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    (Original post by Aj12)
    A few months ago there was a thread about something to do with Africa, can't remember the details but one theme kept coming up and that was that most of Africa's problems were caused by colonisation and various atrocities committed by European nation's.

    Now is this really still a relevant way to explain many of Africa's problems?

    Take the Congo for example. Belgium left the country in 1960 that's more than half a decade ago. Would it still be relevant to blame problems like the civil war an the violence on colonisation?


    Also can much of the poverty we see today still be linked to European empires exploiting their colonies?
    So just because something happened a while ago, it can't still be having an effect. I havent read much on colonisation, but from what little I do know, it seems that the world powers exited their former colonies really quickly. The result? Chaos as a system that has been reliant on something suddenly has to adapt very quickly without it.
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    (Original post by Benammieh)
    The explanation for most of africas poverty is because of the corruption that lies within the governments. Only a small proportion is linked with the exploitation.

    You will see the presidents driving VERY expensive cars living in Massive masions with gold pools and what not, whilst they are forgetting they have to deal with the poorest of them all. The lack of education is another point. African leaders should start relying on their own countries to make a difference.

    My parents are both from ghana and come from a fairly wealthy backgrounds. And my grandmother has built a school to help poor children get that important education. Which is what Africans need to start doing. Ghana's economy is blooming because of the Gold, Cocoa, and the newly found oil but yet nothing is being done about the people who suffer
    YES there is corruption in parts of Africa but corruption exist where poverty exist. Crime is not the problem; the problem again is WEALTH IMBALANCE. Crime is not the actions of an evil soul but desperation. Had these criminals roaming the streets of certain countries in Africa been exposed to the fullest education backed with strong family units and not have a European dominated materialistic culture toyed in their face it is very unlikely that most of them would be committing these crimes.

    All people in here do is shift the blame. Slavery = AFRICA'S FAULT, Poverty = AFRICA'S FAULT. Aids = AFRICA'S FAULT. They talk like Africa woke up and found itself in this mess and transatlantic slave trade, colonial rule, viral introduction, destruction of African family unit through poverty and slavery has no bearing. All them rich leaders you talk about are supported by the west because they will go along with their wishes. Where as people like Robert Mugabe who wants to take the land back that white people stole and wants redistribution of wealth is hated and vilified and seen as a crack pot.

    As I said before white people have a VAST TALKING MACHING, a huge mega watt ear popping sound system of newspapers, TV programmes, news (A news that is being laid on top of racism, a racism that already expects the worst of black people – making the bad news seem more telling than it is and the racism, in turn, more true than it is) radio, forums, blogs, schools university which they use, to further their own ends. This mega watt ear popping sound system drowns out anyone else's opinion and sees their opinion as fact, even thoughh it just an opinion. So they get to decide who is seen as a bad guy and who is seen as a good guy.

    Listen. under apartheid and colonialism Africans faced generations of generations of lost of vital skill banks. So while Europeans were getting access to qualifications and then acquiring years of experience and special knowledge in nation building sectors, these opportunities were denied to African people. Whites were ruling over the continent subjugating the people all the while sucking out the natural resources then leaving them in a shambles. And now they want to point the finger at generations of people who are damaged and say “Why don’t you run your country better ?” As if all it takes is to one day say “Go free !! And BAM !!” Those people are able to catch up.

    It will still take years for this current generation to acquire the experience to become leaders in these fields. Unfortunately, education is tied to economics and when the majority are in poverty it means that access to the necessary education is not being satisfied. Even if the government favours giving loans to African business people if these people are skill deficient, a lot of wastage and failure will occur, to the cheer of critics like who believe Africans are incapable of self-governance. See, what makes white supremacy work and what make it SO VICIOUS is that it protects itself by breeding dependency among those it subjugates.

    By the way, I got to say that people often talk about Africa as if it's one big country. It's not. It has a thousand languages and often when people point out poverty in Africa they never talk about the island of Gabon or Reunion or many other countries where people have a good standard of living
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    (Original post by NigerianStudent)
    YES there is corruption in parts of Africa but corruption exist where poverty exist. Crime is not the problem; the problem again is WEALTH IMBALANCE. Crime is not the actions of an evil soul but desperation. Had these criminals roaming the streets of certain countries in Africa been exposed to the fullest education backed with strong family units and not have a European dominated materialistic culture toyed in their face it is very unlikely that most of them would be committing these crimes.

    All people in here do is shift the blame. Slavery = AFRICA'S FAULT, Poverty = AFRICA'S FAULT. Aids = AFRICA'S FAULT. They talk like Africa woke up and found itself in this mess and transatlantic slave trade, colonial rule, viral introduction, destruction of African family unit through poverty and slavery has no bearing. All them rich leaders you talk about are supported by the west because they will go along with their wishes. Where as people like Robert Mugabe who wants to take the land back that white people stole and wants redistribution of wealth is hated and vilified and seen as a crack pot.

    As I said before white people have a VAST TALKING MACHING, a huge mega watt ear popping sound system of newspapers, TV programmes, news (A news that is being laid on top of racism, a racism that already expects the worst of black people – making the bad news seem more telling than it is and the racism, in turn, more true than it is) radio, forums, blogs, schools university which they use, to further their own ends. This mega watt ear popping sound system drowns out anyone else's opinion and sees their opinion as fact, even thoughh it just an opinion. So they get to decide who is seen as a bad guy and who is seen as a good guy.

    Listen. under apartheid and colonialism Africans faced generations of generations of lost of vital skill banks. So while Europeans were getting access to qualifications and then acquiring years of experience and special knowledge in nation building sectors, these opportunities were denied to African people. Whites were ruling over the continent subjugating the people all the while sucking out the natural resources then leaving them in a shambles. And now they want to point the finger at generations of people who are damaged and say “Why don’t you run your country better ?” As if all it takes is to one day say “Go free !! And BAM !!” Those people are able to catch up.

    It will still take years for this current generation to acquire the experience to become leaders in these fields. Unfortunately, education is tied to economics and when the majority are in poverty it means that access to the necessary education is not being satisfied. Even if the government favours giving loans to African business people if these people are skill deficient, a lot of wastage and failure will occur, to the cheer of critics like who believe Africans are incapable of self-governance. See, what makes white supremacy work and what make it SO VICIOUS is that it protects itself by breeding dependency among those it subjugates.

    By the way, I got to say that people often talk about Africa as if it's one big country. It's not. It has a thousand languages and often when people point out poverty in Africa they never talk about the island of Gabon or Reunion or many other countries where people have a good standard of living
    Exactly! Everything you said is true. All Africa needs are good leaders people who are able to keep the wealth well balanced! It will definately take many years but it will happen!
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    (Original post by Silver Arrow)
    You should all read Guns, Germs and Steel by Jared Diamond. It explains how the world got to where it is today. Simple fact is, white people had the pure luck of living in a geographically perfect environment that allowed them to flourish. They're arent superior WHATSOEVER ! Now the problem with Africa is a very complex one, and one that won't be sorted for at least a few centuries. I personally believe that if Europeans hadn't set foor in Africa, it would be nowhere near as bad as it is today.
    And you should read New York Times science writer Nicholas Wade's 'Before the Dawn'. Or even better, 'The 10,000 Year Explosion: How Civilization Accelerated Human Evolution'.

    Like GGS, these books acknowledge the importance of geography, however, they also include recent genetic research showing this lead to selection for different cognitive and physical traits. At least 7% of the genome has undergone recent selection which appears to have accelerated with agriculture and population expansion.

    As a basic example of changes, brain shape & sizes changed quite considerably. (2009). Whole brain size and general mental ability: A review. International Journal of Neuroscience, 119, http://psychology.uwo.ca/faculty/rus...2009%20IJN.pdf

    Even in the last 700 years there is evidence of a significant change in brain size:

    "Researchers have found that the shape of the human skull has changed significantly over the past 650 years.

    Modern people possess less prominent features but higher foreheads than our medieval ancestors.
    ...

    They looked at 30 skulls dating from the mid-14th Century. They had come from the unlucky victims of the plague. The skulls had been excavated from plague pits in the 1980s in London.

    Another 54 skulls examined by the team were recovered from the wreck of the Mary Rose which sank off the south coast of England in 1545.

    All the skulls were compared with 31 recent orthodontic records from the School of Dentistry in Birmingham.

    Dr Peter Rock, lead author of the study and director of orthodontistry at Birmingham University, told the BBC News website: "The astonishing finding is the increased cranial vault heights.

    "The increase is very considerable. For example, the vault height of the plague skulls were 80mm, and the modern ones were 95mm - that's in the order of 20% bigger, which is really rather a lot."

    He suggests that the increase in size may be due to an increase in mental capacity over the ages.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/4643312.stm

    Also, I would recommend UC Davis economist Greg Clark's 'A Farewell to Alms, mentioned here by Steve Hsu in relation to recent human evolution:

    In my recent book, A Farewell to Alms: A Brief Economic History of the World I argue two things. First that all societies remained in a state I label the “Malthusian economy” up until the onset of the Industrial Revolution around 1800. In that state crucially the economic laws governing all human societies before 1800 were those that govern all animal societies. Second that was thus subject to natural selection throughout the Malthusian era, even after the arrival of settled agrarian societies with the Neolithic Revolution.

    The Darwinian struggle that shaped human nature did not end with the Neolithic Revolution but continued right up until the Industrial Revolution. But the arrival of settled agriculture and stable property rights set natural selection on a very different course. It created an accelerated period of evolution, rewarding with reproductive success a new repertoire of human behaviors – patience, self-control, passivity, and hard work – which consequently spread widely.

    And we see in England, from at least 1250, that the kind of people who succeeded in the economic system – who accumulated assets, got skills, got literacy – increased their representation in each generation. Through the long agrarian passage leading up to the Industrial Revolution man was becoming biologically more adapted to the modern economic world. Modern people are thus in part a creation of the market economies that emerged with the Neolithic Revolution. Just as people shaped economies, the pre-industrial economy shaped people. This has left the people of long settled agrarian societies substantially different now from our hunter gatherer ancestors, in terms of culture, and likely also in terms of biology. We are also presumably equivalently different from groups like Australian Aboriginals that never experience the Neolithic Revolution before the arrival of the English settlers in 1788.
    http://infoproc.blogspot.com/2010/07...y-edition.html
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    (Original post by Aj12)
    A few months ago there was a thread about something to do with Africa, can't remember the details but one theme kept coming up and that was that most of Africa's problems were caused by colonisation and various atrocities committed by European nation's.

    Now is this really still a relevant way to explain many of Africa's problems?

    Take the Congo for example. Belgium left the country in 1960 that's more than half a decade ago. Would it still be relevant to blame problems like the civil war an the violence on colonisation?


    Also can much of the poverty we see today still be linked to European empires exploiting their colonies?
    lol wut?
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    Some of those poverty adverts were really stupid.

    "She has to walk 50 miles every day to get water"

    That really doesn't make sense, because if i lived that far away from a water source, i'd seriously consider moving closer to it.
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    Africa's situation is a complex one, there are several factors to consider; I believe the main one is a lack of cultural belief in self development and education, I think there is a lot we can learn from the developmental democracy of ancient Athens and their belief in Eudemonia. Furthermore, I believe the leaders need to learn how to inspire their people and make tactical arrangements for the benefit of Africa.

    Right now, it is just a series of corrupt blind individuals leading a blind populace, unless people like me get a PPE degree and get back there I feel that Africa will just be further exploited by expanding economies of Asia and a big opportunity could be missed.

    Yes, it is true imperialism and conquest states is still rife in world politics, it is know longer done through acquiring land mass but rather through the exportation of 'democracy', which is capitalism disguise.

    Yes, democracy and the freedom of the demos is important, but it should come in a developmental model not in a model of a protective democracy like we have here in England because that is not the one for us. Africa needs to work with alliance with China however, they must maintain and beware that china will only be in the interest of china and so make sure that the terms which they accept is fair and not just for the enrichment of corrupt leaders.
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    (Original post by Diaz89)
    The effects of colonialism didn't end with independence ceremonies, their influence is far reaching and will remain so.

    European Colonial Empires really ****ed up the world, more than any Empires that preceded them.
    They brought nasty things like infrastructure, sewage systems, literacy & medicine!!

    Come Back, Colonialism, All Is Forgiven

    Le Blanc and I are into our 500th kilometer on the river when he turns my view of modern African history on its head. "We should just give it all back to the whites," the riverboat captain says. "Even if you go 1,000 kilometers down this river, you won't see a single sign of development. When the whites left, we didn't just stay where we were. We went backwards."
    http://www.time.com/time/world/artic...713275,00.html

    Today, the legacy of Kikwit's colonial past is swiftly disappearing.

    "Civilization is coming to an end here," said Rene Kinsweke, manager of Siefac, a chain of food stores, as he spoke of how Kikwit has become a dispiriting tableau of chaos and catastrophe. "We're back where we started. We're going back into the bush."

    It is difficult to exaggerate the dizzying pace of decay in this city of nearly 400,000 people. Six months ago, the Siefac food conglomerate consisted of 21 stores in Bandundu Province. Today, a single store is left, and it is to close as soon as its remaining stock is sold, Mr. Kinsweke said.

    The main road to Kikwit is now rutted and crumbled, and for most of the year the city can be reached from Kinshasa, Zaire's capital, only by a four-wheel-drive vehicle. In 1960, when Zaire gained independence, a visitor could drive the 300 miles in six hours. Today the same drive takes at least 10 hours.

    Elsewhere in town, squatters have moved into homes that once belonged to the Belgian colonials. Entire families now camp on sidewalks, in parks and even in cemeteries. Streets and backyards are littered with indescribable filth, and toward the edges of the city the roads crumble into dirty sand and then disappear altogether. Rats and flies are breeding as never before, adding to critical sanitation and hygiene problems.

    It is at night, though, that Kikwit's seemingly inexorable roll toward ruin is felt the strongest. The sky of this sprawling city is lit with exactly two street lights, one for each of the city's remaining nightclubs. Aside from private generators, there is no electricity; nor is there running water. The postal, telex and telephone offices have been on strike for months, and no one seems able to recall when the regional radio station made its last broadcast.
    http://www.nytimes.com/1991/11/15/wo...-backward.html
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    (Original post by Chi019)
    They brought nasty things like infrastructure, sewage systems, literacy & medicine!!
    Where exactly? which ex colonial country has "infrastructure, sewage systems, literacy & medicine"

    Most actually are deprived of the above. What was taken out of them is no where near comparable to what was put in.
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    (Original post by Diaz89)
    Where exactly? which ex colonial country has "infrastructure, sewage systems, literacy & medicine"

    Most actually are deprived of the above. What was taken out of them is no where near comparable to what was put in.
    Did you read the above articles? They are deprived of the above because the europeans left (the Chinese are now taking their place). Also, how can they have had more taken out of them? They had none of those things in the first place.
 
 
 
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