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Tory MP's vote AGAINST allowing 3000 refugee children into the UK Watch

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    (Original post by Davij038)
    What's the difference between 'virtue signalling' and Brexit signalling? If you want to leave the EU so much why don't you move to Russia instead of *****ing on the Internet? Or at least campaign for brexit? I'd wager practically no one on here has bothered door knocking or campaigning for either side (I haven't, though I do chat to colleagues)

    We're naturally social creatures who will share our opinion regardless of our ability to fulfil or influence decision making.

    Charity is just a way for us escape out obligations by making them appear as rational choices. I blame religion.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/ethics/charity/against_1.shtml
    "Charity is a cold grey loveless thing. If a rich man wants to help the poor, he should pay his taxes gladly, not dole out money at a whim."

    ~ Clement Attlee
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    (Original post by DorianGrayism)
    Yeh. It is more sensible to bring in small kids that will be a burden on the state for longer.
    ...but will be less likely to become thugs.
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    (Original post by Josb)
    ...but will be less likely to become thugs.
    or more likely.

    The reality is that you have no clue.
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    (Original post by DorianGrayism)
    I don't see why citizens of this nation need anymore help. No one is starving to death on the streets. They have access to free healthcare and protection. They are not being forced into sex slavery.

    3000 children do not have access to such provisions and would be a relatively small burden on our welfare system.
    Irrelevant. The reason taxes should be spent on infustructure and social welfare isnt because citizens are dying on the streets but because that where taxes should be spent. If there is surplus it should be spent on the benefit of the citizens, or taxes should be reduced.

    Let those that want to help, help. But dont force others to do so.
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    (Original post by DorianGrayism)
    or more likely.

    The reality is that you have no clue.
    Indeed, I therefore prefer not to admit any of them.
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    What's wrong with that?

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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    I'm ashamed to be British sometimes. These are kids, they aren't ****ing jihadis. It was 3000. 3000 kids that will now have to continue living in absolute poverty, being picked up by child traffickers and having their whole future taking away.

    We aren't full. You can't get a GP appointment or a place in your school of choice because YOUR GOVERNMENT IS CUTTING FUNDING TO THE NHS AND SCHOOLS. House prices are going up BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT ISN'T BUILDING ENOUGH HOUSES.

    This is pure and simple greed. Mostly from people who think they're "suffering" because they can't afford a new smart phone or they had to wait a few hours in A&E. Most people in this country couldn't even begin to comprehend the suffering that these refugees go through daily, because they've lived immensely privileged lives.

    I'm honestly disgusted. I hate this country.
    Isn't the NHS budget going up? And education ring-fenced?
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    (Original post by Farm_Ecology)
    Irrelevant. The reason taxes should be spent on infustructure and social welfare isnt because citizens are dying on the streets but because that where taxes should be spent. If there is surplus it should be spent on the benefit of the citizens, or taxes should be reduced.

    Let those that want to help, help. But dont force others to do so.
    In other words.....

    I only want taxes spent on things I like and people should be forced to spend money on that.

    I don't want to spend taxes on refugees so I shouldn't be forced to spend money on that.
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    (Original post by DorianGrayism)
    In other words.....

    I only want taxes spent on things I like and people should be forced to spend money on that.
    To an extent, yes. Taxes are a forced subscription for living in a nation, and I believe what taxes should be spent on should therefore be justifiable for the improvement of that nation.

    Taxes should not be used as forced state-sponsored charity, but instead be practical ways of improving the conditions of the society.
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    Good, I don't want any of these 40 year old 'children' reaping havoc here
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    (Original post by Farm_Ecology)
    Exactly, it's everyones money, not just those that believe we should help or those that believe we shouldn't. The default position of spending however, would be not to pay for it.

    Although it's difficult to say what the majority want in this regard, as the house of commons does not represent the voting population.
    This may be so, and that is a great argument for donating time and money to helping them on an individual basis. It is not however, a strong argument for donating other peoples money to those outside of the society.
    This whole taxpayers money shouldnt go on tghings we dont all agree on is bull. What if i suddenly dewcide that i dont wanna pay for ambulances? Or the police, or whatever. Do i have the right tp do thayt just because a tiny portion of it is my money.
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    (Original post by JezWeCan!)
    Well do something about it. Volunteer to sponsor a refugee child in a camp.

    Send them all your spare money. Go and work with refugees so you feel less "sad."

    Do something constructive to help rather than emoting on a student website.

    Even if we did help this 3000 so what? There are millions of people in desperate situations like this all over the world. We can't do anything about it as a country, won't do anything about it.

    Any more than you will, individually.
    What a petty, easy response. It is possible to support something without wanting to suddenly dedicate your entire life to it. This country has the infrastructure, capability and systems in place to deal with 3000 refugee children so it isn't hypocritical in the slightest to demand that the government does something about it, that's what taxes are for.
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    (Original post by SophieBarlow87)
    This whole taxpayers money shouldnt go on tghings we dont all agree on is bull. What if i suddenly dewcide that i dont wanna pay for ambulances? Or the police, or whatever. Do i have the right tp do thayt just because a tiny portion of it is my money.
    It's nothing to do with "things we dont all agree on", its to do with practical improvements of the society that is paying the tax.
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    And? Good on the Tories for not giving into emotion.
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    What's the difference between 'virtue signalling' and Brexit signalling? If you want to leave the EU so much why don't you move to Russia instead of *****ing on the Internet? Or at least campaign for brexit? I'd wager practically no one on here has bothered door knocking or campaigning for either side (I haven't, though I do chat to colleagues)

    We're naturally social creatures who will share our opinion regardless of our ability to fulfil or influence decision making.

    Charity is just a way for us escape out obligations by making them appear as rational choices. I blame religion.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/ethics/charity/against_1.shtml
    Don't even know where to begin with this one smh
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    So we should take on totally valueless people on the basis of subjective feelings?
    +1

    Spot on - They are not our problem.
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    (Original post by Farm_Ecology)
    To an extent, yes. Taxes are a forced subscription for living in a nation, and I believe what taxes should be spent on should therefore be justifiable for the improvement of that nation.

    Taxes should not be used as forced state-sponsored charity, but instead be practical ways of improving the conditions of the society.
    Social welfare, free healthcare and etc is state sponsored charity.
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    (Original post by Aceadria)
    And? Good on the Tories for not giving into emotion.
    Indeed.

    The world isn't perfect or fair and it never will be. The wise look at life objectively and disregard emotional interference in all decision making. Here in Britain we already have a plethora of issues to deal with, such as the widespread homophobia and Islamism among the musselmen population, the large number of homeless people and the lack of housing. These issues affect BRITISH citizens, whereas the Syrian war only affects Syrians, most of whom hold barbaric, uncivilised, disgraceful views. British citizens must ALWAYS be put first, because they're our countrymen and not savages from the ME. Besides, importing Muslim barbarians from the shitiest place on earth is obviously going to worsen our own problems.

    If you ever forget this you run the risk of turning to Merkelism - being willing to sacrifice your own people to appease outlanders and then persecuting your own people when they get raped and beaten by the outlander barbarians. The situation in Germany and Scandinavia should be enough of a lesson to soppy, emotionally driven leftists. Unfortunately by the number of people criticising common sense in this thread, it seems that the best we can hope for is that they'll wake up to reality when immigrants start groping and raping them, or beating their children almost to death.
    Do bear in mind though, that while being Muslim and being a barbarian are correlated, one is not causal of the other. I'm not targeting musselmen here. The KKK for example are Christian barbarians. The overall relationship is that religiosity is proportional to barbarism for most religions, but there are of course people who are religious while also being very nice people. .
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    (Original post by DorianGrayism)
    Our affairs will never be in order according to people like you. It is just an excuse to avoid taking refugees.

    It was this dumb attitude that allowed millions of Jews to get murdered at the hands of the Germany.

    The actual right thing is to take have a united front and send ground troops to stop the refugee flow. That was the right thing to do 5 years ago. It is the right thing to do now. Obviously, the public in this country lacks the foresight to support such a move.
    Failing to act sufficiently in preventing a problem and not taking on the ensuing refugees is hardly equivalent. It was not the refusal to take in Jews that lead to their extermination (are these refugees being systematically exterminated?), it was the failure to take out the regime exterminating them.

    (Original post by Davij038)
    What's the difference between 'virtue signalling' and Brexit signalling? If you want to leave the EU so much why don't you move to Russia instead of *****ing on the Internet? Or at least campaign for brexit? I'd wager practically no one on here has bothered door knocking or campaigning for either side (I haven't, though I do chat to colleagues)

    We're naturally social creatures who will share our opinion regardless of our ability to fulfil or influence decision making.

    Charity is just a way for us escape out obligations by making them appear as rational choices. I blame religion.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/ethics/charity/against_1.shtml
    You're so intent on remaining in the EU you bring it into irrelevant threads, have a cookie.

    (Original post by DorianGrayism)
    Oh yes...because your excuse of "our affairs are not in order" is totally objective.
    It doesn't rely on trying to appeal to emotion and petty morality and serves the inherent self interest of humankind rather than a shell of philanthropy.

    (Original post by Youngmetro)
    Have a heart, they're children
    Age is irrelevant. People act as if minors are more important, it's merely appealing to innate human nature to wish to fend for offspring rather than actually trying to give a proper argument; the twenty something is far preferable, retains the ability to produce children but also isn't as great a burden.

    (Original post by DanteTheDoorKnob)
    Would you take a look at this
    Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,


    It was written by people worth far more than you will ever be.
    A statement that relies on premises that not only I reject, but the majority of the British populace reject.

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