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Follower of the Religion of peace stabs man to death over "religious argument" watch

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    (Original post by Saba XD)
    This is what the OP said in a post. Isn't it the exact opposite of what you said? Or is there a difference which I am not able to tell?

    You can't just pick and choose what applies to you and what doesn't. If Muhammed is truly a prophet then you should believe every thing he says, you can't call yourself a muslim if you doubt or disbelieve in him.
    You're right but I would argue the opposite if a person say they are a Muslim then they are a Muslim.

    After all it is only the 5 pillars that make someone a Muslim so breaking parts of their faith doesn't change the way they see themselves (especially for Islam where a lot of it is open to interpretation)
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    Again you have to highlight the religion. If he wasn't Muslim the news story would probably be ' DRUNK MAN KILLS ACQUAINTANCE OVER WEIRD ARGUEMENTS'. You need to stop labelling all Muslims as bad people. If someone kill someone else there probably crazy or violent. However, if a 'Muslim' kills someone its automatically a terrorism attack. I don't know about then, but now it seems like journalists deliberately make their stories more 'juicy' by adding 'Muslim' or 'Islam'. Their words describing people following their religion. If you don't follow the same religion so be it. Leave their views and beliefs alone and stop marinating stories with this 'special sauce' to get views. Yes, you can identify someone's religion in the news, yet if your going that far might as well create a database for their name, address, grandparents, inherited diseases and cousins twice removed. What do you think would have happened if the British guy that tried killing Donald Trump was Muslim? Long story short it would have been all over the world. But since he wasn't, hardly anyone knows about it.This is a website for everyone, please for the sake of humanity think before you write.
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    (Original post by BaconandSauce)
    No wrong

    I know Muslims who drink, I know Muslim women who have partners who are not Muslims, muslims in sexual relationships who are not married, Muslims who gamble, Muslims who smoke weed and even the odd gay Muslim

    The one thing they all have in common is they ARE Muslim.
    So your mockery of the "religion of peace" is actually you mocking those who don't religiously follow the faith and aren't true muslims? Or do you still have the irrational need to find an easy solution to the problem and blame the entire religion?

    (Fyi, the former is the smart option)
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    (Original post by fksociety)
    So your mockery of the "religion of peace" is actually you mocking those who don't religiously follow the faith and aren't true muslims? Or do you still have the irrational need to find an easy solution to the problem and blame the entire religion?

    (Fyi, the former is the smart option)
    no it's mostly me mocking the religion of peace (it is after all the faith that just keeps giving)

    But there's nothing irrational about that
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    (Original post by BaconandSauce)
    no it's mostly me mocking the religion of peace (it is after all the faith that just keeps giving)

    But there's nothing irrational about that
    Perhaps there is issues with Islam (given that there are undoubtedly violent verses within the quran)

    But when these extremists do things that aren't condoned by the religions it is clear that the problem is the deep indoctrination of a religion with ancient morals different to the present days.

    What im trying to say is, the issue is the indoctrination of violent versions of Islam e.g. Wahhabism. (Im not an expert so do correct me lol)
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    (Original post by fksociety)
    Perhaps there is issues with Islam (given that there are undoubtedly violent verses within the quran)
    There are and there is no denying this

    (Original post by fksociety)
    But when these extremists do things that aren't condoned by the religions it is clear that the problem is the deep indoctrination of a religion with ancient morals different to the present days.
    And when they do things that at condoned by the faith? such as the issue of sex slaves and the sanctioned rape of women and children. what then?

    (Original post by fksociety)
    What im trying to say is, the issue is the indoctrination of violent versions of Islam e.g. Wahhabism. (Im not an expert so do correct me lol)
    The violent verse's exist in all branches of Islam the issues as you say is with those who choose follow them.

    But they are they and they exist and they cause real life problems

    This makes the religion of peace work mocking don't you think?
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    What's disgusting is the way Islam tries to cling onto the "religion of peace" epithet when it's completely undeserved and there are many other religions out there that fit that quality much better.
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    (Original post by BaconandSauce)
    There are and there is no denying this



    And when they do things that at condoned by the faith? such as the issue of sex slaves and the sanctioned rape of women and children. what then?



    The violent verse's exist in all branches of Islam the issues as you say is with those who choose follow them.

    But they are they and they exist and they cause real life problems

    This makes the religion of peace work mocking don't you think?
    Yes, I think this is the problem. The liberal media and the stigma associate with criticising Islam hasnt even got to the point where the issue has been highlighted.

    Surely criticising the entire religion is a little irrational? I mean, as you said, muslims who drink are still considered muslims. And muslims have attempted to Isolate themselves from the extremists. Whilst you are informed, many of the anti islam bigotry is through the fallacious correlation=causation fallacy and liberal islam still exists.

    I think we should focus our criticism on the conservative Islam and work to find a solution. After all, Islam is growing.
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    (Original post by Ua3142)
    New York Police say a Muslim woman whose traditional clothing was set alight in a suspected hate crime was a Scottish tourist visiting Manhattan.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/ne...-a7254891.html

    Deranged people do exist, regardless of religion.
    What's "deranged" about a Scottish person visiting Manhattan, Muslim or not?
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    (Original post by Ua3142)
    I get you, but it's simply not as easy as pointing a finger at a religion and saying 'ISLAM IS A RELIGION OF WAR!!'
    But it is as simple as saying that Islam is a religion of peace and violence, of tolerance and intolerance, of equality and discrimination.

    Different people then simply cherry-pick scripture to suit their agenda and they level of modernisation and revisionism that they are prepared to accept.
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    (Original post by ChuckNorriss)
    all the sources used in that vid dont apply to me (different school of thought) + author of source (ibn kathir) used was mainly influenced by wahabi/salafi ideology (basically isis) by the likes of ibn taymiyyah and ibn qayyim + no source for historical context.

    https://youtu.be/9PPthd_RfwM
    37:35-39:55
    explains 9:5 if you're interested.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    So, you are saying that his argument is technically valid, but just not for the particular madhab you follow.

    BTW, Ibn Kathir cannot have been influenced by wahabi/salafi ideology because he predates them. His tafsir is possibly the most widely used in the world, so his work clearly influences many millions of Muslims.

    [/quote] just make sure you are looking for the truth and not for reasons why islam is a religion of violence.[/quote] It is not difficult to identify the violent passages of the Quran and sunnah. And the question must be again asked (as I have never received an answer) - if the Quran is the perfect and final guide for all humanity, why did Allah put in so much stuff that only relates to events in 7th century Arabia unless they were meant to be used as some kind of example or guide?
    Thanks
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    (Original post by ImNotReallyMe)
    At the time before Islam, people of the different tribes were living quite recklessly
    So Islam came along, being a better way of living than the people before, it was therefore seen as more peaceful in comparison, hence 'religion of peace'

    Now humans have developed even more, with better systems, and so now Islam seems barbaric to us

    It was the religion of peace at its time, but not anymore
    Haha! Rubbish!
    Islam was never referred to as "the Religion of Peace" in the 7th century. The term originated with a book of the same name from 1930 and revived bost 9/11 by politicians like Bush, Obama and Cameron - I know, suprised, huh?
    Is seems to have stemmed from the mistranslation of "Islam" as "peace", whereas it actually means "submission".

    Before Islam, Mecca was a haven of multi-faith, multiculturalism and the region was free from major conflict (the Persian/Byzantine epic war usually taking place further north).
    The idea that the inhabitants of the vast regions in Asia and North Africa conquered by invading Muslim armies, saw Islam as bringing "peace" is laughable. Certainly there was peace after the local armies had been defeated and the land occupied, but that doesn't really count, does it?
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    (Original post by 1010marina)
    If you don't beat your wife or kill all the infidels then are you 'relevant' to Islam?

    Saying "not a real Muslim" is a ridiculous argument...
    Not wanting to seem pedantic, but the passage allowing Muslims to beat their wives is not a command but merely a permission, under certain conditions - so never beating your wife is not "unislamic" - but claiming that wife beating is forbidden would be.

    Again, killing infidels would depend on certain conditions - essentially the refusal to submit to Islam, but some also believe that it requires the instruction from an authorised leader of an Islamic State or that it only applies in "Muslim lands". Although there are others who regard Allah and Muhammad as the ultimate Islamic leaders, and the entire world as "Muslim lands", in the same way as Islam claims that everyone os born Muslim and merely stray temporarily. So again, never killing an infidel is not unislamic, but condemning those who do (under the appropriate conditions) is.

    On the other hand, the prohibition against alcohol is absolute, and is therefore different from simply being allowed to beat your wife, or encouraged to kill infidels (all under certain conditions, of course!)
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    (Original post by Applepiex3)
    They might as well call it "THE MUSLIM ROOM (TMR)".
    #iaintnomuslimbruv
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    (Original post by Saba XD)
    This is what the OP said in a post. Isn't it the exact opposite of what you said? Or is there a difference which I am not able to tell?

    You can't just pick and choose what applies to you and what doesn't. If Muhammed is truly a prophet then you should believe every thing he says, you can't call yourself a muslim if you doubt or disbelieve in him.
    The only sin that Allah does not forgive is shirk.

    So, drinking, fornicating, not praying, etc, do not make you a Not True Muslim. Only the rejection of Allah or Muhammad as his prophet would do that.
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    (Original post by 11salmaa)
    You need to stop labelling all Muslims as bad people.
    But nobody really does that.

    If someone kill someone else there probably crazy or violent. However, if a 'Muslim' kills someone its automatically a terrorism attack.
    But the attacker in this incident hasn't been labelled a terrorist.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    But it is as simple as saying that Islam is a religion of peace and violence, of tolerance and intolerance, of equality and discrimination.

    Different people then simply cherry-pick scripture to suit their agenda and they level of modernisation and revisionism that they are prepared to accept.
    ...exactly, read the full post lol
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    (Original post by Ua3142)
    ...exactly, read the full post lol
    I did. It was your use of the usual apologetics like putting Muslim and Islamic in inverted commas, saying "dodgy imams" and employing non sequiturs like "If Islam was to blame then why arent all muslims blowing themselves everyday?" that gave the impression that you were attempting to claim that Islamist extremism was somehow not predominantly motivated and justified Islam - when all the evidence shows that it clearly is. Especially when people interpret it in a literal way and reject modernisation and revisionism.

    In short, absolutist, literalist, retentionist Islam = Islamist extremism.
 
 
 
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