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Why do Leave voters think they know better than experts? watch

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    (Original post by Naveed-7)
    That shows that you dont care about the evidence/protection of this country. Your reason to Vote Remain is simply because of malice against Leave voters.
    These leave voters, in my opinion, are threatening our country so you can kill two birds with one stone
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    (Original post by ckfeister)
    Everyone. I'm also voting in but thats the major problem vote in did wrong, too negative and full of lies.
    It's hard not to be negative, though. The EU gives us all this great stuff, and if we leave, we lose all of it. So instead of saying "the EU will make our economy better", it turns into "leaving the EU will make our economy worse".

    I honestly don't think the remain campaign has been full of lies though. At least not on the scale that Vote Leave have been.

    (Original post by .....Jeff458)
    Obama stated very clearly that if Britain leaves the EU... they would not receive any further help from America.

    Now, considering that Britain is up America's ass, without them we will go bust.

    So if you all want extreme taxes and terribly low wages, be my guests. Obama made this very clear and said he would not go back on this decision.

    Why on Earth would you want to leave anyway?
    After Obama said that, these same people decided that Obama didn't know what he was talking about and obviously it wouldn't happen. It's ridiculous.
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    (Original post by Naveed-7)
    It is my decision because I agree 100% with what the person is saying in every one of the videos Ive posted.

    Stop shouting and getting angry just because I dont agree with you. Relax.
    I accept and respect your decision.
    I was simply pointing out a lot of the out voters (Not necessarily you) tell people who are voting to remain to make their own decision.

    I was not shouting and I wasn't getting angry lol, I was just making an observation, that's all.


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    Experts on either side are just having a blind guess.
    They aren't "experts" at all. Unless they've got the benefit of time travel and actually KNOW what will happen for a fact? Nope. thought not...

    For what it's worth I'm still on the fence...
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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    Scientists all over the world tell us leaving the EU will be bad for science, technology and the environment - "selfish!!!"
    On the basis of Science the only valid argument I ever found by anyone was that we get funding from the EU, which is a fairly small amount anyway that wouldn't make much of a difference, also we could find funding from other places/EU membership cost. Switzerland have Cern who aren't a member of the EU, the UK has far better Universities. I'm sure UK Science wouldn't be any better outside of the EU but the difference would be so minimal that it's not an argument that should be considered when there are much greater things to consider.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    I would vote remain solely to piss off these xenophobes to be honest
    I would vote Leave solely to piss off these liberal idiots who believe every argument they see on the Internet is true. Works both ways
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    The EU is good for profit making corporate greedy *****- It's not for the ordinary person .
    Look what the greedy EU did to Greece disgusting!
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    (Original post by JW22)
    I would vote Leave solely to piss off these liberal idiots who believe every argument they see on the Internet is true. Works both ways
    but voting to remain doesn't have the train wreck of economic side effects to it
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    (Original post by ivybridge)
    "My opinion is better than yours, to put it bluntly, I just know it!"
    Err no.

    It is what I just said don't try and interpret my thoughts differently.

    Also everyone's opinion is equal if they bother to vote


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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    but voting to remain doesn't have the train wreck of economic side effects to it
    True, but voting remain doesn't solve the uncontrolled migration problem from the EU which if it carries on as it has done in the past 10 years, will lead to a European only Britain and economic problems.

    Leaving is likely to have economic problems, not a train wreck as you claim, the positive side is that leaving gives us the opportunity to trade with the other 90% of the world that isn't Europe, and it means there is the potential for the UK to be one of the greatest economies in the world. I really can't see the economy improving by staying in the EU, it would most likely stay the same or deteriorate over time because of new EU members/more EU membership costs/UK migration.
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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    Economists all over the world agree that leaving the EU is bad for our economy - "they don't know what they're talking about!!"
    We want to make our own laws again.

    The experts can't argue with that.
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    I suspect we are due another recession soon whether we stay in or come out, we have an unbalanced economy fuelled by credit and consumer spending, very little has changed since before the 2008 financial crisis
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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    It's hard not to be negative, though. The EU gives us all this great stuff, and if we leave, we lose all of it. So instead of saying "the EU will make our economy better", it turns into "leaving the EU will make our economy worse".

    I honestly don't think the remain campaign has been full of lies though. At least not on the scale that Vote Leave have been.



    After Obama said that, these same people decided that Obama didn't know what he was talking about and obviously it wouldn't happen. It's ridiculous.
    You think Obama knows best? He is the same 2 faced lying rat as Cameron.

    Back when he changed the whole healthcare insurance scheme in the USA he told voters that their premiums wouldn't be more expensive and he spent months & months trying to convince people everything would be okay.

    Medical premium go up!

    And then he basicallys runs away with his tail between his legs lalalalalala.

    Obama is not to be trusted. Same as Hillary to be honest. Infact Hillary should be put in a Jail cell.
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    Perhaps people are not always naive enough to believe "experts" at face value for the fact they're so called "experts" and like to exercise a bit of critical thinking to reach their own conclusions? Just a thought. This of course applies to both sides of the argument.
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    (Original post by carlos10000)
    I suspect we are due another recession soon whether we stay in or come out, we have an unbalanced economy fuelled by credit and consumer spending, very little has changed since before the 2008 financial crisis
    I agree most people don't get that that economy comes in cycles and we are nearing another dip in the coming years regardless of result.

    And nothing meaningful has changed either. Until retail banking is completely separate from casino banking (stocks) then we will always have to bail them out.

    If they were separate we could simply let them go to the wall


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    On both sides of the arguments have either set of experts published their financial modeling, have they detailed the assumptions inherent within same and the basis of these assumptions, or have they merely stated we have considered the opinions/range of outcomes and our conclusion is X? If they have read them which of them has read these documents fully and understood them fully? Do Cameron, Osbornne, Farage, Gove and Johnson have some secret background in economics of which none of us are aware, or are they all mere bar room pundits pedaling half understood mantras?

    All financial models carry error risk, outcomes are obviously dependent upon inputs, I have yet to be made aware of anyone discussing in detail the models. Any model obviously has a range of outcomes, I have yet to come across an economist who is absolute in his/her economic predictions. Accordingly I somehow doubt any of them are as definitive as is made to be the case by our cast of pundits. ( Our football pundits talk nonsense at times but at least most of them played football for a living)

    So, for what it is worth the only undisputed argument re the economy appears to be that one side says they have more experts than the other, we have quantity but little re quality.

    Frankly neither side has covered themselves in glory, each has mouthed the accepted mantra of their position without question.

    We have a great number of politicians who know little of economics, who have accepted the mantra required, have not read the economist's analysis, have not understood the economist's analysis, but somehow their frankly third rate interpretation of an economist's arguments, where they have picked from the conclusions the bits they wish to repeat, is somehow a sound economic basis for their argument.

    Sorry, in my book it is not; to anyone who has studied any economics it is not; it is quite honestly simplistic ,lowest common denominator, pap for the masses.

    Caveat emptor
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    (Original post by ckfeister)
    Everyone. I'm also voting in but thats the major problem vote in did wrong, too negative and full of lies.
    A lot of people say that, but I'm wondering if this is an example of a difference between what people say they want to hear, and what they actually want to hear.

    I wouldn't be surprised if, despite people saying that they don't like negative messages, they are actually very effective in persuading people how to vote.
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    (Original post by DJKL)
    On both sides of the arguments have either set of experts published their financial modeling, have they detailed the assumptions inherent within same and the basis of these assumptions, or have they merely stated we have considered the opinions/range of outcomes and our conclusion is X? If they have read them which of them has read these documents fully and understood them fully? Do Cameron, Osbornne, Farage, Gove and Johnson have some secret background in economics of which none of us are aware, or are they all mere bar room pundits pedaling half understood mantras?

    All financial models carry error risk, outcomes are obviously dependent upon inputs, I have yet to be made aware of anyone discussing in detail the models. Any model obviously has a range of outcomes, I have yet to come across an economist who is absolute in his/her economic predictions. Accordingly I somehow doubt any of them are as definitive as is made to be the case by our cast of pundits. ( Our football pundits talk nonsense at times but at least most of them played football for a living)

    So, for what it is worth the only undisputed argument re the economy appears to be that one side says they have more experts than the other, we have quantity but little re quality.

    Frankly neither side has covered themselves in glory, each has mouthed the accepted mantra of their position without question.

    We have a great number of politicians who know little of economics, who have accepted the mantra required, have not read the economist's analysis, have not understood the economist's analysis, but somehow their frankly third rate interpretation of an economist's arguments, where they have picked from the conclusions the bits they wish to repeat, is somehow a sound economic basis for their argument.

    Sorry, in my book it is not; to anyone who has studied any economics it is not; it is quite honestly simplistic ,lowest common denominator, pap for the masses.

    Caveat emptor
    Agreed!

    -2nd year economics student

    And this also deserves to be echoed:

    (Original post by TooFocused)
    Perhaps people are not always naive enough to believe "experts" at face value for the fact they're so called "experts" and like to exercise a bit of critical thinking to reach their own conclusions? Just a thought. This of course applies to both sides of the argument.
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    Your initial argument is invalid as there are also economists who are for Leave as well (see http://www.economistsforbrexit.co.uk/, http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-bri...-idUKKCN0XP15O, http://www.express.co.uk/news/politi...e-Remain-Leave, for a start).

    Again with scientists - many are also for Leave (see : http://scientistsforbritain.uk/wordpress/?page_id=54 for example). Many don't want to leave the EU as it is their primary source of funding. If you work in a University, you will know you are pressured to get funding from various souces as it boosts the universities REF score, which in turn results in a greater allocation of state funds. However the EU is not the only source of funding for science : http://scientistsforbritain.uk/wordpress/?p=101

    You also have to look at who funds the research for the remain camp. An economist funded by theEU government is not going to spin a negative portrait of the EU economy - even though it is failing ! Were you never taught to examine the bias and motives behind research ?
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    People in this thread seem to like to discredit experts but having experts is the very reason we have representatives in the House of Commons and not direct democracy.

    We elect people who represent our opinions and who are educated enough to make the best decision for us.

    Just think about why this version of democracy is chosen before you argue that your opinion is somewhat better than the majority of experts.
 
 
 
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