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    (Original post by nukethemaly)
    Most of the students here that are agreeing with Gove's point about holidays being too long are GCSE students, once you get to A-levels and you've worked your arse off through the year, you'll realise how crucial these long breaks are. And considering he's scrapped off Jan retakes, we ARE going to need the holidays (be it half term, Easter, just whatever) to prepare for our exams.

    Firstly you don't need summer to prepare, your exams will be over.
    Secondly why do you need this? At 16 I entered a job that worked up To a hundred hour weeks at times with only 20 days entitlement. I survived that just dine for several years as did many other my

    Agw
    age.

    Lastly, at uni (if you do a decent course) you will work your arsenal off even moree over all the holidays and then work for money all summer.
    At school you don't work that hard, and in many jobs you will work a lot harder for years. Hence why I think any move to prepare children for the realities of work is a good one.
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    (Original post by c471)
    Firstly you don't need summer to prepare, your exams will be over.
    Secondly why do you need this? At 16 I entered a job that worked up To a hundred hour weeks at times with only 20 days entitlement. I survived that just dine for several years as did many other my

    Agw
    age.

    Lastly, at uni (if you do a decent course) you will work your arsenal off even moree over all the holidays and then work for money all summer.
    At school you don't work that hard, and in many jobs you will work a lot harder for years. Hence why I think any move to prepare children for the realities of work is a good one.
    A job is not at all the same as a learning environment. It can be challenging, but you're not taking in and assimilating new information constantly.
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    He claims to be trying to model our education system after those in Eastern Asian countries. What an idiot; has he ever stopped to look at why teen suicide is so high in Japan and why so few are capable of thinking for themselves? The current A-Level system works fine, it requires a level of individual thinking and moving to a more facts-based system is simply moronic. He just wants to cultivate a new generation of sheeple; one of the reasons nazism was so successful in Germany was because it permeated the education as well.

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    Hes one of these absolute idiots who thinks that teaching is the only way to get good results? I despise a lot of my teachers, so the Easter break played well for me. I can't stand nearly a whole year with my teachers its just so bad. Regardless more hours does not equal better educational standards
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    (Original post by SocksRock)
    A job is not at all the same as a learning environment. It can be challenging, but you're not taking in and assimilating new information constantly.
    what utter rubbish. Maybe if you work in a shop, its not, but there are plenty of jobs where it is equally if not more mentally draining.

    Apart from topics like maths & science where you may be required to learn new concepts, 'taking on new infomation' is something that is done by everybody. Reading about ww2 and learning it is no different to bankers reading the FT and learning from it every morning, no different to engineers reading industry or company publications and learning from it and no different from doctors reading new research. Any proffessional these days is expected to be conversant with the ins and outs of their industry as a minimum, and this usually means you are constantly 'assimilating new infomation'.

    Even in maths & science, you spend most of your time learning to apply and comprehend basic principles you already know. This happens constantly in industry, and in any job you are constantly learning how to better apply concepts and ideas you already know.

    Im not saying they should have no break, but nearly 2 months of holiday in summer alone is ridiculous, if the only justification is 'to recover'. People recover from heart surgery in significantly less.
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    As someone considering going into teaching, I hope that the holidays stay at least fairly long. I do remember summer seeming a little too long as you saw your friends at school anyway (now holidays from university don't. but that's because there's a lot of catching up to do) but I think two weeks at the end of term was gratefully received myself. Particularly at A level, where I used them fairly effectively.
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    I wouldn't worry...he'll have U-turned on this 'scheme' as well by this time next week...
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    I think Michael Gove needs to be replaced. He seems to have no knowledge of how education in this country works, judging by his 'great ideas'.

    We badly need an education minister who has been a teacher in normal state schools, who actually knows what they are talking about.

    Children need a break after a long year at school. they are entitled to play and have a childhood. filling up all their time with constant schooling is not going to be of benefit to them. The cost of holidays would also go up considerably if there was only 3 or 4 weeks in the summer and children would most likely be taken out of school for family holidays.

    I know people say teachers have it easy having these long holidays. but most jobs work 9-5 and when they come home they have nothing to do. teachers spend their nights and weekends planning, writing up assessments and creating resources to use, it is a constant job. so i do think teachers also need that break over the summer as well.

    think the solution would be to stick Michael Gove in with a class of five year olds (find a nice inner city school with lots of behaviour issues) and make him teach (if he can) these longer hours, including all the planning, assessment, etc that goes with it and see how he copes. think he might change his mind then- what an idiot!
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    (Original post by Cattty)
    I think Michael Gove needs to be replaced. He seems to have no knowledge of how education in this country works, judging by his 'great ideas'.

    We badly need an education minister who has been a teacher in normal state schools, who actually knows what they are talking about.

    Children need a break after a long year at school. they are entitled to play and have a childhood. filling up all their time with constant schooling is not going to be of benefit to them. The cost of holidays would also go up considerably if there was only 3 or 4 weeks in the summer and children would most likely be taken out of school for family holidays.

    I know people say teachers have it easy having these long holidays. but most jobs work 9-5 and when they come home they have nothing to do. teachers spend their nights and weekends planning, writing up assessments and creating resources to use, it is a constant job. so i do think teachers also need that break over the summer as well.

    think the solution would be to stick Michael Gove in with a class of five year olds (find a nice inner city school with lots of behaviour issues) and make him teach (if he can) these longer hours, including all the planning, assessment, etc that goes with it and see how he copes. think he might change his mind then- what an idiot!
    I agree. I find it odd how secretary of states for various portfolios have never actually had any form of training or knowledge of the portfolio that they are responsible for. Gove has never been a teacher, so how can he tell teachers how to teach?

    In the days of Gordon Browns Premiership, he installed Alan Johnson as Chancellor. Alan Johnson admitted he had never worked in the financial sector, or even in a bank, and he had to read up about it. Surely each Secretary of State for each department, must have experience of working in the department that they are responsible for?
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    (Original post by c471)
    what utter rubbish. Maybe if you work in a shop, its not, but there are plenty of jobs where it is equally if not more mentally draining. .
    I disagree (politely). Professionals don't spend all day learning - they spend the majority of their time putting their knowledge to good use, which is what they're paid for. There is a learning element, of course, but it's not the same. This is why universities ask for evidence of recent study from mature students.
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    (Original post by SpiggyTopes)
    Michael Gove has said school holidays are too long- and on this occasion I agree with him.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education...hael-Gove.html

    I've always found summer and end-of-term holidays too long. For me at least they're mostly wasted, mostly full of procrastination and also when I was younger (not so much now) I always came back after the summer about six months behind where I was when I left. Of course we need some holidays, and study leave but not as long as we have. I'm not sure whether I'd like longer school hours though... but staring and finishing an hour later would be nice! Extra time in bed!

    What do you think?
    You must really like school, why would you say such a thing, school holidays are great?!
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    School holidays, especially the summer holiday, are far too long.

    Exams are also placed stupidly, often with most at the end of the 'year' in summer (ignoring the fact that having all the exams in large blocks/at the end of the year is detrimental to actual learning).

    Doubt changing the lengths of days would help much, but the way schools timetable lessons is sometimes ****ing dumb. And it'd probably be beneficial getting kids into decent after school activities be it sports (because ****ing fatties are gross and I'd rather not have half of the NHS dedicated to a bunch of people brought up not eating properly and thus resembling quadrupedal slugs) or other extracurricular **** that benefits people like programming games or whatever.
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    (Original post by SocksRock)
    I disagree (politely). Professionals don't spend all day learning - they spend the majority of their time putting their knowledge to good use, which is what they're paid for. There is a learning element, of course, but it's not the same. This is why universities ask for evidence of recent study from mature students.
    My point is that learning in school is no more demanding then a lot of what people do at work. For most subjects what does learning actually entale?
    Take history. You sit and listen to the teacher. You discuss the issues raised, you go away and do some independant research and consolidate the lesson. How is that so different to work that you cant possibly go a year without a 2 month straight break.

    My dad for example, started work as a pharama. researcher for a company. Is that not learning everyday, and to a higher level than school? University lecturers, for example, dont get the massive holidays, and many are developing the front line of their fields. They learn in a big way every day (as in learn stuff that is new knowledge to humanity), and cope just fine. If you do a demanding university course, you may well have no real time off except for a week or two at summer, and cope fine.

    Ask anybody who has worked for several years how hard school was, and almost all will tell you it was a walk in the park compared with work.

    Like has been raised before, its not long ago that children were expected to spend all summer working the land. Our grandparents generation is not disfunctional or stilted because of this, in fact there are a lot of traits that have been lost en masse when comparing them to todays kids.
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    It's hard enough getting all of the planning and marking done as it is, never mind if the school days were longer and the holidays shorter. Heaven forbid teachers should actually eat, sleep and see the friends/families at some point!


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    I already start school at 8 and finish at 5, it's not that bad but no way would I arrive at school at 7 and finish at 6.

    Anyway if he cut holidays especially summer ones, he'd put off lots of graduates from becoming teachers. Other than the pay & the job 10 weeks of holidays is a huge attraction especially considering it would be inline with their children's.
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    Why can't children be children? The school day shouldn't have to reflect the working hours of parents, it's so depressing.

    Childhood should be a time where you can enjoy life without worries, free time to develop interest, hobbies and skills and learn how to be a person by creating friendships and learning social skills. You won't have that amount of free time ever again. Schools shouldn't be accountable for someone's entire childhood. I've seen enough young children doing 8am-6pm using breakfast, after-school alongside full time holiday clubs already. If it was compulsory for all children we would have a generation of exhausted children facing burnout by the time they hit their teens.

    I have read up a lot on the education system in Finland and I feel (as a teacher myself) this is what we should aim for rather than step backwards by learning rote and turning learning into remembering.

    This speech by Sir Ken Robinson accurately describes why we should do the exact opposite of what Gove is suggesting, give it a watch:

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    Really don't like this man.
    First of all, longer school days? For some this wouldn't be a problem, but most people at my school, including me, already wake up at 6:30 to catch a bus in, and get home at about 5pm, absolutely exhausted with s**t loads of work to do for Summer exams which have added pressure now we know we can't do January retakes.
    I love 6 week holidays. 6 weeks of relaxation, resting, fun, socialising, going on holiday. I feel like in the Summer I get it all "out of my system", all the lazing around etc. So when I get back to school, I feel like I've had a good rest and I'm ready to start the year. Kind of like having a long, good nights sleep.
    I don't think it's detrimental in any way, of course everyone is a bit out of practice and it takes a couple of days to get the brain back in gear and adjusted to school again, but I don't see how that's a big deal. Our school encourages us to spend the last week of summer glancing over the stuff we'll be looking at in September, which helps a lot.
    Hoping this plan never goes ahead.




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    (Original post by Rinsed)
    Because we live in a democracy where we elect politicians to make decisions on things like this for us.
    But one could argue that we elected Gove as an MP, not as education secretary?

    Several international studies have shown that excessive government interference in education causes far more problems than it could ever solve. Gove needs to shut his mouth and leave well alone, then standards might improve if, God forbid, teachers were actually allowed to teach.
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    (Original post by biggie)
    But one could argue that we elected Gove as an MP, not as education secretary?

    Several international studies have shown that excessive government interference in education causes far more problems than it could ever solve. Gove needs to shut his mouth and leave well alone, then standards might improve if, God forbid, teachers were actually allowed to teach.
    The standards in any bureaucratic system do not improve if left alone. At best they stay the same and more probably they deteriorate.

    The problem with and for Gove is that essentially this is his agenda and not that of the government. He is a rushing everything because he knows that if he loses this job, education policy is likely to go off on another tack entirely.
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    (Original post by c471)
    Ask anybody who has worked for several years how hard school was, and almost all will tell you it was a walk in the park compared with work. .
    I'm a mature student and have worked for many years. I wouldn't describe either as a walk in the park, but they are difficult in different ways. Maybe some people who are very well suited to learning (your dad and university lecturers being great examples) don't need the break - kudos to them, though I understand such professions often offer sabaaticals to keep their people fresh, don't they? But not everybody is built that way, and driven people can always find ways of keeping themselves busy in the hols if they want to.
 
 
 
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