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    (Original post by Scots King)
    He's right though! It's just not good enough. Three years into the current Parliament and still they've got nothing. They've flirted with "blue labour", with "predistribution of wealth." Still nothing concrete. They're supposed to be ready to govern.

    Instead all they can do is set up traps for the government and feign outrage at a tax cut they actually support.
    I'm not sure about this. Isn't it just the nature of our political system? Mr Cameron had no real policies up until the end of 2009/early 2010, so Labour are just continuing with that trend.

    And to be honest, I can't really blame them. Why would you promise something now, to be rolled out in 2015 or beyond. This economy changes so fast?

    But I do think, it is a sad state of affairs. Red tie or Blue tie...they are just as bad!
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    (Original post by Chad_Bronson)
    Perhaps they went into coalition, but despite the Lib Dems insisting they have a relevance in government - they don't. The Liberal Democrats have just shown themselves up to be a party lacking bottle and the vitality to stand up to the Tory agenda and say "This is unacceptable."

    It is mostly a right-wing, Tory driven agenda - and when David Cameron formed his government, he deliberately picked his own party members for the good spots - chancellor, secretary of education for example. Of course he would do that.

    How different would it be if they had a Liberal Democrat agenda...?

    Compromising is a good thing in theory, just like the idea of a coalition is. In theory. But the Lib Dems are proving to be a party that is getting utterly slaughted by the Tory agenda. Given the current economic state, you might as just well had a Tory majority.

    Not to worry though - We'll betray the Liberal Democrats come the 2015 election when they fight as seperate parties - just as they betrayed us for a slice of power.
    I know what I am saying is all simply theoretical, but I believe that had the Lib Dems not been in power the Conservatives would have been able to put through more Thatcherite legislation. I don't support the Lib Dems, but I'd far rather a Lib Dem/Conservative coalition than just the Tories in power. At least they're keeping a pro-EU stance, otherwise we would be well and truly screwed.

    The Lib Dems should stand up to the Conservatives, but if they did then they would be accused of undermining stability etc. So they can't win either way, and really its always the smaller party in a coalition that loses out. Again I think that if the Lib Dems had not gone into coalition and another election had been called, they would have also been accused of undermining stability; at the end of the day, they didn't have a choice and have found themselves in a Catch-22 situation.

    Though I can't really see the coalition lasting for the full term, especially since Cameron can't seem to control his backbenchers, just the other day I was watching PMQs and his own backbenchers seemed to be working against him, albeit subtly. At the end of the day, the Tories still have the legacy of Thatcherism hanging over them, and like it or not most of them are still Thatcherites, even if the leadership is slightly less extreme. It is difficult for a party which is basically centre-left to work with a party that is right-wing. I don't think it would be that impossible for either side to call a motion of no-confindence, especially since we don't seem to be growing at all, and the next quarters result will probably be not so good due to the extraordinary amount of snow and cold weather and the high street closures.

    But Labour are only marginally better, although it too subscribes to a free-market ideology, although not to the extent of the Tories.
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    (Original post by theblackphoenixcon)
    I know what I am saying is all simply theoretical, but I believe that had the Lib Dems not been in power the Conservatives would have been able to put through more Thatcherite legislation. I don't support the Lib Dems, but I'd far rather a Lib Dem/Conservative coalition than just the Tories in power. At least they're keeping a pro-EU stance, otherwise we would be well and truly screwed.
    What's harrowing about that comment is you're absolutely right. The Lib Dems may be getting a battering from the Tories, but at least their vetoing their fully Tory agenda.

    (Original post by theblackphoenixcon)
    Again I think that if the Lib Dems had not gone into coalition and another election had been called, they would have also been accused of undermining stability; at the end of the day, they didn't have a choice and have found themselves in a Catch-22 situation.
    Fair point - we only have ourselves to blame for voting a hung parliament

    (Original post by theblackphoenixcon)
    Though I can't really see the coalition lasting for the full term, especially since Cameron can't seem to control his backbenchers, just the other day I was watching PMQs and his own backbenchers seemed to be working against him, albeit subtly. At the end of the day, the Tories still have the legacy of Thatcherism hanging over them, and like it or not most of them are still Thatcherites, even if the leadership is slightly less extreme. It is difficult for a party which is basically centre-left to work with a party that is right-wing. I don't think it would be that impossible for either side to call a motion of no-confindence, especially since we don't seem to be growing at all, and the next quarters result will probably be not so good due to the extraordinary amount of snow and cold weather and the high street closures.

    But Labour are only marginally better, although it too subscribes to a free-market ideology, although not to the extent of the Tories.
    Spot on. When the 2015 election comes around, the electorate will judge them for exactly what they should be. The quicker this vile government is out of power, the better.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    If either the Conservatives or Lib Dems voted for such a motion during the term of this parliament, they'd look a bit hypocritical and their legislation would look pointless.
    I agree it is very unlikely but it is theoretically possible...I posted in response to a member who suggested an early general election can't be held at all.
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    (Original post by Eboracum)
    I'm not sure about this. Isn't it just the nature of our political system? Mr Cameron had no real policies up until the end of 2009/early 2010, so Labour are just continuing with that trend.

    And to be honest, I can't really blame them. Why would you promise something now, to be rolled out in 2015 or beyond. This economy changes so fast?

    But I do think, it is a sad state of affairs. Red tie or Blue tie...they are just as bad!
    The Tories aren't much better...although I think they had a bit more substance to their policies than Labour certainly do in opposition...such as his promise to hold a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty...the "cast iron guarantee"...which of course he failed to give us.

    I think it is legitimate for them to at least set out broad policy objectives, leaving the intimate details to be revealed later. But Labour aren't even anywhere near this stage yet.

    What is their position? Are they going to get tough on welfare, or are they content to maintain spending?

    Are they going to try and reduce the deficit, or continue borrowing ad nauseum?

    What is their stance on the EU and immigration?

    What is their stance on social housing?

    What is their policy on education?

    It's a sad indictment on our political system that we can't expect to have answers to these basic questions!
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    (Original post by sugar-n-spice)
    Probably more to do with the whole recession thing than a fiendish trap the tax raise.

    People earning a million pounds will literally save more than the average yearly salary (and most people earn less than that). It's also the poorest working families who are worse off and it's the poorest generally who spend more of their money, than the richest and that by spending rather than hoarding they are actually playing a vital role in the economy.
    Really? Just months before a general election? And then choosing t make a big song and dance about it now? Knowing full well lowering it would be political suicide for the Tories?
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    (Original post by Scots King)
    Really? Just months before a general election? And then choosing t make a big song and dance about it now? Knowing full well lowering it would be political suicide for the Tories?
    There was an emergency budget and when that budget was passed they didn't know they would lose the election.
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    (Original post by sugar-n-spice)
    There was an emergency budget and when that budget was passed they didn't know they would lose the election.
    I'm struggling to see where the impetus for the rise came from considering they had it at 40p for nearly 13 years if it wasn't to set a trap for the Tories!
 
 
 
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