Why the UK is a police state Watch

LawBore
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#61
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#61
So the country has become a Tory police state under New Labour's laws?

Ah, well. Blame Cameron.
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green chica
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#62
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(Original post by Damix)
UK is the most benevolent easygoing coutry I've ever seen. Which is why I am here
i'd say canada is, but to each his/her own.
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Rant
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#63
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(Original post by Aphotic Cosmos)
If we were living in a police state you would have already been picked up by the provincial rozzers, given a good beating and left to linger in jail for at least a few days for daring to criticise the regime before being rushed before a rubber-stamp court to confirm your guilt.

Your view of the world is clearly delusional. You have no idea what a police state is and how we compare to such a society. Until you've seen the Egyptian police beat someone publicly (this was five years ago) off the beaten track in Cairo you will have no idea what a police state is.
I think you should go to a few of the protests here, study the new laws and then ask yourself "what's stopping the country from becoming a police state?"

Currently, right now - they've won the war for the minds of the masses. Brainwashed them with crap that occupies their waking moments. Most people don't protest, or even care right now - they're too busy worrying about how they'll afford the new iPod, lounge-suite, Ferrari, whatever.

When they finally wake up, that's when the mental bars will become physical.
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Aphotic Cosmos
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#64
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(Original post by Rant)
I think you should go to a few of the protests here, study the new laws and then ask yourself "what's stopping the country from becoming a police state?"
Err, about 60 million people, Parliament, the judiciary, the Queen, the ECHR, the European Parliament. You know, those kind of safeguards? The fact that we're even having this debate means that we are a long way away from becoming a police state.

Currently, right now - they've won the war for the minds of the masses. Brainwashed them with crap that occupies their waking moments. Most people don't protest, or even care right now - they're too busy worrying about how they'll afford the new iPod, lounge-suite, Ferrari, whatever.
I am not convinced that most people in this country are devout materialists, nor that materialism is a form of control, nor that if materialism were describable as a form of control that it would be suitable for being part of the apparatus of a police state. People want nice things because they believe it will provide them with an advantage - it will save them time or raise their social standing or bring them comfort or entertainment, and thus improve their general lot in life. Materialism is nothing new, it is inherent to every human and has been since the stone age. It's what drives technological development. It is not an inherently bad thing and it is very hard to use it as a form of control on anyone who is not actually mentally ill and has problems controlling their material wants.

When they finally wake up, that's when the mental bars will become physical.
Rebel in the cogs of the machine, huh? Enjoy your fantasies :rolleyes:
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velocet
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#65
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I think to conclude we're living in a police state is a huge exagerration. According to a report by RT journalists are being denied the right to report on particular issues, to my knowledge we're seeing nothing of that. Although we have certain aspects such as police keeping records of individuals with no known criminal record as long as they don't start making arrests based on speculation it's not a problem. Yes I know there were quite a few around the time and during the Royal Wedding but I'm willing to dismiss those and merely accept that the government weren't taking any risks.

When we have freedom of the press restricted in the UK i'll admit we're becoming a police state.

Right now I'm more critical of foreign policy of the US and UK but I suppose this isn't a thread for that.
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Rant
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#66
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(Original post by Aphotic Cosmos)
Err, about 60 million people, Parliament, the judiciary, the Queen, the ECHR, the European Parliament. You know, those kind of safeguards? The fact that we're even having this debate means that we are a long way away from becoming a police state.



I am not convinced that most people in this country are devout materialists, nor that materialism is a form of control, nor that if materialism were describable as a form of control that it would be suitable for being part of the apparatus of a police state. People want nice things because they believe it will provide them with an advantage - it will save them time or raise their social standing or bring them comfort or entertainment, and thus improve their general lot in life. Materialism is nothing new, it is inherent to every human and has been since the stone age. It's what drives technological development. It is not an inherently bad thing and it is very hard to use it as a form of control on anyone who is not actually mentally ill and has problems controlling their material wants.



Rebel in the cogs of the machine, huh? Enjoy your fantasies :rolleyes:
Keep swimming in your pool of ignorance, bleater.
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LawBore
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#67
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(Original post by Rant)
Keep swimming in your pool of ignorance, bleater.
You are a great parody. The state couldn't do a better job of getting someone to make those on the hard left look like fools.
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lordash
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#68
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There are so many pointless laws that really should not be criminal offences in this country, and there are a lot of arrests for technical offences that no reasonable person would call a crime. And thanks to meaningless arrest targets, we are letting the rapists and murderers walk free whilst prosecuting people who commit technical offences, automatically giving them a criminal record (and screwing them up for life) no matter how serious or minor the offence. But thank heavens we are spending public money dealing with such heinous crimes as this.

Also, police having the right to hold someone in custody for 90 days without charge?! Ridiculous
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Rant
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#69
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#69
(Original post by LawBore)
You are a great parody. The state couldn't do a better job of getting someone to make those on the hard left look like fools.
And you are? Just another mindless drone.
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jakemittle
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#70
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(Original post by map88)
Which is what they did on Friday at the Royal Wedding. Anything the state didn't want happening was classed as breach of the peace.

People were arrested for dressing up in costumes, singing "We all live in a fascist regime" and for sitting in soho square.
Those people **** me off..people who lived in REAL fascist regimes, i.e. Italians during Mussolini would laugh and say you have absolutely no idea what real fascism is..you know that right?..
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jakemittle
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#71
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(Original post by Rant;31244490[B)
]I think you should go to a few of the protests here, [/B]study the new laws and then ask yourself "what's stopping the country from becoming a police state?"

Currently, right now - they've won the war for the minds of the masses. Brainwashed them with crap that occupies their waking moments. Most people don't protest, or even care right now - they're too busy worrying about how they'll afford the new iPod, lounge-suite, Ferrari, whatever.

When they finally wake up, that's when the mental bars will become physical.
When you went, did the police shoot protesters, throw tear gas, and beat protesters?..When I say beating, I mean grabbing people and beating them till they are either dead or they are pretty much bloody all over..?
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Shuvel
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#72
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(Original post by GwrxVurfer)
First of all, read what I've already said. If the regime ordered the TUC march gassed, there would be too much resistance.

Why do we have elections? Again, it gives a nice illusion of freedom. Personally I'd prefer to live in a country that had liberty as opposed to democracy.

The internet is censored. The regime can declare any website "restricted material" under the Digital Economy Act and then order all ISP's (under thread of legal action) to ban their users accessing it. Of course, the non-technical minded in Westminster didn't realize there is a fairly straightforward way around their "ban". But the point is they tried to censor it.

Go near Downing Street with a placard that demands the regime stops abusing it's citizens, and accepts it's defeat - I bet you'll be confronted by a police officer who will try to make you account for yourself.
The regime? get a bloody grip. We don't live in Syria.
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tulley11
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#73
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(Original post by Rob da Mop)

Since when was kettling illegal? It's an effective method of controlling a crowd that is no longer peacefully protesting. It's a bit heavy handed but, when used well, it works.
It's not effective at all, your stopping people moving freely to try and stop any problems occuring.
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Renner
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#74
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#74
Liberals don't mind police authoritarianism when it's aimed at football oiks

Telegraph hits the nail on the head
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Aj12
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#75
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(Original post by GwrxVurfer)
No it doesn't, because the coalition have chosen to KEEP the Digital Economy Act, reneging on their promise to abolish it.
I would not worry about. I doubt most of the provisions will ever be used. Most ISP's will ignore the act unless they get a direct order from government. Then they will launch a legal challenge against that order. Would take months to actually get anything done with the act as it is on very shaky ground and open to many challenges through our own courts as well as the EU court of human rights.
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LawBore
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#76
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(Original post by Rant)
And you are? Just another mindless drone.
Well done! You've scored on Bonkers Bingo! Look out for:

  • Sheep
  • Sheeple
  • Open YOUR EYES!
  • Think FOR YOURSELF!
  • The cuts are SEXIST/RACIST (extra points for FASCIST)
  • Class War
  • The Workers
  • 'Solidarity' used in place of 'Hello', brother.
  • ConDem, Thatcher, etc


A full house gets you a bit of smashed Tesco window.

Don't worry, you needn't reply. I already know what you'll say.
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U.S Lecce
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#77
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#77
Uk? you mean north korea?
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sollythewise
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#78
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(Original post by map88)
Or at the very least becoming one...

People say that if you have nothing to hide then you need not fear, then why have the police been gathering evidence and carrying out surveillance operations on so many?

The so-called 'domestic extremist database', which includes peaceful protesters:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/ap...ses?CMP=twt_gu

http://www.monbiot.com/2011/01/17/th...ic-extremists/

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/ma...t-surveillance

So now we have he police using illegal tactics (kettling), using undercover infiltrators, collecting detailed information on innocent people (and subsequent harassment based on their car registrations) and pre-arrests of peaceful protesters (Charlie Veitch).

Please enter into a discussion on whether the UK is a police state or not? Based on this evidence, I genuinely believe it is. However, the government has maintained the impression we have the 'right to peaceful protest'. In light of the information they have gathered and their recent willingness to arrest for almost anything under 'breach of the peace' (e.g. people dressed as zombies for the Royal Wedding), I don't even believe this is the case anymore.
so we are now in a police state. right. i suppose the situation is as bad as the one in stalinist russia, nazi germany, china even today, where no-one can speak their mind because they will be tortured, their families attacked, and possibly executed.

if you want to discuss possible over-powerful police, alienation of the police from the public or kettling, feel free to do so. please don't use this sort of over-hyped nonsensical language to debate real issues.
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Shuvel
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#79
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#79
(Original post by GwrxVurfer)
We don't live in Syria, I don't recall anyone saying anything to the contrary? Why are you referencing a country whose only news story currently is that criminals rioting are being contained and arrested by the police en masse - I don't see the connection.

The word "regime" means a form of government. So, the UK is a democratic regime.
Yes but no-one uses it in the western world unless it's with negative connotations. Regime is only used to make a negative reflection, generally in places where journalists seem to have a phobia of using the word government to describe a system they don't like.
Only places I've heard regime used in an official way is in the prison service..
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hazyjane
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#80
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I have a few points to make starting with the last comment.
Regime is not a negative word the UK and USA removed Saddam Hussein on grounds of a regime change and both Blair and Bush used the word completely freely as though they were doing something really good for Iraq.

SORRY IF THIS SEEMS LIKE A REALLY LENGTHY POST BUT I WILL KEEP IT AS SHORT AS I CAN.
THESE ARE EXTREMELY IMPORTANT POINTS THAT I AM TRYING TO CONVEY
SO PLEASE PLEASE READ THEM


Firstly I would like to say thank you to whoever started this thread about whether the UK is a police state or not?

What was interesting from my perspective was that I remember asking myself the same question a couple of years ago.

If I think about the question logically I actually would have to answer yes the UK is a police state.
The situation though the UK does not appear to be a police state as very few people rock the boat enough to get to see it in action.
Try to challenge with any determination any of the points I go on to make and my guess is that you would then get a definitive answer.

Trouble is no one does.




I

I am genuinely shocked and very saddened some of the comments and attitudes posted on this thread.
I have studied UK and world politics in some depth and over some time and from all sides.
I am in no doubt whatsoever that the government despite what they may have us believe are definitely not there to serve us.
We did not democratically elect them although we are led to believe that we did and as a result they have assumed power.
Are people aware that most tory cabinet minister are millionaires?
Yet they want to rob the people of this country blind.

One post actually stated that because we chose to put the government in power they are now there to serve us the people.
I do not mean this as a personal attack however anybody who beleives that to be the case has in fact fallen hook line and sinker
into their trap.

Life would be so nice and lovely and fluffy and really wonderful if only I could sit here with complete faith and trust that my politicians are tirelessly beavering around in no10 thinking and working on ideas all day everyday about how to enrich the average persons quality of life and happiness.

.
This government and the last government are controlled by the rich ruling elite which is headed by the apparently lovely and harmless monarchy neither which have been democratically elected.
The queen has the power to dissolve and get rid of our so called democratically chosen government at a stroke if she so wished.
The Queen has the backing if she ever chose to use them by the armed police force and the armed military.
Just in case that that was not enough we the people do not have a legal right to bare arms in case we might want to offer some resistance.


I am going to make a guess at this point and say that I bet anything that if anyone is still me that they are now really thinking that I have entirely lost the plot and even that maybe I should be certified.
I can almost hear people screaming good god!
she's completely barking she doesn't believe in laws and people will start going around murdering and robbing each other and will will have total anarchy.
However far from society plunging into utter chaos and lawlessness there are case histories as well as considerable academic studies to suggest that if society were left to police itself as it sees fit there would a noticeable drop in crime along with other all round benefits.
This subject alone has had a good deal of academic study dedicated to it and but if I try to go into any depth at all just now I will probably end up writing an essay on it so I won't.

However if anyone does want me to elaborate on this point or any other points please fell free to send me a message.
.



We would not want to upset the state in anyway at all would we?
God forbid that we spoil in anyway tiny way the big f%&*ing royal wedding with all their completely vacuous over privileged friends.
Let alone even a tiny thought that some honest working class person might even very slightly upset or offend a total despotic barbaric foreign leader from an African or middle eastern country that on any humanitarian grounds should never be invited into the UK but is and then welcomed with open arms.

We in this country the USA and many other countries are exploited and no more than their profit making slaves.
When they have no way of profiting from the people they throw them on the scrapheap.
This is capitalism and this time this government are trying to take just about everything from us.
We the working class the proletariat have fought and fought and made huge unmeasurable personal sacrifices for generation after generation to get the filthy obscenely rich to give back at least a small fraction of the wealth that we have made for them
Just check out some of the thousands of workers struggles from history if you do not believe what I am saying and you will see all to clearly that all the gains we the working class made were very rarely given to us.
Our parents our grandparents and their parents and so on all across the industrial world gave up so much for we we have today.
Such things as free healthcare, free education, an 8 hour day holiday pay,care for the old and disabled ,
welfare for those that can not work social housing and libraries etc etc.

As for the remark one poster made stating that we are ok as long as we do not break the law we have nothing to fear needs to have a good hard think about the situation we are in.
We need to seriously start to think about breaking utterly restrictive inhumane laws such as the right to a general strike for a start.
Thatcher brought in draconian anti strike laws to smash the power of the workers only for Labour who are supposedly the peoples party not to think once about repealing any of them.
Why? because it does not benefit the bosses and their profits.
Anyone who believes for 1 second that the state would not come down heavy and as hard if we start showing an meaningful civil disobedience I'm afraid is seriously naive and when the time comes as I believe it will they are in for a huge wake up call.
Just for now the police and the state are only as heavy handed as they need to be.
The fact we can exercise freedom of speech is not a threat in anyway to the government it is far more expedient for them to let us for the most part blow of some steam in a harmless fashion.
March 26 was absolute no threat to the state the absolute majority of the people demonstrating were never going to kick off the small breakaway anarchists were also completely manageable to the police.
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