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The Israel/Palestine Conflict Mk. IV Watch

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    (Original post by Medic35)
    Yeah gaza was treated bad and israel laugh and still say they're the victims when Gaza has millions.of innocent children dead, that's all against the rules of war.
    Millions of dead children? Are you a moron?

    Gaza doesn't even have millions of people, let alone millions of dead people, let alone millions of dead children.

    There were 2,000 dead in the 2014 Gaza Conflict which Hamas started. Around 50% of those 2,000 were militants
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    (Original post by TSRmodssuckdick)
    How Jews, including Holofaux survivors justify genocide.

    So this is where the closet Nazi's hide out.

    You people are the sickest of the sick and have no place on this thread or anywhere in a liberal society.
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    (Original post by Ribbit1234)
    its because palestine is a muslim country. the medias against Muslims and will never say the truth about whats actually going on and people blindly support israel without even knowing what the conflicts about simply cuz palestine is a muslim country.
    lmfaoooo quit spreadin false info...the media isnt against anybody...thats that paranoid talk

    its christians that support israel cuz of the jesus thing so what blindly?

    like i said put the pipe down and check into rehab
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    (Original post by PrincessAnna)
    Posted from TSR Mobile

    I see
    I'm going to try to explain the situation very clearly now to you because you seem eager to know about it. Feel free to question on any points.

    1) Never was a recognized country called Palestine, the land was given to the Jewish state of Israel by the UK who had a mandate for the area, and this was done in the 1917 Balfour Declaration.

    2) Israel has been attacked by it's Arab neighbours regularly 1948, 1967 etc and has been successful in not only defending itself but gaining land during these wars. Most of this land has been given back to the "Palestinians" in exchange for peace, which hasn't happened as Palestinian militants continue to fire rockets into Israel. Also important to note that Egypt and Jordan have both taken "Palestinian" land.

    3) Israel doesn't go round killing children or what ever blood libel you want to come up with. If it wanted to wipe out Gaza, it could do so in an hour. Whenever Israel launches an operation in Gaza it takes excessive care to warn civilians of where bombs will land and even British soldiers such as Col Kemp have said that the IDF is the most humane army in the world. Israel only does what it does to protect its citizens.

    4) Hamas (the terrorist group running Gaza) don't care about their civilians and are anti-semitic to the core (see their charter). They tell their civilians to stand on roofs that Israel are going to bomb so they can maximise Palestinian deaths and win the propaganda war. They also abuse the international aid they receive and keep much of it to themselves (all the senior Hamas leaders are millionaires living in Qatar). It's essentially a business operation for them - they profit from Palestinian deaths.

    5) Israel wants peace, and have offered it on multiple occasions making insane concessions only to be rejected by the Palestinians who refuse to accept Israel's existence.

    Hope this clears some things up for you. And might help you see that when you get through the initial phase of "dem joos killing them innocent Palestinian children. GENOCIDE! APARTHEID!", you can see that the problem is much more complex than that.
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    This will no doubt be merged with the Israel/Palestinian megathread in no time at all.
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    Nice to see some sane people commenting on this thread, i thought i was the only one.
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    one solution: one state, called israpale or paleisra they can flip a coin to see which name comes first
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    (Original post by PPEmachine)
    I'm going to try to explain the situation very clearly now to you because you seem eager to know about it. Feel free to question on any points.

    1) Never was a recognized country called Palestine, the land was given to the Jewish state of Israel by the UK who had a mandate for the area, and this was done in the 1917 Balfour Declaration.

    2) Israel has been attacked by it's Arab neighbours regularly 1948, 1967 etc and has been successful in not only defending itself but gaining land during these wars. Most of this land has been given back to the "Palestinians" in exchange for peace, which hasn't happened as Palestinian militants continue to fire rockets into Israel. Also important to note that Egypt and Jordan have both taken "Palestinian" land.

    3) Israel doesn't go round killing children or what ever blood libel you want to come up with. If it wanted to wipe out Gaza, it could do so in an hour. Whenever Israel launches an operation in Gaza it takes excessive care to warn civilians of where bombs will land and even British soldiers such as Col Kemp have said that the IDF is the most humane army in the world. Israel only does what it does to protect its citizens.

    4) Hamas (the terrorist group running Gaza) don't care about their civilians and are anti-semitic to the core (see their charter). They tell their civilians to stand on roofs that Israel are going to bomb so they can maximise Palestinian deaths and win the propaganda war. They also abuse the international aid they receive and keep much of it to themselves (all the senior Hamas leaders are millionaires living in Qatar). It's essentially a business operation for them - they profit from Palestinian deaths.

    5) Israel wants peace, and have offered it on multiple occasions making insane concessions only to be rejected by the Palestinians who refuse to accept Israel's existence.

    Hope this clears some things up for you. And might help you see that when you get through the initial phase of "dem joos killing them innocent Palestinian children. GENOCIDE! APARTHEID!", you can see that the problem is much more complex than that.
    What a load of propaganda ****e.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    What a load of propaganda ****e.
    Would you care to point out anything in particular that's incorrect, or do inconvenient facts irritate you?
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    (Original post by interact)
    one solution: one state, called israpale or paleisra they can flip a coin to see which name comes first
    I thought Israstine or Pasrael is far better
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    What a load of propaganda ****e.
    Thanks for your helpful response. I've nicely numbered my points in there so you can pick out anything that you don't agree with rather than childishly shouting "NO I DON'T LIKE IT" without giving reason.

    Welcome to an adult discussion
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    (Original post by ExcitedPup)
    I thought Israstine or Pasrael is far better
    oo ye, they're quite clever names
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    Free Palestine <3

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    (Original post by ExcitedPup)
    Feel free to be offended.

    Your point might have a little bit more bite if 100% of Israeli Jews were European, but they're not. 65% of Israeli Jews are Middle Eastern in origin
    Depends how you count it, but it's not 65% unless you're counting any Israeli Jews with partial Middle Eastern ancestry (many of whom also have partial European ancestry) as Middle Eastern in origin. By a more consistent metric, they're pretty close to even. For example, the Israeli CBS, based on patrilineal origin, put the proportions at roughly 50% of Asian or North African origin, 48% of European origin, and 2% of Ethiopian origin.

    It is right and proper that they should have a place of refuge.
    Goalpost moving. I was making a point about your indigenous/aborigine claim, and now you're switching to a different justification.

    Yes, refugees need somewhere to go. But I can't think of any other situations (except for some colonies) where this refuge has needed to be a separate state for those refugees - generally either refugees gradually assimilate into whatever country they have fled to, or intend to return to wherever they have fled from.

    And it is entirely legitimate that a state made up primarily of Mizrahi Jews would import whatever of their European brethren are necessary to secure their safety, otherwise the rights of these Middle Eastern Jews has no applicability in reality
    Except what actually happened is closer to the opposite. Zionism originally was, and remained right up to 1948, a movement of Ashkenazi European Jews. Apart from a few, it had rarely tried to win over Middle East and North African Jews - they arrived later.

    Also, to apply this logic to other situations, would it be OK for Sinn Fein to advocate moving millions of Southern Irish Catholics into Northern Ireland to create a Catholic majority there in order to bring about unification and "secure the safety and rights" of the Northern Catholics? Or for Serbia to move millions of Serbs into Bosnia or Kosovo for the same reasons (or indeed for Bosniaks, Croats or Albanians to advocate the same for their own groups)? The examples could go on. Indeed, you could say the same thing about colonising settlers.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    (Original post by PPEmachine)
    1) Never was a recognized country called Palestine
    There's never been an independent recognised country called Wales either. Indeed, most of the world's countries are relatively recent and had never existed as an independent state prior to their current existence. Virtually all of Latin America and Africa, and even Ireland, would be included here.

    the land was given to the Jewish state of Israel by the UK who had a mandate for the area, and this was done in the 1917 Balfour Declaration.
    No, the Mandate for Palestine merely referred to establishing a Jewish "national home" - commitment to a full state was deliberately avoided, as was specifying exactly where and how much of Palestine it would encompass.

    2) Israel has been attacked by it's Arab neighbours regularly 1948, 1967 etc and has been successful in not only defending itself but gaining land during these wars. Most of this land has been given back to the "Palestinians" in exchange for peace, which hasn't happened as Palestinian militants continue to fire rockets into Israel. Also important to note that Egypt and Jordan have both taken "Palestinian" land.
    In 1948 the neighbouring Arab states invaded the territory that had until the previous day been Mandatory Palestine. Israel had been declared just hours early, was at the time obviously unrecognised, and most crucially had no specified borders.

    5) Israel wants peace, and have offered it on multiple occasions making insane concessions only to be rejected by the Palestinians who refuse to accept Israel's existence.
    In 1993 the PLO not only recognised Israel, but also the invented concept of the "right to exist". They do not "refuse to accept Israel's existence".

    The Palestinian position has been relatively clear and consistent since Oslo, most clearly spelled out in the 2002 Arab Peace Initiative - withdrawal from all the Occupied Territories, and some sort of repatriation of refugees (which has by this point has become largely symbolic anyway). Israel has rarely if ever accepted the idea of a remotely equal Palestinian state, instead advocating a state in name only, usually lacking even much territorial contiguity within the West Bank.


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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    Except what actually happened is closer to the opposite. Zionism originally was, and remained right up to 1948, a movement of Ashkenazi European Jews. Apart from a few, it had rarely tried to win over Middle East and North African Jews - they arrived later.
    Actually, Ashkenazi Jew and European Jew is not a synonym. In fact, the sephardic Jews were the first to set up a community in England following the restoration of Charles II.
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    The Palestinian position has been relatively clear and consistent since Oslo, most clearly spelled out in the 2002 Arab Peace Initiative - withdrawal from all the Occupied Territories, and some sort of repatriation of refugees (which has by this point has become largely symbolic anyway). Israel has rarely if ever accepted the idea of a remotely equal Palestinian state, instead advocating a state in name only, usually lacking even much territorial contiguity within the West Bank.
    Absolute crap. The 2008 offer was full internal contiguity as well as Gaza-WB contiguity through the building of a tunnel connecting them
    • Welcome Squad
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    (Original post by PrincessAnna)
    Free Palestine <3

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    From Hamas, I suppose?
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    (Original post by PopaPork)
    you've just been caught posting lies about this situation and this is your response
    The point is where? I said it was fair enough it was unreliable. Like I meant it. But saying the relationship isn't healthy isn't wrong. Too many people fail to make actual points. Oh well. Research for me is over. Have fun fuming over the inaccuracies.

    No offence taken by the way anarchism. This is the internet.
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    (Original post by Zaki Hendrix)
    The point is where? I said it was fair enough id it was unreliable. It was. But saying the relationship isn't healthy isn't wrong.
    it's not unreliable it's simply dishonest

    but no it's not a healthy relationship and given the lies you buy into and propagate it's hardly surprising
 
 
 
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