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Ozil vs De Bruyne vs Mata vs Coutinho vs Hazard watch

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    (Original post by Syrianprince)
    For me its De Bruyne, Ozil, Coutinho, Hazard, Mata.
    Base some of your decision on current form.
    KDB > Hazard > Oatzeal > Coutinho > Johnny kills
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    I don't really believe in form, so I would rank them so:

    De Bruyne - the best all round player in the EPL. Can do anything.

    Ozil - very creative, fits in great at Arsenal.

    Hazard - very hard to stop when he's on. Had one bad season but so did the whole team.

    Coutinho = Mata. Coutinho has an eye for the spectacular, but Mata is very good. Don't agree he is average at all but does have a habit of getting screwed by his managers i.e. Mourinho.
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    (Original post by chazwomaq)
    I don't really believe in form, so I would rank them so:

    De Bruyne - the best all round player in the EPL. Can do anything.

    Ozil - very creative, fits in great at Arsenal.

    Hazard - very hard to stop when he's on. Had one bad season but so did the whole team.

    Coutinho = Mata. Coutinho has an eye for the spectacular, but Mata is very good. Don't agree he is average at all but does have a habit of getting screwed by his managers i.e. Mourinho.
    I agree he is the best player overall in the league. However, he does not seem to be at his best yet imo. You see parts of his game where he sometimes lacks the mental composure to deliver the final killer pass or shot. Last week against Southampton for example at 0-0 against Southampton when he had the choice of taking the shot on, on his left, or passing to Aguero on his right. He passed to Aguero but it was a poor pass, if he was truly confident it would be an incisive pass or a clinical finish.

    He is affected mentally sometimes and does not use the full extent of his talents with the killer instinct. If he gets that sorted out, he will be unstoppable.


    That is what is the troubling thing about him with regards to the rest of the league, he is not at his best yet. If he becomes clinical then the defenders **** themselves whenever he is running at them. They don't truly fear him yet.
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    (Original post by HopelessMedic)
    Fair point, but his own level of performance was shocking. Even in a bad team you an try and make things happen, but he was hiding in a lot of games and looked like he couldn't be bothered.

    Besides Hazard is one of those players that can score goals by himself, its not like he relies on others . He's scored plenty of individual goals before, but last season he did nothing.
    Hazard played with an injury for a large chunk of the season. The only reason he started playing better towards the end of the season is because he was finally given a long time to recuperate.

    Anyway out of these players, KdB is the only one I'd swap for Hazard in my team. Both of them are about level imo. For the rest I'd say Ozil > Coutinho >Mata. Mata during his Chelsea would be just ahead of Ozil.
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    Charley Adam >. Hazard, Ozil, Mata, Coutinho, De Bruyne
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    (Original post by Ze Witcher)
    Charley Adam >. Hazard, Ozil, Mata, Coutinho, De Bruyne
    Joe Allen has 4 this season. Deadly
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    (Original post by SGHD26716)
    Joe Allen has 4 this season. Deadly
    Oh yh, I forgot about that beast. Still, Charlie Adam has the pace to outrun players like Hazard, which makes him superb.
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    (Original post by xmertic)
    Hazard
    Firstly, Joe Allen, Milner and Capoue have scored as many goals as Hazard this season, with Milner and Capoue having more assists. Even Michael Antonio has scored more than Hazard this season and he's only just had an England call up! So I ask, how am I dense for questioning Hazard fulfilling his potential?

    Statistically, Milner, Capoue, Mane, Chadli and Son Heung Min are all better than him so far this season. If that doesn't prove a lack of consistency and effectiveness, what else does? Hazard, with his potential considered, should be competing with wingers like Sanchez, Mane and I only add this person due to their stats so far, but Walcott as well.

    Walcott - 5 Goals, 2 assists and 61% shooting accuracy.
    Sanchez - 4 Goals, 3 assists and 63% SA.
    Antonio - 5 Goals, 0 assists and 45% SA
    Son - 4 Goals, 2 Assists and 54% SA
    Mane - 4 Goals, 2 Assists and 67% SA
    Sterling - 4 Goals, 2 Assists and 64% SA
    Hazard - 4 Goals, 0 assists and 52% SA

    For someone of Hazards, 'quality', he should be in the top 3 at least.

    Coutinho v De Bruyne
    So far this season, I won't beat around the bush, Coutinho is better statistically. But De Bruyne has been injured and has had a far bigger impact, proven I like to think by Man City's absence of a win in five games, coincidentally since he got injured.

    I believe by the end of the season, the tables will have turned and stat for stat, De Bruyne will be better.

    Before you start criticizing me, do your homework! I bet you feel so dense right now...
    Hahahah fgs that first bold part cannot be ****ing serious. Honestly. Genuinely. Seriously? Mans said Joe Allen has been better because he scored twice against tinpot Sunderland.

    You're judging a player based on 9 games into the season? And if you're going off pure basic stats which is incredibly retarded in this situation then you're essentially saying that Matic is as much a creative force and playmaker as De Bruyne given they have the same number of assists.

    And almost all of the other players you're judging him against bar Antonio have extra games in Europe to stat pad against. Aguero got 3 against Ukrainian farmers and binmen ffs

    All that text and even it's basic context is flawed.

    (Original post by Taran001)
    Ozil Hazard De Bruyne's first seasons wern't great at all this time next year he will be better mark my words
    This isn't even worth replying to.

    (Original post by HopelessMedic)
    He is inconsistent, he flopped an entire season and couldn't score until the last couple of weeks.
    What about the 6 of his other career seasons, you know the one's where he was in the Team of the Year every season, rarely injured, won the French POTY award twice, young player of the year award 3 times, Premier League POTY amongst other awards as well as being the closest to winning the Balon D'Or than any of the other players you're supposedly claiming are better than him.

    Yeah he was shite last year, never denied that, but he also pretty much single-handedly led his team to the title the year before - which again none of the others in this debate have come anywhere near doing.
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    (Original post by Jimmy Seville)
    Hahahah fgs that first bold part cannot be ****ing serious. Honestly. Genuinely. Seriously? Mans said Joe Allen has been better because he scored twice against tinpot Sunderland.

    You're judging a player based on 9 games into the season? And if you're going off pure basic stats which is incredibly retarded in this situation then you're essentially saying that Matic is as much a creative force and playmaker as De Bruyne given they have the same number of assists.

    And almost all of the other players you're judging him against bar Antonio have extra games in Europe to stat pad against. Aguero got 3 against Ukrainian farmers and binmen ffs

    All that text and even it's basic context is flawed.



    This isn't even worth replying to.



    What about the 6 of his other career seasons, you know the one's where he was in the Team of the Year every season, rarely injured, won the French POTY award twice, young player of the year award 3 times, Premier League POTY amongst other awards as well as being the closest to winning the Balon D'Or than any of the other players you're supposedly claiming are better than him.

    Yeah he was shite last year, never denied that, but he also pretty much single-handedly led his team to the title the year before - which again none of the others in this debate have come anywhere near doing.

    Each of the 3 users I tagged in here are either elaborate trolls or children of incest.
    I think you're the only troll and incest advocater here.

    If you're so set on remembering the past, then Pavel Pogrebnyak, world class striker wasn't he... one decent season at Reading, surely justify that claim, right? No it doesn't. In the same way that no-one calls Robinho a legend or one to remember, because he was **** in every season apart from one or two, like Hazard is now doing.

    If Hazard doesn't start preforming like he did in his first Chelsea season and like in France, he isn't worthy of being considered World Class. He's only worth remembering for the potential.

    You live in a fantasy world you do.

    And what is the point of bringing up player of the year awards and player of the season awards when they're coming from France? It's a s**t league, Ligue 1 is the equivalent to our League One mate. Laughable.
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    (Original post by Jimmy Seville)
    Hahahah fgs that first bold part cannot be ****ing serious. Honestly. Genuinely. Seriously? Mans said Joe Allen has been better because he scored twice against tinpot Sunderland.

    You're judging a player based on 9 games into the season? And if you're going off pure basic stats which is incredibly retarded in this situation then you're essentially saying that Matic is as much a creative force and playmaker as De Bruyne given they have the same number of assists.

    And almost all of the other players you're judging him against bar Antonio have extra games in Europe to stat pad against. Aguero got 3 against Ukrainian farmers and binmen ffs

    All that text and even it's basic context is flawed.



    This isn't even worth replying to.



    What about the 6 of his other career seasons, you know the one's where he was in the Team of the Year every season, rarely injured, won the French POTY award twice, young player of the year award 3 times, Premier League POTY amongst other awards as well as being the closest to winning the Balon D'Or than any of the other players you're supposedly claiming are better than him.

    Yeah he was shite last year, never denied that, but he also pretty much single-handedly led his team to the title the year before - which again none of the others in this debate have come anywhere near doing.

    Each of the 3 users I tagged in here are either elaborate trolls or children of incest.
    This is quite possibly the most deluded post I've ever read on here.

    FYI stating opinions as facts doesn't strengthen your argument.
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    Hazard been pretty ****ing good for 3 out of 4 seasons here ffs. Its borderline mental retardation to think that's not the case.

    Heck I dont think he's been that good this season compared to his first season under mourinho e.g. but he still has been good on a statistical level.

    Actually scratch the second sentence, this guys been a ****ing beast.
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    (Original post by HopelessMedic)
    This is quite possibly the most deluded post I've ever read on here.

    FYI stating opinions as facts doesn't strengthen your argument.
    fyi I didn't state opinions as facts, I stated facts as facts.

    (Original post by xmertic)
    I think you're the only troll and incest advocater here.

    If you're so set on remembering the past, then Pavel Pogrebnyak, world class striker wasn't he... one decent season at Reading, surely justify that claim, right? No it doesn't. In the same way that no-one calls Robinho a legend or one to remember, because he was **** in every season apart from one or two, like Hazard is now doing.

    If Hazard doesn't start preforming like he did in his first Chelsea season and like in France, he isn't worthy of being considered World Class. He's only worth remembering for the potential.

    You live in a fantasy world you do.

    And what is the point of bringing up player of the year awards and player of the season awards when they're coming from France? It's a s**t league, Ligue 1 is the equivalent to our League One mate. Laughable.


    The number of times you contradict yourself in this post is remarkable.

    Sit down children
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    (Original post by Jimmy Seville)
    fyi I didn't state opinions as facts, I stated facts as facts.





    The number of times you contradict yourself in this post is remarkable.

    Sit down children
    The only possible contradiction I see is about Hazard playing well in France. But it not being note-worthy as France is a bad league, which is why he stood out there... now he isn't there, he's inconsistent. Coincidence, I think not.
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    (Original post by xmertic)
    If Hazard doesn't start preforming like he did in his first Chelsea season and like in France, he isn't worthy of being considered World Class. He's only worth remembering for the potential.

    You live in a fantasy world you do.
    You live in a fantasy world if you think Hazard was better in 2012/13 than 2014/15. Hazard was the best Chelsea player by a mile from Jan to May 2015 constantly turning one point to three.
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    Funnily enough I think 13/14 he was at a similar level to 14/15, just that Toure and Suarez went on one in 13/14 making it impossible for him to win. Heck his injury in 13/14 was basically what stopped Chelsea from winning the title and getting to the CL final that year.
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    (Original post by bammy jastard 27)
    Hazard been pretty ****ing good for 3 out of 4 seasons here ffs. Its borderline mental retardation to think that's not the case.

    Heck I dont think he's been that good this season compared to his first season under mourinho e.g. but he still has been good on a statistical level.

    Actually scratch the second sentence, this guys been a ****ing beast.
    Mourinho nearly ruined him to be honest, if he stayed at Chelsea for any longer I doubt Hazard would have had his resurgence, he would have got badly injured eventually because Mourinho never rested him. Playing him half injured was totally irresponsible.
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    (Original post by James.Carnell)
    Mourinho nearly ruined him to be honest, if he stayed at Chelsea for any longer I doubt Hazard would have had his resurgence, he would have got badly injured eventually because Mourinho never rested him. Playing him half injured was totally irresponsible.
    He's done that before and then blames him for not being defensively responsible against Atlético despite him being half fit starting the most important fixture of the season. I think Hazard at the moment may be close to playing his best football (even 13/14 which personally was his best season imo but he had Suarez to face for the POTY). I think he doesn't do as much defensively as before but him just focusing on his strengths has made him much more effective.

    Mourinho's truly a ****ing cancer though.
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    (Original post by bammy jastard 27)
    He's done that before and then blames him for not being defensively responsible against Atlético despite him being half fit starting the most important fixture of the season. I think Hazard at the moment may be close to playing his best football (even 13/14 which personally was his best season imo but he had Suarez to face for the POTY). I think he doesn't do as much defensively as before but him just focusing on his strengths has made him much more effective.

    Mourinho's truly a ****ing cancer though.
    I honestly think that Mourinho's coaching of attacking players is somewhat lacking and always has been, he tries to make them fit to quite a rigid attacking system but it blunts the abilities of the very best players. The very best players in their positions tend to have that tendency to be mavericks, they have that unpredictability that makes them a cut above the rest. He just does not seem to understand that part of the game, that great players should be given freedom as their abilities mean that they use their talents to unpick rigid defensive organisation.

    It's like with Ozil, he turned him into a crony for Ronaldo, a bit of a stat padder. Excellent assist record yes, but he limited his overall growth as a player so he didn't grow to be a complete player there. If you watch Ozil before he played for Real Madrid, he was a more complete player at Werder Bremen and for Germany. See the World Cup in 2010, he absolutely ripped teams apart. He was not afraid to shoot, he had more of an unpredictability in how he dribbled past players. The whole "assist" thing does not reflect his ceiling. Thankfully we are seeing a more complete Ozil under Wenger this season, but I think he would have been better had he skipped the Real Madrid experience and moved to Arsenal sooner under Wenger. The thing is, it's obviously better if a 10 can both score and assist.

    Imo, the same thing that happened to Ozil would have happened to Hazard because of the level of micromanagement that Mourinho seems to inflict on his players.
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    Hazard is a level above the rest and is capable of carrying a team over an entire season


    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    (Original post by Dexa)
    Hazard is a level above the rest and is capable of carrying a team over an entire season


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Kneejerk reaction.
 
 
 
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