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Do you think Nigel Farage is xenophobic and/or racist? watch

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    (Original post by Reue)
    I dont believe they contribute more than they take out. Either directly or indirectly by filling a job which would have been done by someone British and has to be on benefits as a result.
    It isn't clear cut. Some research last year found that immigrants arriving since 2000 had put in more than they had taken out. Immigrants living in the UK from 1995 had taken out more than they had put in.

    This second group is interesting - if you break it down, you actually find that EEA migrants did contribute more, but it was non EEA migrants who accounted for the negative contribution. It is also the case that UK born people made a much bigger negative contribution in this time.

    No idea on the effect of UK born people claiming benefits because jobs are taken. Unemployment is going down so I doubt the effect of immigration on jobs. I'd also be worried that someone who have lived in the UK since birth can be beaten to a job by someone fresh into the UK from god knows where.
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    (Original post by Ronove)
    Please feel free to pick apart my argument.
    (Original post by Ronove)
    There are no large swathes of white people desperate to live in Africa. So the only reason you'd say Africa should be majority white would be because of some specific desire to displace or wipe out black Africans. But keep telling yourself that if it helps you feel like less of a ****.
    As you wish. Firstly, you conflate two issues; demand for migration and native displacement. Rather intellectually disingenuous: for the guy's analogy to work, you only have to swap the host nation and it's demographic- not the desirability to migrate.

    Secondly, what he is saying is whites are being displaced in their own country (previously a nation), and that only whites can be racist. Reverse the roles and you get a "white invasion" in African nations, where blacks are attacked by their own state for calling out this injustice: this genocide.


    (Original post by Asurat)
    Do you believe that immigration is part of some greater plot to destroy white-people? If so how so?
    It may not be a plot or conspiracy, but it's happening. It's undeniably happening, the only debate surrounding this is why/how/should we care?

    Do you know about r-type and k-type breeding strategies in biology?
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    (Original post by InnerTemple)
    It isn't clear cut. Some research last year found that immigrants arriving since 2000 had put in more than they had taken out.
    Yes, I read that report as well.. and then all the other statistics which completely discredited it as it had mostly just focused on income taxes while ignoring all the other costs to support their families and the unemployed person whos job was effectively taken.

    (Original post by InnerTemple)
    I'd also be worried that someone who have lived in the UK since birth can be beaten to a job by someone fresh into the UK from god knows where.
    But it shouldn't be about survival of the fittest. The government's first priority should be to it's own people. I'd rather the job be given to an inexperienced 18yr old fresh out of school instead of someone who's come here purely for work and is going to be sending 80% of their pay packet back home and thus out of our economy. Why do we allow people to immigrate here without jobs while those already here remain unemployed?
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    (Original post by HigherMinion)
    As you wish. Firstly, you conflate two issues; demand for migration and native displacement. Rather intellectually disingenuous: for the guy's analogy to work, you only have to swap the host nation and it's demographic- not the desirability to migrate.

    Secondly, what he is saying is whites are being displaced in their own country (previously a nation), and that only whites can be racist. Reverse the roles and you get a "white invasion" in African nations, where blacks are attacked by their own state for calling out this injustice: this genocide.




    It may not be a plot or conspiracy, but it's happening. It's undeniably happening, the only debate surrounding this is why/how/should we care?

    Do you know about r-type and k-type breeding strategies in biology?
    I know a little about breeding strategies but I don't understand how it relates to immigration, please explain.
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    (Original post by Asurat)
    I know a little about breeding strategies but I don't understand how it relates to immigration, please explain.
    http://www.bio.miami.edu/tom/courses...selection.html
    http://www.biologycorner.com/APbiolo...pulations.html

    http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/vsob1/...rth--2012.html

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...ures-show.html

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...tion-boom.html




    This is the fear in a demographic change: http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013...n_3972572.html


    tl;dr: putting r-types into k-type environments allows them to flourish like k-types, but continue to produce at r-type speed. Thus displacing whites and destroying our culture with it.

    Check out that ONS report:

    Key Findings


    • A quarter of births (25.9%) in 2012 were to mothers born outside the UK which was a slight increase from 2011 (25.5%).
    • The total fertility rates (TFRs) for UK born women and non-UK born women have remained unchanged at 1.90 and 2.29 respectively between 2011 and 2012.
    • Poland remains the most common country of birth for non-UK born mothers in 2012.
    • Romania moved into the top 10 most common countries of birth for non-UK born mothers in 2012, replacing China.
    • Pakistan remains the most common country of birth for non-UK born fathers in 2012.
    • Romania moved into the top 10 most common countries of birth for non-UK born fathers in 2012, replacing Ghana.
    • Newham remains the local authority with the highest proportion of births to non-UK born women (76.7%) in 2012.
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    While I don't think Farage himself is either racist or a xenophobe, I am pretty sure that a party like UKIP is sure to attract people who fall under both categories. Me personally, I'd open doors to immigrants who have something to bring to Britain or are very young and eager to learn. Why should being British give you a sudden advantage in terms of employment? A competitive job market filled with immigrants and non-immigrants alike and the person most skilled at said job should be employed; not because you're British.
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    (Original post by Reue)
    I suspect alot of the daily commuters would disagree. Infact I know alot of them do disagree.



    To blame it entirely on immigration is indeed absurd. To suggest that it was a contributing factor is not so.



    A few months ago I had to take someone to the local A+E department. The wait was 4 hours while she was in a huge amount of pain.

    The reason? Too many people requiring the service which hasnt been expanded since before labour threw open the doors. Perhaps not bloody immigrants.. but certainly a contributing factor.
    Immigrants sustains the nhs. Without immigrant doctors and nurses I assure you the wait would of been longer.
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    (Original post by alapa)
    Immigrants sustains the nhs. Without immigrant doctors and nurses I assure you the wait would of been longer.
    Except that's not the uncontrolled immigration we've been referring to.
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    (Original post by HigherMinion)
    As you wish. Firstly, you conflate two issues; demand for migration and native displacement. Rather intellectually disingenuous: for the guy's analogy to work, you only have to swap the host nation and it's demographic- not the desirability to migrate.

    Secondly, what he is saying is whites are being displaced in their own country (previously a nation), and that only whites can be racist. Reverse the roles and you get a "white invasion" in African nations, where blacks are attacked by their own state for calling out this injustice: this genocide.
    If you're going to be deliberately obtuse just to try to push this agenda of yours then I really cannot be bothered.
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    Chinky = raciSt

    /thread.
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    (Original post by Ronove)
    If you're going to be deliberately obtuse just to try to push this agenda of yours then I really cannot be bothered.
    Haha, what? So you asked me to dismantle your argument, now you are set on ignoring me because you can't defend your position. Good job.
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    (Original post by leemer)
    You can't say for sure that he is racist or xenophobic (although his public comments certainly suggest an element of this) however it is clear that UKIP plays on these beliefs and fears within many of its supporters. Everyone needs a scapegoat, especially the disenfranchised, and UKIP sells this through immigration very efficiently.
    He said it was alright to call say the word "chinky". I don't understand why this is not racist.
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    (Original post by Messiah Complex)
    I don't think he is.

    If you do then I think you should provide evidence that he is.
    He isn't but he is simply an opportunist and a politician.
    • Thread Starter
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    (Original post by Alfissti)
    He isn't but he is simply an opportunist and a politician.
    100% agree.

    Coca Cola Vanilla = Cons
    Coca Cola Cherry = Labour
    Coca Cola Life = Greens
    Coca Cola with Lemon = Lib Democrats
    Coca Cola Zero = BNP
    Diet Coca Cola = UKIP (obviously diet because they're trying to free us from the fatty overinflated EU)
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    (Original post by subject1)
    He said it was alright to call say the word "chinky". I don't understand why this is not racist.
    Racist terms are only racist when you use them with malice. If you say, as Farage correctly pointed out but was very vague and danced around it, are going to a Chinese takeaway/restaurant- some would call it the chinky/ie. It's really not a controversial colloquialism. My grandparents both call it that: neither of whom show any malice towards other races.
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    (Original post by HigherMinion)
    Racist terms are only racist when you use them with malice. If you say, as Farage correctly pointed out but was very vague and danced around it, are going to a Chinese takeaway/restaurant- some would call it the chinky/ie. It's really not a controversial colloquialism. My grandparents both call it that: neither of whom show any malice towards other races.
    No, racist terms are racist because of the history that the word has been associated with.

    If someone shouted every swear word under the sun towards me, even if they weren't using them with "malice", I would still be offended and in fact it would be quite rude.

    By using the word you are agreeing with the historical context behind it. You can't call a black man a "nig*er" without offending him.
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    (Original post by subject1)
    You can't call a black man a "nig*er" without offending him.
    My, that is mightily presumptuous, Mr Care Bear.

    I offended a black South African once by requesting to be referred to as "sir or master". Should we ban the word "master"? Young males in the UK grow up as masters. However, to claim every black man would be offended by the word "nigg3r" is preposterous. Although you would claim those who aren't offended are internalising racism, or something.

    No word is inherently bad. If you were talking to an Aussie and they used the word "bloody" every other word, would you care? If a southern Irishman, slightly inebriated, marched up to you for a chat in a pub with an array of "feck this" and "feck that"'s- would you tell him how offensive his speech is to you? You miserable care bear you.
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    (Original post by HigherMinion)
    My, that is mightily presumptuous, Mr Care Bear.

    I offended a black South African once by requesting to be referred to as "sir or master". Should we ban the word "master"? Young males in the UK grow up as masters. However, to claim every black man would be offended by the word "nigg3r" is preposterous. Although you would claim those who aren't offended are internalising racism, or something.

    No word is inherently bad. If you were talking to an Aussie and they used the word "bloody" every other word, would you care? If a southern Irishman, slightly inebriated, marched up to you for a chat in a pub with an array of "feck this" and "feck that"'s- would you tell him how offensive his speech is to you? You miserable care bear you.
    Well it depends on the context of how you said it. If you are using it in a working environment, requesting to be called a "master" is probably not a good idea.

    I know no word is inherently bad, but its the context that causes it to be offensive. How am I being a "miserable care bear", I just don't believe in bullying people because of something they cannot control. I would rather be nice to someone then make someone get pissed because you want a few cheap laughs.
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    (Original post by subject1)
    I know no word is inherently bad, but its the context that causes it to be offensive.
    And so, how is calling a Chinese restaurant - who's services you are intending to employ - a chinky, offensive? Who takes offence, exactly, in the context of a group of mates?

    Better yet, referring to your Chinese friend as a "chink"- is this inherently offensive if the Chinese man is not offended?
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    (Original post by HigherMinion)
    And so, how is calling a Chinese restaurant - who's services you are intending to employ - a chinky, offensive? Who takes offence, exactly, in the context of a group of mates?

    Better yet, referring to your Chinese friend as a "chink"- is this inherently offensive if the Chinese man is not offended?
    Even if it is not offensive towards the group you are in, Nigel Farage publicly defended its use. I am sure many people would take offence listening to that on TV.

    And it is offensive because chinky is a derogatory term for Chinese people, just as "nig*er" is for black people. If someone desribed a Carribbean shop as a "nig*er" then I am sure many black people would be annoyed as well.

    If a Chinese friend is not offended by the use of the word chink it doesn't stop it being a racial slur. If someone called you a ****** and you weren't offended it doesnt stop the word being a profanity.
 
 
 
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