Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Sarkozy vows to offer UK exit from Brexit if he wins French poll Watch

Announcements
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    Et tu Rakas21?

    Iirc you're a fan of the pint sized philandering Frenchman ...
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    Countries like Poland and the Czech Republic will oppose the end to freedom of movement as it benefits their citizens more than anyone else.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by iThrow)
    what's more embarrassing - carrying out your your legal duty to enforce the will of the majority of the electorate or crying because you didn't get your own way?

    We decided we wanted out and are taking steps to ensure that it happens. All you can do is sit and sneer from the sidelines buddy.
    No tears. This could be s game changer like a vote on PR rather than the rejected AV.


    if it goes ahead it will be in a genuinely reformed EU by presumably the time if the next GE. Of course, if youre so sure you'll win again you'll have nothing's to fear.

    I'm sure that three percent majority is watertight
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Maker)
    Countries like Poland and the Czech Republic will oppose the end to freedom of movement as it benefits their citizens more than anyone else.
    Perhaps but if it means less third world migration to them too, plus guaranteeing rights for existing uk EU nationals I'm sure they would be persuaded.
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Davij038)
    If it was put in action via concrete treaty change first why not?

    As for the latter, to protect trade with the UK and to save the EU?
    That's the point, the EU is institutionally unable to agree on reforms. Trying to get everyone to sign up is like juggling cats while nailing jelly to the ceiling. Cameron pushed for reform before the vote. Got nowhere. There's absolutely no evidence Sarkozy could do it. Saying he could is disingenuous at best.

    Protecting French trade? Saving the EU? Why do you think that's in the best interest of Britain?
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Davij038)
    No tears. This could be s game changer like a vote on PR rather than the rejected AV.


    if it goes ahead it will be in a genuinely reformed EU by presumably the time if the next GE. Of course, if youre so sure you'll win again you'll have nothing's to fear.

    I'm sure that three percent majority is watertight
    I'd estimate that there would be way more than three percent by now. The actions of the EU post-brexit vote have been very revealing and really have shown their true colours. They never wanted the UK as an ally they wanted us as a meal ticket. We're staring down an £8.5bn net loss from our membership to the EU. I'm no economist but I realise if something is a net drain on an economy then eventually that economy will be bankrupt.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Duncan2012)
    That's the point, the EU is institutionally unable to agree on reforms. Trying to get everyone to sign up is like juggling cats while nailing jelly to the ceiling. Cameron pushed for reform before the vote. Got nowhere. There's absolutely no evidence Sarkozy could do it. Saying he could is disingenuous at best.
    It's highly unlikely for sure but still within the realms of possibility. These are different times and different people. Cameron was an inefficient muppet- my opinion on Sarkozy isn't much better but he will carry far more weight and crucially has tapped into dissatisfaction within the EU project and aims to address core problems. If he can deliver a changed EU I think the public will be piqued.

    Protecting French trade? Saving the EU? Why do you think that's in the best interest of Britain?
    Those are in Frances interests

    Staying in the EU without a good chunk of the perceived drawbacks would for many be in the best interests of Britain.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Davij038)
    Perhaps but if it means less third world migration to them too, plus guaranteeing rights for existing uk EU nationals I'm sure they would be persuaded.
    No, it would mean chaos since any EU country could have a referendum and threaten to leave if they don't get their way. The EU can only exist if there are enough compromises between all the countries.

    The EU needs to agree a common policy for refugees and economic migrants, not allow one country that will not even be in the EU in a few years time dictate its policies.

    Merkel would tell Sarkozy to take a running jump.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Duncan2012)
    That's the point, the EU is institutionally unable to agree on reforms. Trying to get everyone to sign up is like juggling cats while nailing jelly to the ceiling. Cameron pushed for reform before the vote. Got nowhere. There's absolutely no evidence Sarkozy could do it. Saying he could is disingenuous at best.

    Protecting French trade? Saving the EU? Why do you think that's in the best interest of Britain?
    The EU can agree reforms if it wants them, Cameron wanted reforms the other EU countries did not want so he got nothing.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Won't happen (let's be real) , and Sarkozy is not in a position to deliver this proposal even if he is elected French President.

    As for whether this would swing voters, I don't think so. The referendum had solidified the Brexit movement if anything. The doomsday warnings (which probably scared off some Brexit voters) have not materialise.

    I think most Brexit voters no longer want to have anything to do with the EU. Even if immigration is to be reformed, there are still issues such as sovereignty, democracy and accountability. The EU can bring back free movement through the back door if it wants to. They only have to choose an opportunistic time (e.g. a recession) and the UK will have no choice but to accept.

    Whether you voted for Brexit or not, it should be obvious to you that Sarkozy's proposal is a classic case of bait and switch.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Maker)
    No, it would mean chaos since any EU country could have a referendum and threaten to leave if they don't get their way. The EU can only exist if there are enough compromises between all the countries.

    The EU needs to agree a common policy for refugees and economic migrants, not allow one country that will not even be in the EU in a few years time dictate its policies.

    Merkel would tell Sarkozy to take a running jump.
    Meh.

    If it was part if s new constitution then they're sins would be addressed for the most part. Few countries could take the risk the UK took.

    Yes (on the refugees) but that isn't going to happen if the EU disintegrates. Merkel has destroyed herself and she knows it. Thankfully her successor will most probably be far more robust and hopefully not guilt ridden about what her ancestors did.

    The Bismarck of the EU Wolfgang Schauble would also I think be willing to give it a shot.

    Again, all unlikely but stranger things have happened.
    • Community Assistant
    Online

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Davij038)
    Et tu Rakas21?

    Iirc you're a fan of the pint sized philandering Frenchman ...
    I do like Sarkozy and i dare say that his prior relationship with Merkel (and her own thoughts) would allow him to push some kind of new deal... but without seeing the specifics it changes nothing.

    Fundamentally i don't feel European, i despise what Merkel is doing to the continent with her refugee policy, i despise the idea that Turkey is being pandered to (granted Sarkozy would veto) and most of all, i don't think EU membership is the defining factor in prosperity (hell, one only need look at Berlin and Athens to see that).

    As per the poster above, if anything the vote to Leave has actually solidified my support for Brexit. I'd of course keep an open mind but chances are it won't be substantial or permanent enough.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Observatory)
    There is also a major assumption that we voted Leave over immigration.

    That might well be true but it is not what the referendum question asked and it is not why I for one voted to Leave.
    exactly I voted for the chaos but going in could drop the gold price enough to allow me to buy a few kilos for a steal hopefully then if all goes to s**t globally then the gold price skyrockets and I make even more hopefully enough for some more watches (say a jaeger LeCoultre master in rose gold, an Audemars Piguet ROO in titanium and another couple of Rolexes in gold say one white and one yellow)
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Davij038)
    Meh.

    If it was part if s new constitution then they're sins would be addressed for the most part. Few countries could take the risk the UK took.

    Yes (on the refugees) but that isn't going to happen if the EU disintegrates. Merkel has destroyed herself and she knows it. Thankfully her successor will most probably be far more robust and hopefully not guilt ridden about what her ancestors did.

    The Bismarck of the EU Wolfgang Schauble would also I think be willing to give it a shot.

    Again, all unlikely but stranger things have happened.
    Merkel will stay Chancellor, no one else is in the frame.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by 999tigger)
    He isnt in power.
    The other members wouldnt allow it.
    It fundamentally undermines the single market and treay as is, so they wont allow it.
    The UK would never allow a second referendum, unless there was a massive change in publc opinion. As it exists now most people accpet its a done deal and we are leaving, even if they think a rerun would give a different result.

    Sarkozy is just trying to get elected, si its easy for politicians to make promises they never really keep.
    Sarkozy is at this stage still trying to get his party's nomination, in a close contest with Alain Juppe. I agree there will not be a second referendum in the UK as was made plain even before the 23 June vote.

    I think that any deal will have to include some migration restrictions. Personally I would accept access to the single market for manufacturing and financial services in exchange for migration only where there is a definite job (over a certain salary so not a zero hours contract) and after the employment was advertised in the UK first.
    *
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by barnetlad)
    Sarkozy is at this stage still trying to get his party's nomination, in a close contest with Alain Juppe. I agree there will not be a second referendum in the UK as was made plain even before the 23 June vote.

    I think that any deal will have to include some migration restrictions. Personally I would accept access to the single market for manufacturing and financial services in exchange for migration only where there is a definite job (over a certain salary so not a zero hours contract) and after the employment was advertised in the UK first.
    *
    I do not think you will get reform that merely sorts out the Brits.

    The EU needs structural reform. The French may or may not be able to deliver that.

    At one level Germany must never be allowed to act unilaterally as they did last year. At another level the EU's powers must be reduced. Those seem like contradictory aims.

    The problem is the Commission. There is no institution like this anywhere else in the world: an entirely unaccountable government. The Commission initiates legislation for which there is no political support in the name of "ever closer union". As political and public opposition is national, a Parliament organised along political ideology is no challenge to the Commission. What does Marx or Hayek have to say about the size of fruit?

    Reforming the EU means dis empowering the Commission in favour of the Council so that there has to be political will behind anything the EU does.


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by jamesthehustler)
    exactly I voted for the chaos but going in could drop the gold price enough to allow me to buy a few kilos for a steal hopefully then if all goes to s**t globally then the gold price skyrockets and I make even more hopefully enough for some more watches (say a jaeger LeCoultre master in rose gold, an Audemars Piguet ROO in titanium and another couple of Rolexes in gold say one white and one yellow)
    You are a contender for my favourite poster on TSR.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    At one level Germany must never be allowed to act unilaterally as they did last year. At another level the EU's powers must be reduced. Those seem like contradictory aims.
    The logical solution is for rEU to integrate much further and faster without the UK.

    There is very little appetite for disempowering the EU outside of the UK.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    I do not think you will get reform that merely sorts out the Brits.

    The EU needs structural reform. The French may or may not be able to deliver that.

    At one level Germany must never be allowed to act unilaterally as they did last year. At another level the EU's powers must be reduced. Those seem like contradictory aims.

    The problem is the Commission. There is no institution like this anywhere else in the world: an entirely unaccountable government. The Commission initiates legislation for which there is no political support in the name of "ever closer union". As political and public opposition is national, a Parliament organised along political ideology is no challenge to the Commission. What does Marx or Hayek have to say about the size of fruit?

    Reforming the EU means dis empowering the Commission in favour of the Council so that there has to be political will behind anything the EU does.


    Posted from TSR Mobile

    Its nonsense to say the EU Commission is unaccountable, each national government nominates a commissioner and the President of the Commission has to be endorsed by the EU parliment.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Too little too late. This should have been the absolute minimum offered when Cameron met with Juncker.
 
 
 
Reply
Submit reply
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: October 1, 2016
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Should Spain allow Catalonia to declare independence?
    Useful resources

    Groups associated with this forum:

    View associated groups
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.