The Commons Bar Mk IX - MHoC Chat Thread Watch

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Birkenhead
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#681
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#681
(Original post by RayApparently)
I'm more interested in how many posts they'd made in the Liberal Party sub-forum. If the only time they ever enter the MHoC is to vote how Birk wants them to (noting we can't categorically rule out that they are Birk's dupes - just saying) then it's very dodgy indeed.
I'd appreciate it if you stop sullying my reputation with false information. I never directed them how to vote. I invited two of my politically engaged, like minded housemates to join the party as a way of boosting activity, but they were never particularly active. If an election was on that I was standing in, I would inform them. The only occasion I actually know of either of them actually voting at all has been in this election as a result of this furore, though I see that Glyx has been banned. For the sake of party image and clearing this up, however, I have hinted at them to consider leaving the party for the greater good.

You can't rule out that they're my dupes in the same way you can't rule out the existence of the flying spaghetti monster. A meaningless comment.

The idea that I should be under fire for having invited two people I live with into my party is frankly ridiculous. It doesn't surprise me that the people most perseverant in finding some wrong doing in my behaviour come from certain wings of the House. This is becoming something of a witch hunt.
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That Bearded Man
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#682
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#682
(Original post by Birkenhead)
I'd appreciate it if you stop sullying my reputation with false information. I never directed them how to vote. I invited two of my politically engaged, like minded housemates to join the party as a way of boosting activity, but they were never particularly active. If an election was on that I was standing in, I would inform them. The only occasion I actually know of either of them actually voting at all has been in this election as a result of this furore, though I see that Glyx has been banned. For the sake of party image and clearing this up, however, I have hinted at them to consider leaving the party for the greater good.

You can't rule out that they're my dupes in the same way you can't rule out the existence of the flying spaghetti monster. A meaningless comment.

The idea that I should be under fire for having invited two people I live with into my party is frankly ridiculous. It doesn't surprise me that the people most perseverant in finding some wrong doing in my behaviour come from certain wings of the House.
Anyway, it isn't our job to investigate, but I'd like to see if other members of the house agree, so I'll comment no further.

And Birk, you would do the same if the roles were reversed, just saying.
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RayApparently
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#683
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#683
(Original post by Birkenhead)
I'd appreciate it if you stop sullying my reputation with false information. I never directed them how to vote. I invited two of my politically engaged, like minded housemates to join the party as a way of boosting activity, but they were never particularly active. If an election was on that I was standing in, I would inform them. The only occasion I actually know of either of them actually voting at all has been in this election as a result of this furore, though I see that Glyx has been banned. For the sake of party image and clearing this up, however, I have hinted at them to consider leaving the party for the greater good.

You can't rule out that they're my dupes in the same way you can't rule out the existence of the flying spaghetti monster. A meaningless comment.

The idea that I should be under fire for having invited two people I live with into my party is frankly ridiculous. It doesn't surprise me that the people most perseverant in finding some wrong doing in my behaviour come from certain wings of the House. This is becoming something of a witch hunt.
Note my use of the word 'if'. And if they aren't active in the MHoC and only show up to turn for you because you've 'informed them' then how are those legitimate votes cast. How exactly have you not given yourself a decided advantage over your opponents?

My comments on that front were simply to remind everyone that we might be fooling ourselves into believing a lie simply by calling them 'they' when they might still be 'you'. And there are ways to demonstrate your story is wrong. Their times of joining TSR for example might not match your story.

The last comment attacks the person not the argument.
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Birkenhead
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#684
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#684
(Original post by InnerTemple)
The fact of the matter is that you have said that you recruited a friend to the party. This friend "helped you out" on matters. This friend appears to have had bugger all activity on the rest of the forum.

Now it may be that this friend of yours was very active in the party, almost exclusively posted in the party's private forum and was clearly acting of their own accord. If that's the case, then fine.

But on the face of it and from what you have said, I feel that it is possible that something not altogether proper has occurred.
What exactly is 'not altogether proper' about this situation? Am I liable for reprimand because someone I live with and invite into the party does not post enough for you personally to see them as legitimate members of an MHoC party and equally deserving to vote? Am I liable for reprimand for living with this person, and benefiting from their personal loyalty? As I have said, I don't actually know of any occasion of them voting before this furore, and I never requested their electoral support. My only intention in recruiting them was to boost party activity, but the idea that 'something not altogether proper', as yet undefined, has occurred here smacks of political opportunism. I have done nothing wrong. You want to find me guilty of something, rather than believing I am having objectively surveyed the situation.
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Birkenhead
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#685
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#685
(Original post by That Bearded Man)
And Birk, you would do the same if the roles were reversed, just saying.
I wouldn't, actually. Regardless of person or alleged crime I torture myself with anxiety trying to convince myself that there is room enough for reasonable doubt. I'm probably the only person in the world who thinks Pistorius' conviction for manslaughter was the right decision.
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InnerTemple
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#686
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#686
(Original post by Birkenhead)
What exactly is 'not altogether proper' about this situation?
I think I have made myself clear. I do note that one or two other members have commented on this thread with the same concerns - so I am confident that I have been clear.

I'll assume that the Speaker and other relevant people will look into the matter and get back to us soon.
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Birkenhead
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#687
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#687
(Original post by InnerTemple)
I think I have made myself clear. I do note that one or two other members have commented on this thread with the same concerns - so I am confident that I have been clear.

I'll assume that the Speaker and other relevant people will look into the matter and get back to us soon.
You haven't made yourself clear at all. What you've said is that it is possible 'something not altogether proper' has occurred, without explaining exactly what this is or how I am in the wrong. You have also failed to respond to my points. It is blindingly obvious that you and others are turning this incident into a politically motivated witchhunt, despite the paucity of your arguments against my conduct.
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InnerTemple
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#688
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#688
(Original post by Birkenhead)
You haven't made yourself clear at all.
Well it seems that there is only one person here who is not following me. So I disagree with the above.

That is unless one of your, until now dormant, friends can come along to "help you out"...

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Birkenhead
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#689
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#689
(Original post by InnerTemple)
Well it seems that there is only one person here who is not following me. So I disagree with the above.
Your posts in this conversation are nothing more than a succession of veiled and indistinct accusations and repeated insistences that you've made any coherent argument.

That is unless one of your, until now dormant, friends can come along to "help you out"...

You are painting me as having deliberately taken advantage of these people being members of my party when you have no reason or evidence to back this up and when I have denied doing so. Do you find much success with this strategy in the courts? I doubt it. Take your political opportunism elsewhere, please.
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Kittiara
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#690
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#690
Everyone, I suggest awaiting the findings of the investigation. And let's not get personal.
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InnerTemple
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#691
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#691
(Original post by Birkenhead)
You are painting me as having deliberately taken advantage of these people being members of my party when you have no reason or evidence to back this up and when I have denied doing so. Do you find much success with this strategy in the courts? I doubt it. Take your political opportunism elsewhere, please.
This isn't political. It's about integrity and making sure that the MHoCs is run properly.

I was merely making a point.

1) If these accounts are dupes - that is bad. The site team need to look into this further.
2) If they are not dupes, you appear to admit that these people "helped you out" when you required assistance.

Point 2 is what I sought to question. I asked the Speaker whether this was proper conduct. I did so because it seems to me that it is not proper to sign up friends if their sole function is to act as support for one's own endeavours. This is regardless of whether or not they originally signed up with good motive (to become a fully engaged member).

Hopefully the Speaker will clear this up. That is all I asked. The rest of this interaction between you and I has been you denying that any such arrangement (such as that set out above) is wrong.

(Original post by Birchington)
MSG
Mr Speaker I hope you will look into my concerns. I doubt you'll need clarification on the matter, but do let me know if any is required.
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Birkenhead
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#692
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#692
(Original post by InnerTemple)
This isn't political. It's about integrity and making sure that the MHoCs is run properly.

I was merely making a point.

1) If these accounts are dupes - that is bad. The site team need to look into this further.
2) If they are not dupes, you appear to admit that these people "helped you out" when you required assistance.
No, I haven't. That is a conclusion you have come to without any good reason. At no point did I in any way direct these people to assist me in any way.

Point 2 is what I sought to question. I asked the Speaker whether this was proper conduct. I did so because it seems to me that it is not proper to sign up friends if their sole function is to act as support for one's own endeavours. This is regardless of whether or not they originally signed up with good motive (to become a fully engaged member).
What these friends chose to make of their membership is not something that I am at all responsible for. I didn't sign them up, and I didn't direct them to support me at any stage. The only record of them ever voting at all is in the leadership election, which I had told them that I was standing in.

Hopefully the Speaker will clear this up. That is all I asked. The rest of this interaction between you and I has been you denying that any such arrangement (such as that set out above) is wrong.
Wrong. I have denied that any such relationship existed and pointed out how unreasonable it is to bay for my blood because of the actions and behaviours of other people over whom I exercise no control whatsoever. Apart from this, I have been attempting to extract some semblance of an argument from you and correcting a seemingly hydra-headed list of misjudgements and misinformations.

Mr Speaker I hope you will look into my concerns. I doubt you'll need clarification on the matter, but do let me know if any is required.
You are quite obviously not a suitable source of information on this issue.
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RayApparently
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#693
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#693
InnerTemple is familiar with the concept of 'means, motive and opportunity' I imagine.
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tehFrance
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#694
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#694
Sorry to interrupt, some **** has stolen all the TP and I just had a massive dump, quite the colon cleanser but my god, I need TP!!! Some help?!
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RayApparently
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#695
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#695
(Original post by tehFrance)
Sorry to interrupt, some **** has stolen all the TP and I just had a massive dump, quite the colon cleanser but my god, I need TP!!! Some help?!
Would you like us to legislate such that some TP would magically manifest before you?
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InnerTemple
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#696
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#696
(Original post by RayApparently)
InnerTemple is familiar with the concept of 'means, motive and opportunity' I imagine.
Indeed.

(Original post by Kittiara)
Everyone, I suggest awaiting the findings of the investigation. And let's not get personal.
I agree.
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RayApparently
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#697
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#697
(Original post by InnerTemple)
Indeed.
Then you'll know your suspicions are justified, despite what Birk might want to dismiss as a 'witch-hunt' or 'opportunism'.
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InnerTemple
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#698
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#698
(Original post by tehFrance)
Sorry to interrupt, some **** has stolen all the TP and I just had a massive dump, quite the colon cleanser but my god, I need TP!!! Some help?!
TP?

What is this TP you speak of?

EDIT - Toilet paper... obviously... :facepalm:
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Tanqueray91
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#699
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#699
(Original post by InnerTemple)
TP?

What is this TP you speak of?

EDIT - Toilet paper... obviously... :facepalm:
Don't worry! It took me a while as well lol!
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Aph
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#700
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#700
(Original post by InnerTemple)
TP?

What is this TP you speak of?

EDIT - Toilet paper... obviously... :facepalm:
(Original post by mobbsy91)
Don't worry! It took me a while as well lol!
:toofunny:
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