The Liverpool FC Thread XIV Watch

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#7701
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#7701
(Original post by bammy jastard 27)
Na he plays on the right of a 4-3-3.
Kagawa Castro and Gundogan play in the centre for Dortmund in central midfield, which is probably the most suited position for Gotze in the Dortmund team. I'm inclined to think he'd get in the team over Kagawa.
Nope, Weigl plays deepest with one of Castro, Sahin and Gundogan next to him. And then there's a broad kind of hybrid position at RCM, where the RCM (usually Castro but sometimes Durm or Gundogan I think) plays as a CM, but move out wide when Mkhi picks up the ball. When Shinji plays it's a more normal 4-2-3-1 with him pulling the strings as the 10. Gotze would never get in ahead of Auba, Reus or Mkhi, and both Dembele and Pulisic will get big minutes next season. I don't know much about Passlack but he too is in the frame.

Shinji already does very well as their regular rotation option, there's no need to sign Gotze to rotate with Shinji in what is already a rotation space and an alternate formation. Kicker have already reported that a move to Dortmund is not an option and that Dortmund don't want him, and I believe another reliable source has said that Dortmund would only be interested if it was on a free next season. And that's without considering the opposition of their fans.

So there's neither the space in the squad nor the desire from any level of their club to have Gotze right now.
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samir12
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#7702
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#7702
Where would Gotze fit in at Arsenal when they already have Ozil? There is RW but Mahrez would be a better signing for them at RW.
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#7703
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#7703
(Original post by Zerforax)
Milner - 6.5 (solid, lots of games, gave us experience but another workhorse rather than a superstar. While he's regularly been a starter and done well in terms of goals and assists, you'd imagine his position is under threat next season)
21 goals or assists this season, which is more than 'superstars' Firmino and Coutinho. Only three were penalties. I think 6.5 is extremely harsh. I can see him starting a similar number of games next season, he's productive, gritty and he's a winner, and we clearly don't have enough of those.
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#7704
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#7704
(Original post by samir12)
Where would Gotze fit in at Arsenal when they already have Ozil? There is RW but Mahrez would be a better signing for them at RW.
Whilst nobody can underestimate Wenger's ability of buying lightweight attacking midfielders that clearly aren't what they need, Gotze doesn't fit in there at all. Which makes it weird why you mentioned them as a potential target. Anyway they'll probably secure Xhaka soon and two outfield signings in a window will give Wenger a nosebleed.

I've said it before, the only alternatives Gotze has to LFC are Juve and staying at Bayern. Both of which would be career suicide.
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bj27
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#7705
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#7705
(Original post by Ass State)
Nope, Weigl plays deepest with one of Castro, Sahin and Gundogan next to him. And then there's a broad kind of hybrid position at RCM, where the RCM (usually Castro but sometimes Durm or Gundogan I think) plays as a CM, but move out wide when Mkhi picks up the ball. When Shinji plays it's a more normal 4-2-3-1 with him pulling the strings as the 10. Gotze would never get in ahead of Auba, Reus or Mkhi, and both Dembele and Pulisic will get big minutes next season. I don't know much about Passlack but he too is in the frame.

Shinji already does very well as their regular rotation option, there's no need to sign Gotze to rotate with Shinji in what is already a rotation space and an alternate formation. Kicker have already reported that a move to Dortmund is not an option and that Dortmund don't want him, and I believe another reliable source has said that Dortmund would only be interested if it was on a free next season. And that's without considering the opposition of their fans.

So there's neither the space in the squad nor the desire from any level of their club to have Gotze right now.
Wrt Weigl, didn't mention him because I was talking about the CM positions in the 4-3-3 rather than the entire midfield. I was more saying that those three that I stated(+Sahin I forgot as he's not been fit most of the season) are the ones who occupy the central midfield positions(where Gotze would likely play in the 4-3-3 as he's probably not better than Mki or Reus out wide) as Weigl plays deep, especially as Gotze doesn't play as a DLP/DM.

Kagawa has played 12 games as a CM and 18 as a CAM so I guess he plays both as they alternate the two formations(so maybe there is space for Gotze but it's not a necessity/desire to have him). Castro is pretty versatile so he can play pretty much everywhere in midfield.

But yeah, eitherway it's not a necessity, but Kagawa's place is most under threat(although Gotze replacing Kagawa's role is not really needed)

Kagawa also got 26 starts(out of 29 appearances and a possible 34) in the league and 5 starts out of 8 europa league appearances so I would be inclined to think he's first choice.
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bj27
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#7706
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#7706
(Original post by Ass State)
Whilst nobody can underestimate Wenger's ability of buying lightweight attacking midfielders that clearly aren't what they need, Gotze doesn't fit in there at all. Which makes it weird why you mentioned them as a potential target. Anyway they'll probably secure Xhaka soon and two outfield signings in a window will give Wenger a nosebleed.

I've said it before, the only alternatives Gotze has to LFC are Juve and staying at Bayern. Both of which would be career suicide.
Why would Juve be career suicide? I would think Allegri would try accommodate him in the squad, especially if Morata is going and they don't buy another striker as they could go back to the diamond they played in 14/15 with Gotze at the tip.
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#7707
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#7707
(Original post by bammy jastard 27)
Wrt Weigl, didn't mention him because I was talking about the CM positions in the 4-3-3 rather than the midfield. I was more saying that those three that I stated are the ones who occupy the central midfield positions(where Gotze would likely play in the 4-3-3 as he's probably not better than Mki or Reus out wide) as Weigl plays deep, especially as Gotze doesn't play as a DLP/DM.

Kagawa has played 12 games as a CM and 18 as a CAM so I guess he plays both as they alternate the two formations(so maybe there is space for Gotze but it's not a necessity/desire to have him). Castro is pretty versatile so he can play pretty much everywhere in midfield.

But yeah, eitherway it's not a necessity, but Kagawa's place is most under threat(although Gotze replacing Kagawa's role is not really needed)

Kagawa also got 26 starts(out of 29 appearances and a possible 34) in the league and 5 starts out of 8 europa league appearances so I would be inclined to think he's first choice.
I dunno how Whoscored are calculating what position Shinji plays in but it's definitely not what I'd call central midfield.

Shinji - got a lot of games to start the season (with Sahin, Durm injured), is generally part of first team rotation, but Castro, Gundogan, Weigl would be the midfield if everyone was fit and there were no other commitments etc. Shinji is definitely in the first team rotation, done his job well, don't see why Gotze would be targeted to upgrade on him. They need a deeper midfielder to replace Gundogan, whether he moves or not.

(Original post by bammy jastard 27)
Why would Juve be career suicide? I would think Allegri would try accommodate him in the squad, especially if Morata is going and they don't buy another striker as they could go back to the diamond they played in 14/15 with Gotze at the tip.
It's Italy: **** pay, retirement home, one-team league, poor exit opportunities, doesn't suit Gotze's style of football etc.
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bj27
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#7708
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#7708
(Original post by Ass State)
I dunno how Whoscored are calculating what position Shinji plays in but it's definitely not what I'd call central midfield.

Shinji - got a lot of games to start the season (with Sahin, Durm injured), is generally part of first team rotation, but Castro, Gundogan, Weigl would be the midfield if everyone was fit and there were no other commitments etc. Shinji is definitely in the first team rotation, done his job well, don't see why Gotze would be targeted to upgrade on him. They need a deeper midfielder to replace Gundogan, whether he moves or not.



It's Italy: **** pay, retirement home, one-team league, poor exit opportunities, doesn't suit Gotze's style of football etc.
I guess. I ain't watched Dortmund(well in the second half of the season anyway) so I can't say. I assume they've been using 4-2-3-1 more though.

I don't see the need for Gotze at Dortmund either but if they can afford him I guess it can help them challenge Bayern. Dortmund's lack of rotation options under Klopp made it impossible for him to sustain a title challenge as well as stay competitive in europe, in that case Gotze going back to Dortmund makes sense.

They need to buy a CB badly though and I think Gotze is Liverpool bound anyway. I'd like him at Chelsea but don't see the need for him if Conte wants to go 4-2-4/4-3-3.
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#7709
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#7709
(Original post by bammy jastard 27)
I guess. I ain't watched Dortmund(well in the second half of the season anyway) so I can't say. I assume they've been using 4-2-3-1 more though.

I don't see the need for Gotze at Dortmund either but if they can afford him I guess it can help them challenge Bayern. Dortmund's lack of rotation options under Klopp made it impossible for him to sustain a title challenge as well as stay competitive in europe, in that case Gotze going back to Dortmund makes sense.

They need to buy a CB badly though and I think Gotze is Liverpool bound anyway. I'd like him at Chelsea but don't see the need for him if Conte wants to go 4-2-4/4-3-3.
I haven't watched loads either but did the scouting before our tie.

Again, don't see the point. Dembele, Pulisic, Passlack, Ramos, Castro, Durm, (Kagawa) are sufficient back up for a front three/four of Auba, Reus, Mkhi, (Kagawa). Kicker said they're not interested and they're as close to fact as media gets.

They have Ginter to step in for Hummels (people said he was the long term replacement anyway) so they'll probably get Sule or Tah. I feel like I got this info off qua but I'm not sure.
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bj27
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#7710
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#7710
(Original post by Ass State)
I haven't watched loads either but did the scouting before our tie.

Again, don't see the point. Dembele, Pulisic, Passlack, Ramos, Castro, Durm, (Kagawa) are sufficient back up for a front three/four of Auba, Reus, Mkhi, (Kagawa). Kicker said they're not interested and they're as close to fact as media gets.

They have Ginter to step in for Hummels (people said he was the long term replacement anyway) so they'll probably get Sule or Tah. I feel like I got this info off qua but I'm not sure.
That's fair enough. I guess then Liverpool is the most likely destination in that case. With Ozil I doubt Wenger will buy Gotze either.

Qua mentioned that the idea was for Ginter to be a long term Hummels replacement which was what most people thought when he was signed, but they were looking at a couple of signings, Sule and Dragovic. I think putting Ginter in as first choice CB will be too much anyway.
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Zerforax
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#7711
Report Thread starter 2 years ago
#7711
(Original post by Ass State)
21 goals or assists this season, which is more than 'superstars' Firmino and Coutinho. Only three were penalties. I think 6.5 is extremely harsh. I can see him starting a similar number of games next season, he's productive, gritty and he's a winner, and we clearly don't have enough of those.
I wasn't so much rating his season but rather the signing. He's probably the best "piano carrier" in the squad in terms of doing all the hardwork. His game intelligence is underrated too but considering he moved to Liverpool to play CM, he hasn't really stamped himself into the XI in his preferred position? Obviously a good signing but so far it hasn't looked like a star signing?
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samir12
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#7712
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#7712
Milner has been a good signing, just not for the right position (CM). Quite a few of our signings were actually decent imo but they just didn't address the the problems we had in our squad. Last two windows just feels like we focus too much on buying a good player and not enough on buying the right player, we need both.
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LFC_fan_321
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#7713
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#7713
LvG > Klopp. LvG 1 final, 1 trophy. Klopp 2 finals 0 trophies.
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Lúcio
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#7714
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#7714
(Original post by LFC_fan_321)
LvG > Klopp. LvG 1 final, 1 trophy. Klopp 2 finals 0 trophies.
By that logic, Barnsley > United

Barnsley: 2 finals, 1 trophy (so far)
United: 1 final, 1 trophy

Pls leave
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Zayn is Bae
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#7715
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#7715
(Original post by Lúcio)
By that logic, Barnsley > United

Barnsley: 2 finals, 1 trophy (so far)
United: 1 final, 1 trophy

Pls leave
No, by that logic Barnsley= United, and if they lose the Play-Off final United> Barnsley you dumbass


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Lúcio
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#7716
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#7716
(Original post by Zayn is Bae)
No, by that logic Barnsley= United, and if they lose the Play-Off final United> Barnsley you dumbass


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A team getting to 2 finals and winning 1 is obviously better than a team only getting to 1 final and winning 1.

Pls re-evaluate your life.
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Zayn is Bae
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#7717
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#7717
(Original post by Lúcio)
A team getting to 2 finals and winning 1 is obviously better than a team only getting to 1 final and winning 1.

Pls re-evaluate your life.
100% win rate in the final>
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Lúcio
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#7718
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#7718
(Original post by Zayn is Bae)
100% win rate in the final>
This is the dumbest argument you've ever made.

Seriously.
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Zayn is Bae
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#7719
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#7719
(Original post by Lúcio)
This is the dumbest argument you've ever made.

Seriously.
So you're saying that a team that reaches cup finals but lose have had a successful season


Are you Swansea


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Lúcio
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#7720
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#7720
(Original post by Zayn is Bae)
So you're saying that a team that reaches cup finals but lose have had a successful season


Are you Swansea


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No, I'm saying that if you're using the previous logic, a club that has won the same trophies as another but gotten to more finals has obviously had a better season.

Pls leave u fool
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