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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Corbyn is soft left...

    Lol, he does a good job pretending he is. If you look into some of his dodgy mates then opinions change very quickly.
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    (Original post by JamesN88)
    Haha.

    I understood heavy weapons to mean **** like artillery and anti-tank missiles, so I answered no.
    I answered "no" as well because of the purpose. For museal and hobbistic purposes they should be allowed to have (disarmed) heavy weapons (though tank is dangerous enough even without operational gun).
    But thinking about it now, armed societies rarely brought chaos and revolutions.

    Besides, presume that government breaks the country's constitution, bet there is political mechanism to execute it (obviously an error in law), so army does nothing about (or presume, that army is on government's site).
    Wouldn't it better, if citizens had resources to overthrow the government, rather foreign forces who may not understand local situation and act for own interests?
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    (Original post by PTMalewski)
    I answered "no" as well because of the purpose. For museal and hobbistic purposes they should be allowed to have (disarmed) heavy weapons (though tank is dangerous enough even without operational gun).
    But thinking about it now, armed societies rarely brought chaos and revolutions.

    Besides, presume that government breaks the country's constitution, bet there is political mechanism to execute it (obviously an error in law), so army does nothing about (or presume, that army is on government's site).
    Wouldn't it better, if citizens had resources to overthrow the government, rather foreign forces who may not understand local situation and act for own interests?
    Whilst I see the point supporters of this viewpoint are making, realistically if the government had the army on its side then an armed populace would never be able to overthrow them. Modern technology simply makes this no longer viable, even though the army would be immensely outnumbered (which doesn't really matter since how would the civilian population even attempt to take out a tank or fighter jet?)

    I think Thomas Jefferson is a great man and at the time of framing the US constitution (closest direct comparison to us) he had a strong point after experience under the monarchy, but at the present time this same mentality just simply isn't applicable.
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    You are a: Objectivist Anti-Government Non-Interventionist Cosmopolitan Moderate Collectivism score: -83%
    Authoritarianism score: -33%
    Internationalism score: -33%
    Tribalism score: -17%
    Liberalism score: 0%
    ...
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    (Original post by PTMalewski)
    I answered "no" as well because of the purpose. For museal and hobbistic purposes they should be allowed to have (disarmed) heavy weapons (though tank is dangerous enough even without operational gun).
    But thinking about it now, armed societies rarely brought chaos and revolutions.

    Besides, presume that government breaks the country's constitution, bet there is political mechanism to execute it (obviously an error in law), so army does nothing about (or presume, that army is on government's site).
    Wouldn't it better, if citizens had resources to overthrow the government, rather foreign forces who may not understand local situation and act for own interests?
    You can own disarmed tank here without any restrictions apart from a driving licence. I've no idea how easy it is to reactivate them(if possible at all?).

    Considering the UK is safe and stable enough for the police to not routinely carry guns I'm struggling to feel the need for a howitzer in my back garden.
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    (Original post by JamesN88)
    You can own disarmed tank here without any restrictions apart from a driving licence. I've no idea how easy it is to reactivate them(if possible at all?).
    I think it isn't, most difficult is to get ammo for it.

    (Original post by JRKinder)
    (which doesn't really matter since how would the civilian population even attempt to take out a tank or fighter jet?)
    With proper though very expensive arms it is not impossible.

    (Original post by JRKinder)
    I think Thomas Jefferson is a great man and at the time of framing the US constitution (closest direct comparison to us) he had a strong point after experience under the monarchy, but at the present time this same mentality just simply isn't applicable.
    I would add to this that in extreme cases unarmed civilians probably would be able to overthrow government even against army, in European countries. (soldiers would refuse to shoot civilians)
    Other parts of the World may be different though.
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    Socialist Totalitarian Isolationist Nationalist Reactionary
    Collectivism score: 50%
    Authoritarianism score: 100%
    Internationalism score: -67%
    Tribalism score: 17%
    Liberalism score: -67%

    Not quite sure I'd describe myself as such but hey-ho.
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    You are a: Objectivist Anarchist Non-Interventionist Bleeding-Heart Progressive
    Collectivism score: -100%
    Authoritarianism score: -100%
    Internationalism score: -33%
    Tribalism score: -83%
    Liberalism score: 67%

    Objectivist? the ****?!
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    (Original post by PTMalewski)
    I think it isn't, most difficult is to get ammo for it.


    With proper though very expensive arms it is not impossible.



    I would add to this that in extreme cases unarmed civilians probably would be able to overthrow government even against army, in European countries. (soldiers would refuse to shoot civilians)
    Other parts of the World may be different though.
    So you're saying all citizens should have the right to own anti-air guns, rocket launchers etc.? This is just foolish and could lead to disastrous losses of life. But if you just mean things like guns as in America, then I still maintain that these would not be enough to overthrow the government. The only thing that would really be stopping the army from quelling the uprising would be their lack of numbers & hence abilitity to fight on all fronts. As for your latter point then yeah, if the army refused to shoot then of course they could overthrow the government without weapons. But that's just hypothetical, and for all intents and purposes is unlikely. And if it was likely, then there'd be no need for citizens to have weapons in the first place. It honestly just depends on whether the soldiers saw themselves as part of the government or one of the people, so to say. For the situation we're discussing though I think it's reasonable to suppose they would fight back, just because we're talking about arming the populace.
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    (Original post by JamesN88)
    Lol, he does a good job pretending he is. If you look into some of his dodgy mates then opinions change very quickly.
    Personally, I think he has very bad judgement and is naive in terms of some of the groups and individuals he engages with. But his willingness to do so doesn't come from any far leftist ideology; he is just a social liberal, carried along by certain strains of humanitarian discourse. He is hardly a Marxist. And that is actually my biggest issue with him and a large part of his support: a seeming naivety and lack of knowledge of the history and complexity of left wing thought. I saw a Cornyn supporter decry Owen Smith the other for "stealing" Corbyn's policies, as if they sprung fully formed from Corbyn's head, as if Corbyn invented social democracy.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    You are a: Left-Leaning World-Federalist Humanist Liberal
    Collectivism score: 33%
    Authoritarianism score: 0%
    Internationalism score: 83%
    Tribalism score: -50%
    Liberalism score: 33%
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    Collectivism score: -33%Authoritarianism score: -83%Internationalism score: 33%Tribalism score: 17%Liberalism score: -50%
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    You are a: Communist Authoritarian Multilateralist Bleeding-Heart Liberal
    Collectivism score: 83%Authoritarianism score: 50%Internationalism score: 50%Tribalism score: -100%Liberalism score: 17%
    Umm...No?
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    You are a: Conservative Libertarian Isolationist Nativist Reactionary
    Collectivism score: -67%
    Authoritarianism score: -50%
    Internationalism score: -50%
    Tribalism score: 67%
    Liberalism score: -67%
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    You are a: Right-Leaning Libertarian Non-Interventionist Nativist Moderate

    Collectivism score: -33%
    Authoritarianism score: -50%
    Internationalism score: -33%
    Tribalism score: 67%
    Liberalism score: 0%
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    this quiz is wrong.

    You are a: Right-Leaning Authoritarian Multilateralist Liberal
    Collectivism score: -33%
    Authoritarianism score: 50%
    Internationalism score: 50%
    Tribalism score: 0%
    Liberalism score: 17%


    on most quizzes I am centre-left. but I don't mind being called a authoritarian multilateralist liberal
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    Left-Leaning Totalitarian Interventionist Nationalist Liberal
    Collectivism score: 33%
    Authoritarianism score: 100%
    Internationalism score: 33%
    Tribalism score: 33%
    Liberalism score: 33%

    "Liberal" :rofl:

    30 questions isn't enough to be even vaguely accurate, the questions were often very leading, through being needlessly extreme; e.g. I wouldn't "just nuke all our enemies", because I would fear a counter attack; but I would nuke a lot of them, if there were no counterattack. Or am I being too literal?

    So I tried it again, just changing my answer to that one question, and now I am a:
    Left-Leaning Totalitarian Interventionist Nativist Liberal
    Collectivism score: 33%
    Authoritarianism score: 100%
    Internationalism score: 33%
    Tribalism score: 67%
    Liberalism score: 33%

    If I had to guess, I'd award myself:
    Far-Left Totalitarian Interventionist Nativist Collectivist
    Collectivism score: 100%
    Authoritarianism score: 100%
    Internationalism score: low
    Tribalism score: medium
    Liberalism score: low

    I call myself a European Nationalist; so that probably throws a spanner in the "nationalism vs internationalism" aspect.
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    (Original post by jake4198)
    You are a: Conservative Libertarian Isolationist Nativist Reactionary
    Collectivism score: -67%
    Authoritarianism score: -50%
    Internationalism score: -50%
    Tribalism score: 67%
    Liberalism score: -67%
    explains a lot of your views
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    explains a lot of your views
    Which views would those be?
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    You are a: Socialist Anti-Government Multilateralist Humanist Liberal

    Collectivism score: 67%
    Authoritarianism score: -17%
    Internationalism score: 50%
    Tribalism score: -67%
    Liberalism score: 17%

    oh damn, i'm a liberal!!!
 
 
 
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