yes
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Rational Thinker
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#59
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(Original post by Plainview)
Yes
Well chosen.
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gladders
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#60
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(Original post by n00)
What doesn't add up? Are only the Tory MPs rich?
I am unable to say for certain as I don't know the details of the wealth of individual MPs, but I would imagine not.

You asked me what MPs and Lords weren't rich, and you seemed to be asking it in response to my point that you don't have to be rich to be a Tory. So I'm not sure what you were trying to say.
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