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I don't agree with some of the reasons why some people voted Brexit Watch

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    Here's me think it was gonna be a fredorjohn thread. I am pleasantly surprised, I thought that this sort of comedy was rare.
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    (Original post by 1010marina)
    But you can't deny that there are very, very efficient measures to open access to all genders, ethnic minorities, etc.

    Beyond that - upper class students are more likely to go to grammar school... Be raised positively... They're more likely to be confident and it's no secret that interview performance often trumps the candidate's skillset on paper. So yes. You have an advantage if you are white and male and go to a grammar school. But statistically speaking white boys in your run of the mill state school are most likely to fall behind and struggle. So really there are benefits and drawbacks. And if you think "confidence" isn't a benefit for securing a job then you're going to struggle getting one. Toodles.
    Oh you must be new here. Try living in the north east as a minority.

    I am confident, I speak well (i have the cv to back it up too)... I did a law degree and spoke regularly in public settings. Still, the white guy who is exactly the same on paper (I have checked , many) gets the roles. If you are denying there is mass discrimination then you are in denial altogether. Look, many of those that voted for Brexit are not just anti EU workers, they are anti anyone that is not white and British.

    White men playing the victim card is laughable.

    I have a white full name, so i get called to a lot of interviews. When i switched my name to an African name as an experiment guess what the result was?
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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    Still, the white guy who is exactly the same on paper (I have checked , many) gets the roles.
    Couple things here...

    1- Isn't that an invasion of privacy (you checking their papers) or something along those lines? Either way, privacy concerns right there, and probably illegal, if not borderline illegal.
    2- "On paper"... You can be the best person in the world on paper, if the interview goes better for someone else, that someone else will likely get the job.

    There's certainly discrimination going on behind closed doors, but the whole "we're the same on paper" argument doesn't stand up.
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    (Original post by TheMcSame)
    Couple things here...

    1- Isn't that an invasion of privacy (you checking their papers) or something along those lines? Either way, privacy concerns right there, and probably illegal, if not borderline illegal.
    2- "On paper"... You can be the best person in the world on paper, if the interview goes better for someone else, that someone else will likely get the job.

    There's certainly discrimination going on behind closed doors, but the whole "we're the same on paper" argument doesn't stand up.
    The people I checked were friends from my course from university, we compared cv's and we had virtually the same experiences. If you want a totally perfect test with scientific conditions then sorry I won't be able to do that. But I sense that is the standard of proof you would want since people seem unwilling to admit that their country is deeply racist in areas outside London.
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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    Typically: open racism, blaming the unemployed, delusions of Britain's bargaining power with the EU.

    I don't regret voting for Brexit because economically I think it is necessary, the EU is a sinking ship.

    However, I hate the types of people that have come out in force. Confident that the referendum result has reinforced their bigotry. Yeah, have fun losing a significant wedge of diplomatic leverage, have fun kowtowing to your new Chinese Communist masters.

    On a different point, I think the gradual descent into this situation was already well in earnest after the 2015 election. The turkeys voted for christmas. Because opposition parties are so ineffectual, we voted for a government that has been useless at repairing the economy and are hellbent on creating a social environment where all of the disenfranchised get attacked.

    1. If you are disabled, you are on your own. Sorry.
    2. If you are unemployed then it must always be your fault! Stop feeling sorry for yourself! Never mind the totally decimated economy we are facing right now. The Tories are in power so the economy is actually doing great and you're just not trying hard enough! I am sorry, but this is just an older generation and deluded people being totally unreasonable. Baby boomers ate from the cradles of their children with the economic choices they made. Then they pull the drawbridge up and tell us to all work harder. It is a lot of rubbish.
    3. Fear of UKIP has led to a harsh shift towards targeting migrants. The Conservatives have legitimized this shift. Of course, we all know that this means anyone that is not white and British. Don't get this twisted, its all about racism. And believe me, underneath the thin surface this country is very racist. We have a lot of good people but there is a significant amount of people that are very keen to dish it out to anyone that is not white British.
    4. Idiotic notions such as 'positive discrimination' are perpetuated. They are drops in the ocean in the context of the overall picture. Let's get this straight, if you're white and male, you have a much better chance than everyone else at gaining opportunities because believe it or not, there is a lot of favouritism working in your favour. People pretend that we live in a post racial society. If anything, the current climate is every bit as volatile as the 80s.
    5. Societal fragmentation from inequality. The haves and have nots. The gap is ever wider between the rich and poor. The middle class are getting 'rekt' but their debt fueled lifestyles pay for their pretensions of privilege. This inequality is constantly shoved in our faces in the media and social media. This leads to totally fractured communities. Money divides people, many of the haves start thinking that the have nots must be poor because its their own fault.

    Tory Britain everyone.

    Again, I must reiterate, this **** show has been allowed to go on because opposition parties have been so ineffectual at presenting themselves. The Conservatives have been so ineffectual at managing debt levels, their apparent economic pedigree is farcical in the present day. Their approach? Kick the can further down the road. They know we are economically doomed but are happy to exacerbate societal divisions to maintain power.

    For an explanation of the economic reality regardless of a Brexit or Bremain I have attached a presentation I prepared:
    Incorrect on many levels, Firstly open racism is less of a problem then many may think and has less of an impact, the equality act of 2010 makes it Illegal to directly or indirectly discriminate against race- as this is in the group of protected characteristics, I appreciate that this does not stop people being racist, but people who are openly racist, was indeed racist before brexit. I for one think that it is exaggerated as a problem and has very little impact, there was 84 racial hatred crimes here after the referendum result this was up 57% compared with the month before the vote and the amount of racial hatred crimes was 54, does this sound like a problem which needs to be aired nationally, i dont see it as much of a problem, in fact racial hate crimes was higher in the 70's and 80's. Liberal media and education go into overdrive over it to try and make the country even more politically correct, and in the media's case to make a few bob off the headlines. They need to get over themselves 84 racial hate crimes is very minute when you compare it to Israel/palestine and the middle east the only way it will affect the foreign population is that it will make them want to leave the country as they feel they are being forced out, if it does , we will only lose a few off our population as it is not widespread or regular enough to cause a massive problem

    In terms of the disabled i 100 percent agree that they are discriminated against especially in the recruitment and selection process, if you are a hiring manager and you have a disabled candidate and a candidate with no defects they will go for the non disabled candidate so they can dodge the costs of making reasonable adjustments. The government have made it hard for the disabled with out boring everyone - have a read of this (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17288762)

    With your second point, there will never ever be full employment, there is a natural level of unemployment- the phillips curve displays this. But there are a lot of unemployed people who do not try hard enough to find a job , and its not made easy for the long term unemployed , while we are still a fully functioning member of the EU (which we are until article 50 is invoked) there will be floods of migrants fleeing to here and they have more recent work experience then out unemployed giving them an advantage, the more people out of work and wanting employment, the higher the demand becomes for jobs while the supply remains stagnant. The migrants are at an advantage because of there low wage demands and experience compared to our long term unemployed so that is a very valid point. Other than that your post is quite reasoned
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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    The people I checked were friends from my course from university, we compared cv's and we had virtually the same experiences. If you want a totally perfect test with scientific conditions then sorry I won't be able to do that. But I sense that is the standard of proof you would want since people seem unwilling to admit that their country is deeply racist in areas outside London.
    Your argument is that you and your friends are the same on paper. Your friend's interview could've gone better than yours. That doesn't make me a racist sympathiser as you so imply.

    If anything, it makes you ignorant, CV's are just part of the process. A mediocre CV with a good interview is going to sit much better with an employer than a good CV and a mediocre (or worse) interview.
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    (Original post by TheMcSame)
    Your argument is that you and your friends are the same on paper. Your friend's interview could've gone better than yours. That doesn't make me a racist sympathiser as you so imply.

    If anything, it makes you ignorant, CV's are just part of the process. A mediocre CV with a good interview is going to sit much better with an employer than a good CV and a mediocre (or worse) interview.
    Have you ever considered that the interviewees merits at interview are pretty inconsequential? They could just not like x,y,z ethnic minority and ex post facto rationalise their decisions. They don't need to give reasons. If anything, this makes you ignorant.
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    The people asking to 'get over it' or similar haven't read the post in it's entirety, and have clearly just assumed this person is a remainer.
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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    The people I checked were friends from my course from university, we compared cv's and we had virtually the same experiences. If you want a totally perfect test with scientific conditions then sorry I won't be able to do that. But I sense that is the standard of proof you would want since people seem unwilling to admit that their country is deeply racist in areas outside London.
    I find it funny that people still deny that there is discrimination against minorities in this country. Obviously 99% of the time you won't get attacked on the street because of your difference but institutional racism does exist to this day. There was even a study done a few years ago where people with ethnic sounding name with the same qualifications and experience were not called to interview compared to people with English sounding names.
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    (Original post by TheTechN1304)
    So using your argument, all Muslims are responsible for the recent terror attacks, and it's deplorable that they absolve themselves from any responsibility? Stupidity at its finest...
    I think they have not done nearly enough as a community to root out extremism in their communities and. It is not exactly false to say that.
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    (Original post by TheTechN1304)
    Yawn. We voted to leave, get over it. Despite what you think, many people who voted are not racist, unemployed, uneducated bigots. If anything, you generalising 52% of the population in that way makes you the bigot. It's time to move on. Having a tantrum won't solve anything.
    I absolutely agree with you there. I know most Brexiters who voted leave and they are certainly NOT unemployed uneducated bigots. They went to university and actually became an adult, going to work and pay taxes - UNLIKE OP who is still making baby tantrums over something which happened weeks ago.

    Move on OP. Your side lost. After protests and a petition, you still lost. Get over it! :yawn:
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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    Typically: open racism, blaming the unemployed, delusions of Britain's bargaining power with the EU.

    I don't regret voting for Brexit because economically I think it is necessary, the EU is a sinking ship.

    However, I hate the types of people that have come out in force. Confident that the referendum result has reinforced their bigotry. Yeah, have fun losing a significant wedge of diplomatic leverage, have fun kowtowing to your new Chinese Communist masters.

    On a different point, I think the gradual descent into this situation was already well in earnest after the 2015 election. The turkeys voted for christmas. Because opposition parties are so ineffectual, we voted for a government that has been useless at repairing the economy and are hellbent on creating a social environment where all of the disenfranchised get attacked.

    1. If you are disabled, you are on your own. Sorry.
    2. If you are unemployed then it must always be your fault! Stop feeling sorry for yourself! Never mind the totally decimated economy we are facing right now. The Tories are in power so the economy is actually doing great and you're just not trying hard enough! I am sorry, but this is just an older generation and deluded people being totally unreasonable. Baby boomers ate from the cradles of their children with the economic choices they made. Then they pull the drawbridge up and tell us to all work harder. It is a lot of rubbish.
    3. Fear of UKIP has led to a harsh shift towards targeting migrants. The Conservatives have legitimized this shift. Of course, we all know that this means anyone that is not white and British. Don't get this twisted, its all about racism. And believe me, underneath the thin surface this country is very racist. We have a lot of good people but there is a significant amount of people that are very keen to dish it out to anyone that is not white British.
    4. Idiotic notions such as 'positive discrimination' are perpetuated. They are drops in the ocean in the context of the overall picture. Let's get this straight, if you're white and male, you have a much better chance than everyone else at gaining opportunities because believe it or not, there is a lot of favouritism working in your favour. People pretend that we live in a post racial society. If anything, the current climate is every bit as volatile as the 80s.
    5. Societal fragmentation from inequality. The haves and have nots. The gap is ever wider between the rich and poor. The middle class are getting 'rekt' but their debt fueled lifestyles pay for their pretensions of privilege. This inequality is constantly shoved in our faces in the media and social media. This leads to totally fractured communities. Money divides people, many of the haves start thinking that the have nots must be poor because its their own fault.

    Tory Britain everyone.

    Again, I must reiterate, this **** show has been allowed to go on because opposition parties have been so ineffectual at presenting themselves. The Conservatives have been so ineffectual at managing debt levels, their apparent economic pedigree is farcical in the present day. Their approach? Kick the can further down the road. They know we are economically doomed but are happy to exacerbate societal divisions to maintain power.

    For an explanation of the economic reality regardless of a Brexit or Bremain I have attached a presentation I prepared:
    Your thread title is hypocritical after some behaviours of the Remoaners (deliberate misspelling because thats all your side ever does) in this forum. Throwing toys out of the pram type.

    I am personally and politically against the concept of a second referendum because it is a waste of time and money for the government; it is also actually an already embarrassing affair right now.
    We have a new government (still Conservative Party though) but with different people, because David Cameron had the guts to resign after being humiliated with the Brexit result. Some people are against the idea of still having Boris Johnson being in the team as the new Foreign Secretary, and most importantly the pound has dropped significantly in years. You can't just simply turn back time to change all of those things can you?

    Also what does happen after the result of the second referendum, a third, fourth, fifth - if neither side agrees with the result - or even worse, causing riots? I do not want a repeat of 2011.

    In this day and age we can't always please everyone and we have to accept what has happened.
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    you know why I voted out it was the hope to move my business a little more by getting the volatile markets flowing and it worked hence how come I am writing this on an iPad from my air conditioned Mercedes with a 2016 two tone Rolex 41mm Datejust on one wrist and a big diamond smothered bracelet on the other
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    Get over it you fools,
    We're leaving and that's that.
    You'll thank us later when you see the worsening state of turkey


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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    Typically: open racism, blaming the unemployed, delusions of Britain's bargaining power with the EU.

    I don't regret voting for Brexit because economically I think it is necessary, the EU is a sinking ship.

    However, I hate the types of people that have come out in force. Confident that the referendum result has reinforced their bigotry. Yeah, have fun losing a significant wedge of diplomatic leverage, have fun kowtowing to your new Chinese Communist masters.

    On a different point, I think the gradual descent into this situation was already well in earnest after the 2015 election. The turkeys voted for christmas. Because opposition parties are so ineffectual, we voted for a government that has been useless at repairing the economy and are hellbent on creating a social environment where all of the disenfranchised get attacked.

    Tory Britain everyone.

    Again, I must reiterate, this **** show has been allowed to go on because opposition parties have been so ineffectual at presenting themselves. The Conservatives have been so ineffectual at managing debt levels, their apparent economic pedigree is farcical in the present day. Their approach? Kick the can further down the road. They know we are economically doomed but are happy to exacerbate societal divisions to maintain power.
    Please, do tell us on what magical method you are basing your broad based opinions?

    I've seen quite the oposite. Leavers have been pasted as uneducated morons by the Rrmain side. THey've also been openly attacked by some actually quite nasty people. They've also been singled out by the media, perticularly channel 4 and the NotsoIndependant interviewing loads of leavers untill they get the one that foams at the mouth over immigrants etc, then broadcast that one attempting to portray all leavers as racists.

    So yeah, they doesn't exactly paint some parts of the Remain side in exactly flying colours.

    With regards to Conservatives and debt, they've actually been very good. If there is one thing that's been good it's been their reduction in the national deficit.

    And the tories are ineffectual compared to whom? Labor? lol, please don't make me laugh. Labor is the biggest joke in politics right now.

    Good job.
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    (Original post by Pegasus2)
    Please, do tell us on what magical method you are basing your broad based opinions?

    I've seen quite the oposite. Leavers have been pasted as uneducated morons by the Rrmain side. THey've also been openly attacked by some actually quite nasty people. They've also been singled out by the media, perticularly channel 4 and the NotsoIndependant interviewing loads of leavers untill they get the one that foams at the mouth over immigrants etc, then broadcast that one attempting to portray all leavers as racists.

    So yeah, they doesn't exactly paint some parts of the Remain side in exactly flying colours.

    With regards to Conservatives and debt, they've actually been very good. If there is one thing that's been good it's been their reduction in the national deficit.

    And the tories are ineffectual compared to whom? Labor? lol, please don't make me laugh. Labor is the biggest joke in politics right now.

    Good job.
    Omfg you are wrong. So very wrong lol!!
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    (Original post by Boreism)
    Your thread title is hypocritical after some behaviours of the Remoaners (deliberate misspelling because thats all your side ever does) in this forum. Throwing toys out of the pram type.

    I am personally and politically against the concept of a second referendum because it is a waste of time and money for the government; it is also actually an already embarrassing affair right now.
    We have a new government (still Conservative Party though) but with different people, because David Cameron had the guts to resign after being humiliated with the Brexit result. Some people are against the idea of still having Boris Johnson being in the team as the new Foreign Secretary, and most importantly the pound has dropped significantly in years. You can't just simply turn back time to change all of those things can you?

    Also what does happen after the result of the second referendum, a third, fourth, fifth - if neither side agrees with the result - or even worse, causing riots? I do not want a repeat of 2011.

    In this day and age we can't always please everyone and we have to accept what has happened.

    Again, read the goddamn original post in its entirety. The reading and comprehension skills of supposedly educated people is ridiculously low.

    Who is asking for a second referendum? Not me.
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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    Oh you must be new here. Try living in the north east as a minority.

    I am confident, I speak well (i have the cv to back it up too)... I did a law degree and spoke regularly in public settings. Still, the white guy who is exactly the same on paper (I have checked , many) gets the roles. If you are denying there is mass discrimination then you are in denial altogether. Look, many of those that voted for Brexit are not just anti EU workers, they are anti anyone that is not white and British.

    White men playing the victim card is laughable.

    I have a white full name, so i get called to a lot of interviews. When i switched my name to an African name as an experiment guess what the result was?
    If you don't get a job at an interview, perhaps it's not always time to start calling flaws in the system (:
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    James, or whatever your real name is, me ol' mucka

    You have alleged that it must be US that has stopped you getting a job despite your qualifications. You claim to speak well but it is is much about the content as it is the delivery. Eloquence will only get you so far before people get turned off or offended at being unjustly labelled racist. Ring any bells?

    After reading your hissy fit I wonder whether your holier than thou attitude comes across in interviews and employers think you won't be a team player. If you came across in an interview like you have come across in this thread I wouldn't employ you no matter how impressive you were 'on paper'.

    It's not always someone else's fault you know.

    That advice is giving you the benefit that you are real. I actually wouldn't be surprised if you are not but hey ho.
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    Stfu you stupid Marxist ******* OP


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