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    (Original post by HexBugMaster)
    I refute you thusly:
    Wow. A crudely drawn animation with rubbish voice acting, sneering at a large artistic enterprise that managed to put a best-seller on the market. A best-seller that is widely appreciated for its satirical bite and humour

    I know which I prefer
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    So is an unmade bed with a bottle of vodka and some tights and a packet of headache tablets. And it's just sold for over £2m.
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    (Original post by MostUncivilised)
    We're not talking about a couple of years from now, we're talking about games that are out now. In a couple of years, we can then debate on the relative merits of titles that are out then. Otherwise it's simply a counterfactual debate with as much merit as "What would have happened if Hitler won the war?"
    So you dismiss the whole point because ONE of the given THREE engines isn't actually used yet?



    The graphics are considerably better than IV. And the writing is a lot better; IV consisted of a lot of shoot outs, and driving from point A to point B.
    I should hope the graphics are considerably better, after all , there were FIVE years between the launches, but it still looked to be a at least a year or two behind. As for the gameplay, it is vastly improved from GTA IV, but it still isn't highly noteworthy, it's been picked up off the floor and dusted off, that is all.

    GTA 5 had many more funny and interesting missions (the one where you're chasing the yacht on the highway, and Franklin is swinging around off the sail?), much more in the style of San Andreas.

    Anyways, maybe we will have to agree to disagree. I suspect, though, that in 20 or 30 years you will appreciate this game for the classic it is. In its day, the Godfather was considered a big budget Paramount film, not the profound work of art it is considered today.
    Doubt I will, GTA will probably stand the test of time in that respect, but not V, SA maybe, but not V.
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    RDR was R*'s greatest work yet.
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    I would have to agree with much of the sentiment expressed above in terms of the groundbreaking nature of the game in terms of the level of satire and gameplay and the five year gap between IV and V made it the most anticipated video game release for me personally.

    It definitely 'lived up to the hype' and I was hooked from September and still play occasionally but to nowhere near the same extent as San Andreas or even IV. I think this is for numerous reasons; firstly while the map and game engine were both the most impressive I'd ever seen, having completed the story mode and additional side missions I felt like there wasn't the same depth to the title - while exploring the map is fun and something I continue to do, the omission of the vigilante/paramedic/firefighter missions really took away from some of the immersion I'd enjoyed in previous titles as it offered a means of utilising the map differently each time without the possibility of completion.

    Also I felt like at times Rockstar had taken a step backwards with other features present in earlier games being removed. The entry of cheats through the phone handset in IV is an example of this - I thought this was convenient and made good use of the protagonist's mobile, while the 'retro' method of tapping out a code was a novelty at first it soon wore off and I remember wondering why both couldn't be present in V. The cheat content was also disappointing as I was hoping for a 'pedestrian riots' cheat a la San Andreas since Rockstar were supposed to be moving back towards 'fun' as opposed to 'extreme realism' gameplay or even just a greater choice of cheat codes.

    Despite these gripes which have had an impact on the longevity of the game for myself personally I still appreciate the powerful social commentary and fantastic natural and urban environments that feel so authentic.
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    (Original post by MostUncivilised)
    Wow. A crudely drawn animation with rubbish voice acting, sneering at a large artistic enterprise that managed to put a best-seller on the market. A best-seller that is widely appreciated for its satirical bite and humour

    I know which I prefer
    It helps if you argue against the points, not the style. And a best seller through anticipation, not necessarily good.
    If I were to publish a game and make it look amazing, and sold $1bn in a couple of days because it was so hyped up and anticipated, but in fact you just stood in a room and did nothing put ponder life, is that a good game because it sold well?
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    (Original post by HexBugMaster)
    x
    Holy ****balls that was awesome, thanks for giving me something to procrastinate over this evening.

    With regards to the OP... An artistic masterpiece? Naaaaah. A bloody good game? Aight, I'll give you that. The dialogue was funny (especially when Trevor and Michael were in the same room), the storyline was typical GTA but didn't have nearly enough heist missions. Doesn't have any heist missions so far in the multiplayer mode, which I was quite disappointed about.

    The guns, cars, and general population are all typical GTA, which isn't a bad thing so much as it is the same thing. Then again, if it ain't broke...
    The map was fun with a fair amount of varied scenery, and Rockstar have kept to the tradition of poking fun at reality (and indeed as you pointed out, certain aspects of it) and parodying everything that they can. But to claim the game as a masterpiece because of that? Can't say I agree, man. I rate it highly, but it's not masterpiece material.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    So you dismiss the whole point because ONE of the given THREE engines isn't actually used yet?
    What are you talking about? You're the one who raised games that haven't yet been released. I was merely pointing out that we can only really debate based on games that are currently out.

    it is vastly improved from GTA IV, but it still isn't highly noteworthy
    And what open-world crime/shooter game has better graphics? To me this sounds like the usual sneering, carping, gamer boys who don't really understand, know or appreciate the effort that goes into developing, creating and publishing a game. They fixate on graphics, and make asinine comparisons between, say, GTA and Call of Duty.

    They fail to appreciate the satirical elements of GTA because they're the kind of gamer who is more interested in shooty-bang-bang and racing games than artistic contributions to pop culture on the level GTA has.
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    (Original post by Drunk Punx)
    didn't have nearly enough heist missions
    I agree with that, it could have had a fair few more heist missions.

    The guns, cars, and general population are all typical GTA, which isn't a bad thing so much as it is the same thing. Then again, if it ain't broke...
    The map was fun with a fair amount of varied scenery, and Rockstar have kept to the tradition of poking fun at reality (and indeed as you pointed out, certain aspects of it) and parodying everything that they can. But to claim the game as a masterpiece because of that? Can't say I agree, man. I rate it highly, but it's not masterpiece material
    It's noteworthy that you failed to mention the satirical elements, the script, the voice-acting... essentially, all the artistic elements of note. Perhaps the cars, the guns etc were at the top of your mind such that you didn't really have much regard for the quality of the writing?
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    (Original post by MostUncivilised)
    I was just searching and I couldn't find any mention of it on Xbox Is it only on Playstation?
    Yeah it is.

    Honestly, just buy a PS3 and TLOU. Sell it once you've done with it. You won't lose too much cash and it is 100% worth it. I know all this to be true because that's exactly what I did having been a 360 gamer for the rest of that generation! :yep:
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    Yeah I agree with you, OP. I thought the characters and story were great. I never really understand why CJ is worshipped as a protagonist so much. I loved GTA SA, but CJ always came across as a bit boring to me. A bit one dimensional. I could never relate to him. In GTA V, I think Michael was a great character because I could understand how he was feeling a bit more. Even though there were the three protagonists, I feel it was still sided to Michael being the main character because a lot of the key missions were to do with his storyline.

    I'm just about to start replaying it, actually. Uni's finished and I tend to replay games a few times if I enjoyed them. I wanted to replay GTA SA recently, too, but despite how good it is, I can't forget the scale of GTA V's map now. It's not the same.
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    (Original post by MostUncivilised)
    What are you talking about? You're the one who raised games that haven't yet been released. I was merely pointing out that we can only really debate based on games that are currently out.
    I gave three engines on which games that out do have been/will be published. The CryEngines have published the Crysis series, among others, 3 definitely beats down GTA V (even on last gen consoles); Frostbite engines have, among other things, the battlefield series, again, 4 would beat down GTA V, even 3 would give it a run for its money; UE4 will undoubtedly out do GTA V, and probably the next GTA for that matter and I shall leave the next example for your next question.


    And what open-world crime/shooter game has better graphics?
    Enter: Watch_Dogs, merely comparable on last gen because it was it was a low priority port, Current gen at least comparable, PC, well, we will have to wait until some decent GTA V mods come out to make that comparison

    To me this sounds like the usual sneering, carping, gamer boys who don't really understand, know or appreciate the effort that goes into developing, creating and publishing a game. They fixate on graphics, and make asinine comparisons between, say, GTA and Call of Duty.

    They fail to appreciate the satirical elements of GTA because they're the kind of gamer who is more interested in shooty-bang-bang and racing games than artistic contributions to pop culture on the level GTA has.
    Whatever you say Mr Ad Hominem
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    (Original post by mikeyd85)
    Yeah it is.

    Honestly, just buy a PS3 and TLOU. Sell it once you've done with it. You won't lose too much cash and it is 100% worth it. I know all this to be true because that's exactly what I did having been a 360 gamer for the rest of that generation! :yep:
    I was actually really tempted to do this, but I don't have the money at the moment even if I was selling it back .I want to play it so badly though. Do you think I'd be missing out if I tried to find a playthrough on Youtube and watched that?
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    (Original post by Airfairy)
    I was actually really tempted to do this, but I don't have the money at the moment even if I was selling it back .I want to play it so badly though. Do you think I'd be missing out if I tried to find a playthrough on Youtube and watched that?
    Just keep on saving up. It's only going to get cheaper over time and it's not going to become worse in any way. It'll still be awesome. I'd say avoid playthroughs on YouTube though simply because (at least when playing it on Hard) there are many gameplay moments when you feel either powerless, overwhelmed or completely terrified. You just won't get that watching someone else. Planning your moves, conserving ammo when you can and not angering the Clickers is half the fun of the game, but I really, really like games like that anyway.
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    (Original post by MostUncivilised)
    Wow. A crudely drawn animation with rubbish voice acting, sneering at a large artistic enterprise that managed to put a best-seller on the market. A best-seller that is widely appreciated for its satirical bite and humour

    I know which I prefer
    I prefer to call the animation minimalistic, and the "sneering" is the expression of an opinion about the game, which is of the same value, if not more, than yours. He's a professional reviewer after all and I assume he has a lot more experience with games.

    And it being a "best-seller" doesn't guarantee that it's good, look at Twilight, for example. But nevermind this.

    The reason I posted this video is because you were so busy exalting the game to Mount Olympus that you forgot to notice its disadvantages, and this video concisely expresses them. He didn't say the game was absolutely rubbish - he said what he didn't like in it and stated that it didn't excite him. My expectations were, since you advertised yourself as a "highly educated person", that you will consider these arguments and arrive at a more balanced view of the game.
    You however went on to making irrelevant ad hominem comments about how the video is made, ignored all the criticisms and failed to make any attempt at rebutting them.

    I also don't get your vehement opposition when someone suggests that the game isn't as good as you see it - if you really like it and are sure of its goodness other people's opinions shouldn't bother you in the slightest.

    All in all, I'm not impressed by the way you're acting - like a hyperactive fanboy that refuses to see any evidence that dampens his views about his beloved game.
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    (Original post by Airfairy)
    Yeah I agree with you, OP. I thought the characters and story were great. I never really understand why CJ is worshipped as a protagonist so much. I loved GTA SA, but CJ always came across as a bit boring to me. A bit one dimensional. I could never relate to him
    I completely agree, he always seemed a bit empty. It was often hard to know why he did what he did. And his whole character arc was often merely an attempt to overturn his friends and family's assumptions that he was a "buster" (i.e. abandoned the grove street gang)

    In GTA V, I think Michael was a great character because I could understand how he was feeling a bit more. Even though there were the three protagonists, I feel it was still sided to Michael being the main character because a lot of the key missions were to do with his storyline.
    Exactly. Michael had a superb blend of relatability, of mid-life crisis, self-deprecation, self-doubt, and wildness. I really enjoyed him as a character.

    I'm just about to start replaying it, actually. Uni's finished and I tend to replay games a few times if I enjoyed them. I wanted to replay GTA SA recently, too, but despite how good it is, I can't forget the scale of GTA V's map now. It's not the same
    Absolutely. GTA San Andreas plays a bit of a trick in that the San Andreas county seems bigger than it is because there are lots of turns and windy roads that slow you down. GTA 5 has a beautiful, long highway where you can drive with the wind in your hair (metaphorically speaking), the radio on full blast).

    It's also a great game in that it expanded my music tastes, that's a brilliant achievement for a console game.
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    (Original post by MostUncivilised)
    I'm a huge fan of the Wire, the Sopranos, Six Feet Under, X Files, Game of Thrones, Stanley Kubrick movies like A Clockwork Orange, The Shining. Francis Ford Coppola movies.

    I enjoy Shakespeare, I read Dostoyevsky. And from all of this, from all of this artistic sensibility, I say

    GTA 5 is a work of art! What an exceptional work. It's a master parody of the times in which we live, it's an incredible satire of social media, the film industry, video games and pop culture. I rate GTA 5 very highly

    What do you think?
    The radio has me in stitches sometimes, they do it brilliantly!
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    Overrated game. I found the plot quite boring and I hated all the characters they were quite annoying. Technically it was great but the rest was a bit crappy. Like Skyrim it was lacking in story but that had lots of other redeeming qualities (especially the soundtrack) unlike GTA V which even had online to keep it going but that was boring after a day or two.
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    its ok, i prefer crash bandicoot
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    (Original post by HexBugMaster)
    My expectations were, since you advertised yourself as a "highly educated person", that you will consider these arguments and arrive at a more balanced view of the game
    I characterised myself as a literate person who appreciates fine cinema, fine literature and fine television. Admittedly, I didn't really watch too much of what you posted, that was unfair.

    But I profoundly disagree with the people claiming the game was ordinary or rubbish. It was clearly a substantial work of artistic expression, that involved a very large number of artists co-operating with one another, whether voice actors, script writers, programmers, animators, sound engineers, and so on. To create this work from all those disparate parts, to create something with such impressive satirical bite along with good gameplay, is in my opinion an achievement worthy of respect.

    You however went on to making irrelevant ad hominem comments about how the video is made, ignored all the criticisms and failed to make any attempt at rebutting them.
    I apologise for the ad hominems.

    I also don't get your vehement opposition when someone suggests that the game isn't as good as you see it - if you really like it and are sure of its goodness other people's opinions shouldn't bother you in the slightest.
    I think my opposition to people suggesting the game is not good is more based on my belief that they are not assessing the game on its true merits, they are simply comparing it to other titles based on cars and guns, and such things, rather than its artistic whole. I feel that people who claim it's "lame and gay", that it was too easy and they finished it in 3 hours, often miss the point and the game's humour and parody elements.
 
 
 
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