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    (Original post by Tawheed)
    Israel is on par with ISIS/al nusra/alqaea , they're all absolutely evil.

    Honest man tears apart Israel on Question time (rare moment on the BBC/mainstream non-rupert murdoch owned media)

    The biased left-wing BBC. So impartial.
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    (Original post by thedylanman)
    Isreal has violated international law and has done so on many occasions. Surely this is enough to justify labelling Isreal as a terrorist state?
    International law does not exist.
    • Welcome Squad
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    (Original post by Skip_Snip)
    Question: Who is governed by a terrorist organisation?
    Answer: Palestine.

    Question: Who is being hugely biased?
    Answer: You.
    Explain how she is be hugely biased?

    And who has killed thousands in Gaza? Explain the need for a blockade in Gaza as well please.
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    Who do you guy support and why. Also why do Zionists say Palestine never existed well neither did Saudi Arabia until the early 20th century, the entire middle east was one big country called Arabia, but the British and french partitioned it in the sykes picot agreement, and later on the British promised the Jews a homeland in Arabia which was the home of the Arabs.
    Give your opinions below and why you support that side, also please take it easy im only 15
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    (Original post by Mantle hood)
    Who do you guy support and why. Also why do Zionists say Palestine never existed well neither did Saudi Arabia until the early 20th century, the entire middle east was one big country called Arabia, but the British and french partitioned it in the sykes picot agreement, and later on the British promised the Jews a homeland in Arabia which was the home of the Arabs.
    Give your opinions below and why you support that side, also please take it easy im only 15
    Your understanding of the history/geography involved is a bit confused. Arabia is only a part of what is now called the Middle East, the part between the Red Sea and the Persian Gulf. There are other historic regions which are part of the Middle East, such as Syria, Mesopotamia (Iraq), Persia (Iran), Egypt, the Maghreb (North Africa), etc. Israel and Lebanon are part of a region called the Levant which overlaps and sometimes blurs with Syria. They are not part of Arabia. Prior to the First World War, and for several hundred years previously, the vast majority of the Middle East was ruled, at least nominally, by the Ottoman (Turkish) Empire, and divided into many administrative districts, some of which correspond loosely to modern borders, and some of which do not.
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    Its not about supporting a side, both sides justify eachothers existence and are about equally responsible for what is going on.
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    Most of the Pro Israeli arguments:

    - Best human rights in the middle east.
    - Technological superpower providing goods and advancements to the entire world.
    - Against people who want their existence ended.
    - Arab world had plenty of opportunities to negotiate.

    Most of the Pro Palestinian arguments:

    - Were not considered when we gave land to Israel.
    - Palestinians have lived in Israel a long time.
    - They have no where else to go.
    - Israel is a developed nation they should show more restraint.
    - Israel takes out the grief it receives from the Arab world on the Palestinians.
    - Many Palestinians have no interest in terrorism yet the current situation results in all Palestinians being penalized.
    - Israel isn't giving the Palestinians much of a choice.


    Those pretty much sum up the points put forward by both sides (obviously there are considerable numbers who hate Israel because they hate Jews and/or hate Palestinians because they are Muslim, best thing is to stay away from them). A really good rule for this is that if anyone is completely pro-Israel or completely pro-Palestinian they tend to be either really stupid or really xenophobic, as Pulse said both sides are responsible for the current situation, to what extent is obviously up for debate.
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    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...with-palestine

    According to Israel, the Vatican officially supporting peace based on a two-state solution actually makes reaching a peace based on a two-state solution more difficult.....

    Also, they want the Palestinians to "return to direct bilateral negotiations." You know, those direct bilateral negotiations that were last broken off by the Israeli side?
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    Israel.

    Because Palestinians are Jordanians. I do not condone all of Israel's actions though, I think their economic sanctions are taking it too far. Palestine is far too radicalized to just "let it go", but I think an immediate two-state solution and a gradual release of sanctions should be in place, along with some constitutional guarantees, such as a ban on a Palestinian military and a mandatory check by Israel on all goods coming into Palestine.
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    I think a three state solution is a better idea the west bank gaza and Israel. Personally living in Israel i can tell you there are a lot of human rights abuse to some people. personally being in the west bank and all
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...with-palestine

    According to Israel, the Vatican officially supporting peace based on a two-state solution actually makes reaching a peace based on a two-state solution more difficult.....

    Also, they want the Palestinians to "return to direct bilateral negotiations." You know, those direct bilateral negotiations that were last broken off by the Israeli side?
    Broken off by the so-called 'palestinians' actually.
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    (Original post by Feraligatr)
    Explain the need for a blockade in Gaza as well please.
    Quite easy.

    With a blockade, they managed to smuggle in tens of thousands of rockets.

    Without a blockade, what do you think the so-called 'palestinians' will be able to smuggle in?
    • Welcome Squad
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    (Original post by LockheedSpooky)
    Quite easy.

    With a blockade, they managed to smuggle in tens of thousands of rockets.

    Without a blockade, what do you think the so-called 'palestinians' will be able to smuggle in?
    They referring to who?
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    (Original post by Feraligatr)
    They referring to who?

    :facepalm2:
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    (Original post by LockheedSpooky)
    Broken off by the so-called 'palestinians' actually.
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...s-palestinians
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    (Original post by Feraligatr)
    They referring to who?
    The person you are replying to made it pretty clear that his 'they' is "so-called palestinians."

    To be more precise, the subset of the above which we are dealing with in this context is primarily Hamas and secondarily Islamic Jihad. Recently, it has also begun to refer to the local ISIS chapter. These are subsets of a larger 'they' which is Gazans.
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    The Guardian is on par with Goebbels when it comes to Israel.

    A paper without credibility that was forced to (under weight of the evidence) publicly apologise for its correspondents "straying into anti-semitism" when reporting on Israel.

    Now the so-called 'palestinians', that fabricated politically-motivated construct, claimed that 'settlement' building was a barrier to peace and that they were unable to attend peace talks because of that.

    Let's leave aside the fact that there wasn't a single settlement building pre-1967 and still the so-called 'palestinians' (trading under the name 'Jordanians' back then) attacked Israel.

    However, Israel took the so-called 'palestinians' at face value and froze all settlement building for a period of 9 months.

    During these 9 months, the so-called 'palestinians' rebuffed every single attempt by Israel to meet for peace talks. Even when Bibi publicly called on them to meet and said Israel was willing to without preconditions.

    Still they refused because they have the EU on their side funding their war against Israel and now an acquiescent friend in the white house - not to mention the morally bankrupt and bigoted left wing movement.
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    (Original post by LockheedSpooky)
    Now the so-called 'palestinians', that fabricated politically-motivated construct, claimed that 'settlement' building was a barrier to peace and that they were unable to attend peace talks because of that.
    Any nationality is a fabricated construct, but the Palestinian people who were living in what was known as Palestine when the British were in charge have a right to self-determination.

    The Israeli settlements are illegal. Even Israel's Supreme Court admits this. The Palestinians have attended peace talks on several occasions, and, in fact, have offered Israel incredibly generous deals in the past.

    In 2008, for instance, the Palestine Papers were leaked, in an embarrassment for the Palestinian Authority.

    The Palestinian Authority offered to give Israel “the biggest Yerushalayim in Jewish history”, permitting it to formally annex nearly all of East Jerusalem. Alongside this the Palestinian negotiating team outlined a deal in which Israel would annex 1.9% of the West Bank in the context of a landswap, permitting Israeli to incorporate into its future borders 63% of the illegal settler population. They also made massive concessions on the right of return of refugees, allowing for only 10,000 out of approximately 5 million refugees to return. The response from Tzipi Livni, the then leader of Israel’s ‘moderate’ opposition, was blunt: “we do not like this suggestion because it does not meet our demands”. In fact, they also show that Livni admitted that "the policy of the [Israeli] government for a really long time", has been "to take more and more land day after day and that at the end of the day we'll say that is impossible, we already have the land and we cannot create the [Palestinian] state".

    And, of course, today, Netanyahu himself has admitted that he does not support a two-state solution, whilst the President of the State of Palestine does and also recognises Israel's right to exist.

    (Original post by LockheedSpooky)
    Let's leave aside the fact that there wasn't a single settlement building pre-1967 and still the so-called 'palestinians' (trading under the name 'Jordanians' back then) attacked Israel.
    The settlements were built when the State of Israel was founded, and the Israelis ethnically cleansed Palestinians from locations which weren't even allocated to the Israelis under the UN Partition Plan.

    Even Benny Morris, a staunch Zionist and historian, who was one of the first to demonstrate that this had occurred, has admitted that ethnic cleansing took place. Of course, some prefer to use the euphemistic term "population transfer".

    (Original post by LockheedSpooky)
    However, Israel took the so-called 'palestinians' at face value and froze all settlement building for a period of 9 months.

    During these 9 months, the so-called 'palestinians' rebuffed every single attempt by Israel to meet for peace talks. Even when Bibi publicly called on them to meet and said Israel was willing to without preconditions.
    Negotiations did take place during a later settlement freeze, however, and were taking place up until last year.

    Throughout every negotiation, Israel and the United States have blocked the international consensus on the two-state solution, failing to pledge to end the occupation and illegal annexation of Palestinian territory. And, as seen above, Israel rejected an extremely generous offer from the Palestinian leadership.

    Israel have always offered a variety of excuses, ranging from "the Palestinians aren't united" to, when they form a unity government, "they're united, so we can't have a deal". However, from the 1930s to the present day, the aim of the Zionist movement has been to take more and more land for themselves.

    As David Ben-Gurion stated in a letter when he claimed to have accepted the UN Partition Plan: "My assumption (which is why I am a fervent proponent of a state, even though it is now linked to partition) is that a Jewish state on only part of the land is not the end but the beginning."
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    The amount of IRA sympathisers who, for whatever reason, seem to believe that the Palestinians are their best mates, never fails to astonish me :rofl:
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    (Original post by LockheedSpooky)
    The Guardian is on par with Goebbels when it comes to Israel.

    A paper without credibility that was forced to (under weight of the evidence) publicly apologise for its correspondents "straying into anti-semitism" when reporting on Israel.
    Do you actually dispute what the article says - i.e. that the Israeli side broke off the talks in April 2014, supposedly in reaction to the forming of the Palestinian unity government, or are you just going to ad hom?

    Now the so-called 'palestinians', that fabricated politically-motivated construct
    Like all national identities, in other words?

    Let's leave aside the fact that there wasn't a single settlement building pre-1967 and still the so-called 'palestinians' (trading under the name 'Jordanians' back then) attacked Israel.
    The dynamics of a conflict are slightly different to what they were half a century ago? Shocking!

    However, Israel took the so-called 'palestinians' at face value and froze all settlement building for a period of 9 months.

    During these 9 months, the so-called 'palestinians' rebuffed every single attempt by Israel to meet for peace talks. Even when Bibi publicly called on them to meet and said Israel was willing to without preconditions.
    Aside from anything else, this was in 2009-10, whereas the last peace talks, as I said, were last year. Keep up.
 
 
 
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