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Lib dem question time watch

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    (Original post by abucha3)
    You need to brush up on your political history then because the Liberal Democrats haven't been in power since David Lloyd George in 1922. Since then the people vote for either the Conservatives (Right) or Labour (Left). The really sounds as though central dishwater parties such as yourselves are winning, doesn't it?
    This is the kind of assumption you will get rid of if you study Politics in sixth form / University. It is not correct. If we are talking currently in this country, both the Tories and Labour are fairly central (broadly). The Lib Dems are similar.

    It should be pointed out that you haven't explained why you think the TSR Lib Dems are bang on central. Or answered any of the other points raised. Or provided any actual evidence...
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    (Original post by Thunder and Jazz)
    This is the kind of assumption you will get rid of if you study Politics in sixth form / University. It is not correct. If we are talking currently in this country, both the Tories and Labour are fairly central (broadly). The Lib Dems are similar.

    It should be pointed out that you haven't explained why you think the TSR Lib Dems are bang on central. Or answered any of the other points raised. Or provided any actual evidence...
    The Conservative Party is Central-Right and the Labour Party is Central-Left. They still veer to their respective wings with policies. The Liberal Democrats, do not veer to either left wing or right wing, hence why I say they don't know if they are coming or going and hence why they haven't won an election since 1922.

    TSR Liberal Democrats and the RL Liberal Democrats are fairly similar with policies. The only reason that TSR Liberal Democrats are popular is because you make yourselves appealing to students, since most of the users are students, you get votes.
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    (Original post by abucha3)
    The Conservative Party is Central-Right and the Labour Party is Central-Left. They still veer to their respective wings with policies. The Liberal Democrats, do not veer to either left wing or right wing, hence why I say they don't know if they are coming or going and hence why they haven't won an election since 1922.

    TSR Liberal Democrats and the RL Liberal Democrats are fairly similar with policies. The only reason that TSR Liberal Democrats are popular is because you make yourselves appealing to students, since most of the users are students, you get votes.
    How exactly are we fairly similar?? Proof please.

    Also - it depends on the Labour government in this case - if its a new one, they will be Centre-left, if your watching a dieing Labour Government then it will be a case of - trying to get voters from somewhere.
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    (Original post by Afcwimbledon2)
    How exactly are we fairly similar?? Proof please.

    Also - it depends on the Labour government in this case - if its a new one, they will be Centre-left, if your watching a dieing Labour Government then it will be a case of - trying to get voters from somewhere.
    I really think that the similarities between TSR Liberal Democrats and the RL Liberal Democrats do not need to be highlighted; they are fairly obvious.

    Not at all. Labour may become less left wing if they are dying as you put it but will still remain left wing. The Conservatives still remain right wing but at different levels. Thatcher was very right wing whilst Cameron is only slightly right wing.

    The Liberal Democrats on the other hand, are neither. They are just dishwater and do not know whether they are coming or going.
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    (Original post by abucha3)
    The Conservative Party is Central-Right and the Labour Party is Central-Left. They still veer to their respective wings with policies. The Liberal Democrats, do not veer to either left wing or right wing, hence why I say they don't know if they are coming or going and hence why they haven't won an election since 1922.
    I'm not going to go into the history of the Liberal party since '22 as there are more qualified people around to do so but it's more complicated than this. The RL Lib Dems currently are not nag on central. However, you must realise, elections in this country are won by those who most convincingly occupy the middle ground.
    TSR Liberal Democrats and the RL Liberal Democrats are fairly similar with policies. The only reason that TSR Liberal Democrats are popular is because you make yourselves appealing to students, since most of the users are students, you get votes.
    Policy wise, there are clearly similarities but there are also differences e.g. policy on nuclear energy. Student vote wise, what's your point? If our electorate is made up of students it would a) be stupid and b) be immoral to have policies that did not benefit them. On the one hand, yes, it's populism. on the other and more significant hand it's about representing those who vote for you.
    (Original post by abucha3)
    The Liberal Democrats on the other hand, are neither. They are just dishwater and do not know whether they are coming or going.
    You really need to explain your opinion of being in the political centre. Why is it a case of not coming or going? You consistantly fail to explain this.
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    (Original post by Thunder and Jazz)
    You really need to explain your opinion of being in the political centre. Why is it a case of not coming or going? You consistantly fail to explain this.
    I have explained myself numerous times but because you have not liked the answer, you claim that I am not answering the question.

    Political parties obtain power by usually being in the centre. People either vote for the Labour Party (Centre-Left) or the Conservative Party (Centre-Right). The Liberal Democrats are just central. Sometimes they appear to be centre-left and others centre-right. Either way the Liberal Democrats do not know which wing they want to be on, hence the phrase they don't know if they are coming or going. That is why the general public don't vote for them.
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    (Original post by abucha3)
    Political parties obtain power by usually being in the centre. People either vote for the Labour Party (Centre-Left) or the Conservative Party (Centre-Right). The Liberal Democrats are just central. Sometimes they appear to be centre-left and others centre-right. Either way the Liberal Democrats do not know which wing they want to be on, hence the phrase they don't know if they are coming or going. That is why the general public don't vote for them.
    This does not answer why being bang on central stops people voting for you. It does explain the "coming or going" phrase but you are confusing results for evidence. The plural of anecdote is not data. There are many reasons why the RL Lib Dems do not get into power. A significant number of them e.g. the perception that Britain is a two party state, plurality in our electoral system, Charles Kennedy being an alcoholic etc etc are more important (and actually correct) than the fact that they are central. Also, it's not like they have been central since '22.
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    (Original post by Thunder and Jazz)
    This does not answer why being bang on central stops people voting for you. It does explain the "coming or going" phrase but you are confusing results for evidence. The plural of anecdote is not data. There are many reasons why the RL Lib Dems do not get into power. A significant number of them e.g. the perception that Britain is a two party state, plurality in our electoral system, Charles Kennedy being an alcoholic etc etc are more important (and actually correct) than the fact that they are central. Also, it's not like they have been central since '22.
    People will not vote for people being bang on central because it shows indecisiveness. The Liberal Democrats cannot even choose which wing they won't be on so how can they be expected or trusted to make choices on important issues, when all they do is sit on the fence?
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    (Original post by abucha3)
    People will not vote for people being bang on central because it shows indecisiveness. The Liberal Democrats cannot even choose which wing they won't be on so how can they be expected or trusted to make choices on important issues, when all they do is sit on the fence?
    I suggest you read Magnum Opus's answer to my question in the Centre Party thread.

    Being central, if you believe we are central, does not mean that we sit on the fence. Remember, to be blinded by ideology is to be useless to the country. Pragmatism is valuable and you should be wary of going too far towards either political wing.

    Could you give some examples of how we, the TSR Lib Dems, cannot choose between the right or left? Could you then explain why each individual example is a bad thing?
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    (Original post by Thunder and Jazz)
    I suggest you read Magnum Opus's answer to my question in the Centre Party thread.

    Being central, if you believe we are central, does not mean that we sit on the fence. Remember, to be blinded by ideology is to be useless to the country. Pragmatism is valuable and you should be wary of going too far towards either political wing.
    You are not going to hijack the TSR Centre Party's explanation and use it for the TSR Liberal Democrats. TSR Centre Party is a party based on being central so that explanation is acceptable for them. The TSR Liberal Democrats cannot use that. Their party is not based on being central, they just sit on the fence and do not know which wing they are going to be.
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    (Original post by abucha3)
    You are not going to hijack the TSR Centre Party's explanation and use it for the TSR Liberal Democrats. TSR Centre Party is a party based on being central so that explanation is acceptable for them. The TSR Liberal Democrats cannot use that. Their party is not based on being central, they just sit on the fence and do not know which wing they are going to be.
    a) Answer the question. You have not explained how we 'sit on the fence'. Provide evidence or retract your statement.

    b) I specifically asked him that question so I could use it to show you how being central is a perfectly sensible way to conduct politics. I share many of the opinions expressed within it.
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    (Original post by Thunder and Jazz)
    a) Answer the question. You have not explained how we 'sit on the fence'. Provide evidence or retract your statement.

    b) I specifically asked him that question so I could use it to show you how being central is a perfectly sensible way to conduct politics. I share many of the opinions expressed within it.
    A. This is a Liberal Democrat Question Time. I will ask you the questions on here and not the other way around, thank you very much.

    B. It's funny how you will suddenly use all the excuses under the sun or lies shall I say to make yourself seem better. Perhaps you should be in the Centre Party then. The Liberal Democrats cannot choose between left or right, its acceptable for the Centre Party because they are central. In the case of the Liberal Democrats its just sitting on the fence.
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    (Original post by abucha3)
    A. This is a Liberal Democrat Question Time. I will ask you the questions on here and not the other way around, thank you very much.
    It's called debate, both sides have input. However, fair enough, I'll put something in your Question thread in a moment.
    B. It's funny how you will suddenly use all the excuses under the sun or lies shall I say to make yourself seem better. Perhaps you should be in the Centre Party then. The Liberal Democrats cannot choose between left or right, its acceptable for the Centre Party because they are central. In the case of the Liberal Democrats its just sitting on the fence.
    You still haven't explained why you think we're central. Retract your statement or prove it. We do not sit on the fence.
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    Where do the Lib Dems stand on immigrant camps and illegals coming here through France and because the frogs keep closing their immigrant camps?
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    We don't have a party line on the issue since we haven't discussed it in great detail.

    France's actions don't do a great deal of good because they simply move the people on to new locations. It's not really a proper solution to the problem. Clearly, we can't have an open door immigration policy but to be honest, it's the policing and implementation that needs fixing, not the basis of the system itself.

    Obviously, this is a very complex issue and there's all sorts of legal and moral questions to be looked at.
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    Why shouldn't the Scots be given their own choice over whether they want independence or not?

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/8336195.stm

    Hardly democratic from a party that flaunts itself as the Liberal Democrats :rolleyes:
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    Well, it's not like that referendum will actually give them independance now is it. And it;s not like the entire RL Lib Dem party is behing the leadership's policy, or even the entire Scottish party. And it's not like the TSR Lib Dems have thought about this, much the same as any party on TSR. And it's not like the "democrat" part is actually to do with democracy anyway. And it's not like 'democracy' in this country is fair anyway.

    So... what's your point?
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    How does the Liberal Democrats intend to tackle anti-social behavour next term?
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    (Original post by Cardozo)
    How does the Liberal Democrats intend to tackle anti-social behavour next term?
    We don't have a legislative agenda in this area at the moment. We will likely discuss this issue further in the next week (as we write manifestos, plan a direction for the term etc). Once term has begun, we will likely write a bill(s) or sponsor a bill(s) written by another party in this area. I'm afraid we don't have anything planned specifically e.g. tackling the problem of binge drinking, but if we come up with something we will consult widely on it.
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    (Original post by Cardozo)
    How does the Liberal Democrats intend to tackle anti-social behavour next term?
    We plan to continue with current ASBO policies but also intend to look at possible new community service programmes, designed to make the offenders think twice before re-offending. In addition, we want to reform prisons and the penal system for more 'petty' offences such as anti-social behaviour which offer a balance of rehabilition and giving offenders a chance to appreciate their local environment and community whilst having the power to give people tough punishments on things that are genuinely damaging to society. A key part of this would be giving the police more power to act where they see it being committed- essentially, we would go for the common sense approach.

    and what Thunder and Jazz said
 
 
 
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