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Corbyn vs Eagle watch

  • View Poll Results: Corbyn or Eagle?
    Corbyn
    594
    77.14%
    Eagle
    176
    22.86%

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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    This country is one of the most socially liberal countries in the world. Out conservative party just legalised gay marriage.
    If you are progressive economically and despise immigration you will always do well in England
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    (Original post by george_c00per)
    The size of the membership isn't meaningless whatsoever. More Labour Party Members = more people who will campaign for a Labour success in 2020, which will divert more attention to the party locally = more votes for Labour. It also shows a rise in popularity and hints a win in the next general election, it happened in the early 1990s before Labour came into power and this pattern is showing to repeat itself now.

    I'm glad he didn't back bombing ISIS as many Labour supporters + me included thought that it was a bad and ineffective way of eliminating a terrorist organisation, as well as it being a massive waste of money. This won't stop him becoming PM - there are more people who agree with what he stood for than you think. Also, backing bombing Syria will displace more people which will mean there will be more refugees.

    On the topic of refugees, he has never said that he wants to take in more ISIS members disguised as refugees at all. That's just you making assumptions of the refugees coming into this country.

    OK, I don't know about you but I don't think there are 4 million Labour supporters who voted Labour last year and won't vote for it now. He won the Labour leadership election by a landslide, and he is incredibly popular with the Labour public.
    But not popular with the country
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    This country is one of the most socially liberal countries in the world. Out conservative party just legalised gay marriage.
    Don't assume the country is liberal because the government pushes through liberal social policy. British governments have almost always been ahead of the public in terms of social policy. The raising of the age of consent for gay sex, divorce laws and a few others were all pushed through against a skeptical population that came around to the ideas later on.
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    (Original post by GrangeRange)
    But not popular with the country
    I wouldn't say that Cameron was popular with the public during his leadership, and he still became PM.
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    Anyone suggesting Corbyn should be replaced by a neoliberal or neoconservative Blairite Tory in red clothing is deluding themselves. Corbyn has not drove the party into the ground, but he's been betrayed by the self serving backstabbers in his party.
    Why anyone would vote for another Tory-lite Labour Party is beyond me. If you want a party that will suck up to corporate interest whilst making you poorer, just go and vote for the Tories themselves.

    Corbyn is being smeared left, right and centre because he goes against this agenda and is a socialist. If Corbyn is replaced by a Blairite then I will not vote Labour in the next election, pure and simple.
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    I'm still at a loss as to why Corbyn half-arsed his "Remain" campaign and then voted to leave. Given that he's already got the immigrant and "gluten-free hipster leftie" votes locked down, he could have really pushed the "Leave" agenda which might have got the Labour strongholds who shudder at the fear of immigration on his side as opposed to UKIP or whoever.
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    As others have noted Eagle is a terrible candidate who seemingly thinks she can win purely by not being Corbyn.
    I think it is brave if her to stand though- that Momentum lot are genuinely nuts.

    I think this is a very half hearted attempt at saving what is essentially a lost cause. What will be telling will be how many (if any) have the guts to split and form a new party.
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    (Original post by george_c00per)
    When Labour Membership has been growing constantly since he has gotten into power I wouldn't necessarily say he has led the party into the ground
    But who? Would you say a drive done by the BNP would be good if they got more members? All Corbyn has done is brought about a large grassroots movement of people who support unelectable policies for the majority.

    His party has one role at the moment (be the opposition) and he has failed to do that ergo he is not fit to lead Labour.



    (Original post by welshiee)
    Anyone suggesting Corbyn should be replaced by a neoliberal or neoconservative Blairite Tory in red clothing is deluding themselves. Corbyn has not drove the party into the ground, but he's been betrayed by the self serving backstabbers in his party.
    Why anyone would vote for another Tory-lite Labour Party is beyond me. If you want a party that will suck up to corporate interest whilst making you poorer, just go and vote for the Tories themselves.

    Corbyn is being smeared left, right and centre because he goes against this agenda and is a socialist. If Corbyn is replaced by a Blairite then I will not vote Labour in the next election, pure and simple.
    How is failing to be the opposition not failing at his job? He's killed Labour and returned it to the crap old days of Labour constantly infighting.
    All you people need to get familiar with politics rather than being 5 minute experts. Labour was unelectable until it became united and New Labour, like it or not, was the most successful stint Labour ever had. Milband led to Corbyn and has undone 25 years of progress. That's just ****ing great....
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    How is failing to be the opposition not failing at his job? He's killed Labour and returned it to the crap old days of Labour constantly infighting.
    All you people need to get familiar with politics rather than being 5 minute experts. Labour was unelectable until it became united and New Labour, like it or not, was the most successful stint Labour ever had. Milband led to Corbyn and has undone 25 years of progress. That's just ****ing great....
    Labour during that 'successful stint' was Tory-lite. If you think that they represented you then you are deluded beyond belief. Corbyn has not killed the Labour Party. The self serving snake Blairites in the party who have stabbed him in and all of us in the back have. Anyone voting for a Blairite is a turkey voting for Christmas.
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    (Original post by welshiee)
    Labour during that 'successful stint' was Tory-lite. If you think that they represented you then you are deluded beyond belief. Corbyn has not killed the Labour Party. The self serving snake Blairites in the party who have stabbed him in and all of us in the back have. Anyone voting for a Blairite is a turkey voting for Christmas.
    O right I didn't realize that the Good Friday agreement, Tax credits, Immigration relaxation are all Tory-lite policies.....:rolleyes:
    You kids just want the bloody red book and tanks rolling through Westminster.

    How is a man who is utterly unelectable, useless in leading, pathetic/nonexistent at fulfilling his role at challenging the Tories doing good? You are complaining about the crew throwing the Captain off the ship when the Captain insists on sailing into an Iceberg. You can believe the Titanic is unsinkable, but you are flat out wrong.
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    Labour members seem to think the way to win is to appeal to a narrow fringe.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    O right I didn't realize that the Good Friday agreement, Tax credits, Immigration relaxation are all Tory-lite policies.....:rolleyes:
    You kids just want the bloody red book and tanks rolling through Westminster.

    How is a man who is utterly unelectable, useless in leading, pathetic/nonexistent at fulfilling his role at challenging the Tories doing good? You are complaining about the crew throwing the Captain off the ship when the Captain insists on sailing into an Iceberg. You can believe the Titanic is unsinkable, but you are flat out wrong.
    Wish I could double rep you.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    O right I didn't realize that the Good Friday agreement, Tax credits, Immigration relaxation are all Tory-lite policies.....:rollseyes:
    Good Friday Agreement: That was just common sense regardless of left/right wing politics
    Tax credits: make people reliant on the state - condemn them to servitude - give a man a fish vs teach a man to fish etc.
    Immigration relaxation: allows large corporations to exploit labour which has happened - for example, Poles exploited in the construction industry

    Go on....keep telling me how a man who adored Thatcher, claimed he would never stand on a leftist platform and was a centre-right capitalism gave a **** about the people....capitalism at its very core cares about profits, not people.







    You kids just want the bloody red book and tanks rolling through Westminster.
    No, I don't. Stop putting words in the mouths of others, prat.
    How is a man who is utterly unelectable, useless in leading, pathetic/nonexistent at fulfilling his role at challenging the Tories doing good? You are complaining about the crew throwing the Captain off the ship when the Captain insists on sailing into an Iceberg. You can believe the Titanic is unsinkable, but you are flat out wrong.
    Because there are numerous things that will play into his hands:

    a) Tories have to deal with the difficulties of Brexit
    b) Tories have to deal with possible issues with their own party
    c) Already there's been talk of many angry Tories switching to UKIP because of May becoming PM
    d) As austerity increases Corbyn will gather more and more support, especially during tough times with a devalued pound

    He will gain momentum. Its just people like you think everything must happen immediately because you've been spoilt your entire lives and weren't told no enough by your parents. Shame. As for you probably going to go on about the EU referendum, he's a Eurosceptic, of course he was not going to go out campaigning to remain 24/7. He did enough to appease the scumbags in his party.
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    Whilst I would like Corbyn to go, Eagle is even worse and in my own opinion no more electable.

    If you're going to replace him, at least replace him with someone who is convincingly electable. Eagle isn't so at the moment my vote would go very reluctantly to Corbyn.

    However I do hope the party puts forward Owen Smith or Dan Jarvis and i would vote for either.
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    (Original post by Diego Costa)
    I'm still at a loss as to why Corbyn half-arsed his "Remain" campaign and then voted to leave. Given that he's already got the immigrant and "gluten-free hipster leftie" votes locked down, he could have really pushed the "Leave" agenda which might have got the Labour strongholds who shudder at the fear of immigration on his side as opposed to UKIP or whoever.
    a) Corbyn needed to appease the Blairite neoliberals in his party throughout the campaign
    b) After Article 50 is triggered the discussion surrounding immigration will die down and issues such as the NHS etc. will become more prominent, at which point Corbyn's momentum will increase tenfold
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    (Original post by welshiee)
    Good Friday Agreement: That was just common sense regardless of left/right wing politics
    Tax credits: make people reliant on the state - condemn them to servitude - give a man a fish vs teach a man to fish etc.
    Immigration relaxation: allows large corporations to exploit labour which has happened - for example, Poles exploited in the construction industry

    Go on....keep telling me how a man who adored Thatcher, claimed he would never stand on a leftist platform and was a centre-right capitalism gave a **** about the people....capitalism at its very core cares about profits, not people.








    No, I don't. Stop putting words in the mouths of others, prat.


    Because there are numerous things that will play into his hands:

    a) Tories have to deal with the difficulties of Brexit
    b) Tories have to deal with possible issues with their own party
    c) Already there's been talk of many angry Tories switching to UKIP because of May becoming PM
    d) As austerity increases Corbyn will gather more and more support, especially during tough times with a devalued pound

    He will gain momentum. Its just people like you think everything must happen immediately because you've been spoilt your entire lives and weren't told no enough by your parents. Shame. As for you probably going to go on about the EU referendum, he's a Eurosceptic, of course he was not going to go out campaigning to remain 24/7. He did enough to appease the scumbags in his party.
    Pahaha, you post inane pictures rather than facts, sources etc. Wow, how would that go down if you were writing an essay? :rofl:

    Right, you're the problem with democracy. The fact that you get the same vote as someone who is actually informed is just moronic. I mean how is tax credit not one step removed from communism? Haha, I won't bother replying to you again as I would have to teach you years of politics, economics etc just to get you to be able to comprehend this problem let alone debate it!
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    Corbyn has the same charisma as a tinned anchovy. However Angela Eagle is also an anchovy. And I am politically more in line with Corbyn. So against all my better judgement I guess I'd have to pick Corbyn. Realistically I wouldn't choose either to be PM.

    Theresa May's views are completely against more or less all of what I believe to be right in this world, but at the same time she's sure as hell competent and able to lead people.

    So it's between somebody who cannot lead but I agree with versus somebody who can lead but who I vehemently disagree with. What terrible, terrible options we have...

    At the end of the day IMO people will vote for somebody who they at least think can lead us over somebody who has a nice voting record and goes to Union meetings. Labour is doomed under Corbyn OR Eagle. Which is a crying shame because we need an opposition now more than ever before.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    Pahaha, you post inane pictures rather than facts, sources etc. Wow, how would that go down if you were writing an essay? :rofl:
    Im not writing an essay though, which is fundamentally different. Nice attempt to deflect the debate because you cannot respond. I have nothing to prove as I'm a successful graduate doing very well in life and you've been a troll on a forum for years....but yeah, you just go around telling people they're morons when its you who is quite clearly the abject failure in life.

    Right, you're the problem with democracy. The fact that you get the same vote as someone who is actually informed is just moronic. I mean how is tax credit not one step removed from communism? Haha, I won't bother replying to you again as I would have to teach you years of politics, economics etc just to get you to be able to comprehend this problem let alone debate it!
    aka 'I'm too much of a clueless troll to actually engage in a debate that requires at least 3 of my brain cells'.

    Tell us something we don't know.
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    (Original post by welshiee)
    a) Corbyn needed to appease the Blairite neoliberals in his party throughout the campaign
    b) After Article 50 is triggered the discussion surrounding immigration will die down and issues such as the NHS etc. will become more prominent, at which point Corbyn's momentum will increase tenfold
    a) Why? He admitted he didn't put full effort into the campaign and has more or less said he voted leave. It's not as though he's got unified support either.

    b) Immigration was always the hot topic. I doubt it will be put on the back-burner
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    O right I didn't realize that the Good Friday agreement, Tax credits, Immigration relaxation are all Tory-lite policies.....:rolleyes:
    You kids just want the bloody red book and tanks rolling through Westminster.

    How is a man who is utterly unelectable, useless in leading, pathetic/nonexistent at fulfilling his role at challenging the Tories doing good? You are complaining about the crew throwing the Captain off the ship when the Captain insists on sailing into an Iceberg. You can believe the Titanic is unsinkable, but you are flat out wrong.
    Good Friday was largely done by the major government


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