How the left respond to the recent attack in Orlando now we know the perp was Muslim? watch

Rorschach II · 12-06-2016 16:59

(Original post by Axel Johann)
We would say exactly the same thing, you can't generalise a group of people based on the actions of a few.

How does that not get to your brain?

--
Edit :- it looks like you changed your OP to:

lol

But you can acknowledge tendencies within said group and address the causes of e.g. the Qur'an and the culture from which they came / by which they are influenced.

nexttimeigetvpn · 12-06-2016 17:01

(Original post by KingBradly)
What an incredible deflection you had to resort to in-order to refute my previous point. No where did I state that Islamists attack left-wing institutions. I simply said that if they were radicalised in reaction to criticism of Islam or Muslims, then they would surely make an effort to attack those people. But they don't, they attack people based on what their religions says. They attack gays, they attack those who publish images of their prophet, they attack Western society based on the idea that it is haram.

Obviously it wasn't only Islam that drove them to do this. Just as it wasn't only the guns that caused this attack. However, guns played a big part, so I'd say it's a good idea to ban them. Guns seem to be a big theme in a lot of mass shootings, so I'd say banning them is a good idea if you want to stop them. Islam also seems to be a very common thread in terror attacks, so perhaps we should consider that thread and think about how it may influence them. All the parts about chopping off the fingers of unbelievers and killing them and reigning fire on gays might just have something to do with it. I dunno, maybe it's just me. But I'd say it seems likely it has an effect. Maybe you should actually try reading the Qu'ran before defending it?

cant be bothered to argue with a brick wall, you're one of the tsr islamophobes who always politicises these things

ChickenFillet2.0 · 12-06-2016 17:15

A realignment of journalistic intent in light of recent events in Orlando:

What one feels is of particular interest regarding the recent atrocity in Orlando was the media's, and in fact the authorities - willingness and eagerness to classify it. At first we saw the initial classification being an 'act of domestic terrorism' - I suggest that the perception was as the result of the 'target' being a LGBTIQ+ venue, and provoked by the existence of right-wing terror groups in the US which are ideologically opposed to the expanding institution of LGBTIQ+ people in the United States.

Our second classification seemed to be in-light of the identity of the perpetrator (the name 'Omar', still yet to be confirmed heralds from Islamic origins). I believe the FBI then updated their perspective from 'looking into [the atrocities] as an act of domestic terrorism', to 'exploring weather outside influences played in role as motive'. The media was quick to explore this new angle provided by the name of the perpetrator.

What ever did spur on the horrendous acts, my real point is that shouldn't the fact that there are so many possibilities of classification as clue to the fact that classification should be irrelevant. Instead of the media trying to collect different fragments of partial information and then presenting them under one signpost 'horrendous act of islamic terrorism' etc. I suggest that it would be beneficial to our nation, if a different path as pursued in the future. I believe the media's role should be to inform, and solely to inform. When you start to amalgamate the populous's need for information, with the perception of a news agency being distributed under the guise of 'information' - you in fact dangerously misinform people and spur people to jump from the solid cliffs of known fact, into the sea of suppositions. The path in future, I believe, is just for media outlets to provide the raw sources - i.e. in the format "we have learned that the identity of the shooter may be "Omar Mateen", as opposed to "there are [unfounded] suggestions of Islamic Terrorism. We recently learned to the true identity of the shooter to be Omar Mateen".

By also just providing the raw information, as opposed to an arrangement of this information to suit editorial objectives; news agencies could help inform the public to become more astute and conscious of the challenges facing our world. It is time for the reevaluation I propose, and I feel such a reevaluation will be beneficial who hindering the progress of demagogues and fear-mongers who live off the suppositions the media implants in us.

Grand High Witch · 12-06-2016 17:22

(Original post by ChickenFillet2.0)
A realignment of journalistic intent in light of recent events in Orlando:

What one feels is of particular interest regarding the recent atrocity in Orlando was the media's, and in fact the authorities - willingness and eagerness to classify it. At first we saw the initial classification being an 'act of domestic terrorism' - I suggest that the perception was as the result of the 'target' being a LGBTIQ+ venue, and provoked by the existence of right-wing terror groups in the US which are ideologically opposed to the expanding institution of LGBTIQ+ people in the United States.

Our second classification seemed to be in-light of the identity of the perpetrator (the name 'Omar', still yet to be confirmed heralds from Islamic origins). I believe the FBI then updated their perspective from 'looking into [the atrocities] as an act of domestic terrorism', to 'exploring weather outside influences played in role as motive'. The media was quick to explore this new angle provided by the name of the perpetrator.

What ever did spur on the horrendous acts, my real point is that shouldn't the fact that there are so many possibilities of classification as clue to the fact that classification should be irrelevant. Instead of the media trying to collect different fragments of partial information and then presenting them under one signpost 'horrendous act of islamic terrorism' etc. I suggest that it would be beneficial to our nation, if a different path as pursued in the future. I believe the media's role should be to inform, and solely to inform. When you start to amalgamate the populous's need for information, with the perception of a news agency being distributed under the guise of 'information' - you in fact dangerously misinform people and spur people to jump from the solid cliffs of known fact, into the sea of suppositions. The path in future, I believe, is just for media outlets to provide the raw sources - i.e. in the format "we have learned that the identity of the shooter may be "Omar Mateen", as opposed to "there are [unfounded] suggestions of Islamic Terrorism. We recently learned to the true identity of the shooter to be Omar Mateen".

By also just providing the raw information, as opposed to an arrangement of this information to suit editorial objectives; news agencies could help inform the public to become more astute and conscious of the challenges facing our world. It is time for the reevaluation I propose, and I feel such a reevaluation will be beneficial who hindering the progress of demagogues and fear-mongers who live off the suppositions the media implants in us.

Where did you copy and paste this dribble from? The blood isn't even dry yet and someone is already pontificating over "incorrect" terminology.

Olie · 12-06-2016 17:24

(Original post by Plagioclase)
Hysteria is literally the absolute worst possible way to respond to a terrorist attack. You are literally handing them what they want on a golden platter.

This. The primary aim of carrying out terrorist attacks is to cause fear and hysteria, that literally is the definition of terrorism, all these hysterical and fearmongering reactions aimed at Muslims and Islam as a whole only serve as proof the terrorist attack succeeded.

And no, before anyone strawmans me, I am not suggesting I think a horrific attack like this should be ignored, action is clearly needed to counter Islamic extremism, but hysteria and directing anger and hatred towards Muslims is not the answer and only divides society further.

username878267 · 12-06-2016 17:57

(Original post by Plagioclase)
How TSR's resident anti-Muslim crowd responds to every terrorist attack: making the exact same threads moaning about how the left are totally okay with this, spamming sarcastic comments about Islam being the religion of peace and more moaning about the left wing. From the enthusiasm you all put into these posts you'd almost think you get excited when these events happen.

It is a tragedy, feel sorry for the victims, please leave the exploitation of mass shootings for political aims for later.

This. Seems that Posters like OP get all giddy over attacks like this.

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drogon · 12-06-2016 18:03

You seem more interested in attacking the left and attacking the entirety of islam than show respect for the victims. Its disgusting that you think you can use this as leverage for your own hateful agenda as opposed, thereby undermining the real victims of this attack.

Axel Johann · 12-06-2016 18:04

(Original post by XcitingStuart)
But you can acknowledge tendencies within said group and address the causes of e.g. the Qur'an and the culture from which they came / by which they are influenced.

Of course I can, but OP has thing thing against 'the left' and like latches onto every little bit he can and tries to blow it out of proportion.

oShahpo · 12-06-2016 18:06

Terrorism has become more of a natural thing to be honest, much like earthquakes and volcanoes. The only difference is that while earthquakes are the result of problems in the Earth's mantle, terrorism is caused by problems in the brains of the lunatic race that is humans.

Melancholy · 12-06-2016 18:08

(Original post by nexttimeigetvpn)
islamic extremism isn't going to disappear if half the country is constantly hateful towards Muslims

I think you have your causation the wrong way round, in truth. It isn't the west which has caused most middle-eastern countries to discriminate against homosexuals.

nexttimeigetvpn · 12-06-2016 18:15

(Original post by Melancholy)
I think you have your causation the wrong way round, in truth. It isn't the west which has caused most middle-eastern countries to discriminate against homosexuals.

No, but spamming hate speech towards Islam/Muslims isn't exactly helping

Melancholy · 12-06-2016 18:17

True dat tho.

Jebedee · 12-06-2016 18:19

(Original post by drogon)
You seem more interested in attacking the left and attacking the entirety of islam than show respect for the victims. Its disgusting that you think you can use this as leverage for your own hateful agenda as opposed, thereby undermining the real victims of this attack.

I think the real victims would want us to make sure this isn't repeated again so that their deaths won't be in vain.

Apparently the police were aware of a relatively local Imam espousing anti-gay rhetoric, but chose to do nothing. Perhaps they didn't want to "use it as leverage" so to speak.

Chakede · 12-06-2016 18:24

(Original post by Olie)
This. The primary aim of carrying out terrorist attacks is to cause fear and hysteria, that literally is the definition of terrorism, all these hysterical and fearmongering reactions aimed at Muslims and Islam as a whole only serve as proof the terrorist attack succeeded.

And no, before anyone strawmans me, I am not suggesting I think a horrific attack like this should be ignored, action is clearly needed to counter Islamic extremism, but hysteria and directing anger and hatred towards Muslims is not the answer and only divides society further.

the purpose of this attack was not to 'create a hysterical reaction toward muslims' , it was to kill gay people who he didnt like , perhaps his hatred was linked to his islamic upbringing. unfortunatey the inevitable fall out of this , and all the other incidents that have involved culprits of an islamic background, is that ppl will develop more and more distrust of other muslims - most of whom are normal decent ppl - and indeed attach this to wider society of 'brown people' who arnt even muslim ( this has bred into the growing fears of immigration in general)

Sulfolobus · 12-06-2016 18:30

I'm not surprised to see many on the right having a go at the left after acts of terrorism. Its the easy target and takes no effort on their behalf.

The sad true is that complaining about the left on the internet achieves nothing, and those complaining are about as impotent as Jeremy Crobyn in the fight against Islamic extremism. If those who view Islamic extremist as a genuine threat to the West, they would get off their corpulent backsides and travel out to Syria to fight ISIS rather than expecting others to fight and die to protect values their purport to hold dear. Sadly only a tiny handful of Brits are prepared to volunteer to fight against ISIS, with more having volunteered to fight for them. To quote Edmund Burke "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to sit around moaning on the internet".

M14B · 12-06-2016 18:33

(Original post by JohnGreek)
By:

a) Ignoring it
b) Deflecting to how some random air strike in Syria also killed 20 people last week
c) Reporting your post
d) Popcorn memes
e) Crying about Islamophobia
f) No True Muslim fallacy
I'll add more to this list when I have time

Edit: Okay, so:
g) Writing articles about how the true victims are Muslims
h) Blaming this on Trump/UKIP/Brexit/American imperialism/Male privilege/Involvement in Iraq
i) Creating videos interviewing a select few Muslims who magically appear to be accepting of homosexuality
j) Repeating the "there are 1.6bn Muslims in the world" meme
k) Asking why some completely unrelated attack in Asia or the Middle East didn't get similar news coverage
l) Blaming everyone else for jumping to conclusions when they do the exact same thing in assuming that it wasn't Islamic ideology that led to this attack
m) Claiming that they've read the Q'uran and that you don't know anything about their religion
n) Coming up with broad generalisations as to what "right wingers" think (such as not wanting gun control, being white and Christian, etc)

Pick and choose. Points (g), (j), (k), (m) and (n) have already come up in the first 20 posts of this thread.

unprinted · 12-06-2016 18:36

(Original post by FredOrJohn)
Who cares what the reason is.
The main reason is a lack of gun control in the USA.

All other reasons are meaningless drivel

That's the reason why they have a multiple shooting a day, roughly.

The reason for this one is homophobia, and Islam is not the only faith where some of its followers want to murder LGBT people.

oShahpo · 12-06-2016 18:43

Perhaps it's time for Muslims to either start a new sect of their religion which denounces violence so that we can rule out the good from the bad, or even better, realise how galvanising Islam towards violence can be and do like I and my family did, leave it for good knowing that benevolent God could have come up with this tripe.
To be honest it feels unfair to attack Muslims for things they had absolutely no hand in, but if they don't separate themselves from this evil **** they will just be caught in whatever **** storm occurs in the future.

NickLCFC · 12-06-2016 18:45

Hang on a second, this has absolutely nothing to do with Islam or Muslims.

Remember when that white guy crashed that plane one time?

Observatory · 12-06-2016 18:49

They will launch a concerted push to stop it happening again by disarming white men in Arizona.

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How the left respond to the recent attack in Orlando now we know the perp was Muslim? watch

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