Birmingham - Second City?? Watch

nulli tertius
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#61
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#61
(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
The new library does look stunning, I saw a programme about it on the Culture Show.

I seriously doubt Birmingham is the only city with stressed child and social services, most of the big urban centres are in a mess with it, due to soaring demand and government cuts.
It was half a joke but there were accusations that the school budget was used to pay for Centenary Square in the late 80s and early 90s.
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Fullofsurprises
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#62
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(Original post by nulli tertius)
It was half a joke but there were accusations that the school budget was used to pay for Centenary Square in the late 80s and early 90s.
I believe it was done with borrowed money, I remember reading that Symphony Hall and the ICC were, anyway.
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MatureStudent36
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#63
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(Original post by Arbolus)
I'm not saying that nothing big ever gets built in Birmingham. Just that there are fewer important landmarks in Birmingham than you'd expect for a city of its size.
NEC, LG arena, large international airport, central hub for the motorway and rail network, NIA, symphony hall, two large theatres ( Alex and Hippodrome) Bull ring, merry hill, sea life centre.

Yeah, not a lot going for it. (Sarcasm)
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MatureStudent36
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#64
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
I believe it was done with borrowed money, I remember reading that Symphony Hall and the ICC were, anyway.
Most things are done on borrowed money.
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Le Nombre
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#65
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
OK. I remember some stuff about law and property being big in Birmingham. Maybe it was the legal side that he was talking about? I don't recall that there's anything much like fund management, brokering, trading, investment management, etc in Birmingham now, I think there used to be, but like many things across the UK, these services have consolidated to one or two places and large cities are tending to specialise.

Interestingly, I looked up financial sector as part of GVA by region on the ONS site just now and it shows Scotland and West Yorkshire as the largest outside London.
Leeds has a bigger legal services sector than Birmingham, in part due to the large amount of financial work that happens there through accident of history.
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nulli tertius
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#66
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(Original post by Le Nombre)
Leeds has a bigger legal services sector than Birmingham, in part due to the large amount of financial work that happens there through accident of history.
In the 19th century, Liverpool was the largest legal market outside London. In the 20th, it was surpassed by Manchester and at the very end of the 20th century Leeds has taken over.
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nulli tertius
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#67
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
I believe it was done with borrowed money, I remember reading that Symphony Hall and the ICC were, anyway.
However there is no doubt that Birmingham finds money for municipal grands projets that few, if any, others are able to do match.
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Le Nombre
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#68
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(Original post by nulli tertius)
In the 19th century, Liverpool was the largest legal market outside London. In the 20th, it was surpassed by Manchester and at the very end of the 20th century Leeds has taken over.
Surprised Manchester was, always felt Brum was next for some reason. Suppose could be a result of TC hunting around the time of Halliwells, obviously didn't make Manc look too profitable!
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Black Rose
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#69
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Second City because of population, I think that's what the person meant, not because it's the 2nd best city or a better city...
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nulli tertius
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(Original post by Le Nombre)
Surprised Manchester was, always felt Brum was next for some reason. Suppose could be a result of TC hunting around the time of Halliwells, obviously didn't make Manc look too profitable!
I think it is historical.

Like the City of London, both Liverpool and Manchester had their own civil courts; the Chancery Court of the County Palatine of Lancaster, Liverpool Court of Passage and Salford Hundred Court all with financially unlimited jurisdiction which remained until 1971.

Birmingham was like any other provincial city. It had its county court with very limited monetary jurisdiction until the 1990s, and its civil assize jurisdiction (as of course did Liverpool and Manchester) twice a year.

The difference was that the southern Lancashire lawyers could keep much more of their own contentious work and not agent it out to London solicitors. Remember that until about 1980 no firm could grow to more than 20 partners; but the Lancashire firms were much more profitable. Add to that, Liverpool's reputation as the PI capital of England dates back to late Victorian times.
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IntelAtom
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#71
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Nobody seems to have mentioned our Selfridges store in Brum, the design is known all over the world. What does Manchester have which people know about


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SaFa1237
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#72
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(Original post by MatureStudent36)
NEC, LG arena, large international airport, central hub for the motorway and rail network, NIA, symphony hall, two large theatres ( Alex and Hippodrome) Bull ring, merry hill, sea life centre.

Yeah, not a lot going for it. (Sarcasm)
Yes! Plus Cadbury's, Edgbaston cricket ground, canal hill park, the german markets, broad street, jewellery quater, mailbox. etc
Also JRR Tolkien lived in Birmingham for a while and got his inspiration for LOTR from near Moseley.
Duran Duran and Georige Osbourne as well as George and Oliver Phelps and Arthur Darvill are some amazing actors and musicians. Oh and the Rep theatre.
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MatureStudent36
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#73
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(Original post by SaFa1237)
Yes! Plus Cadbury's, Edgbaston cricket ground, canal hill park, the german markets, broad street, jewellery quater, mailbox. etc
Also JRR Tolkien lived in Birmingham for a while and got his inspiration for LOTR from near Moseley.
Duran Duran and Georige Osbourne as well as George and Oliver Phelps and Arthur Darvill are some amazing actors and musicians. Oh and the Rep theatre.
This debate does seem to be turning into 'who should be the second city' Birmingham holds that title already and it's unlikely to be taken away.

It's a bit like Canberra and Sydney in Australia. Everybody knows that Sydney is the largest most important city, but Canberra is still the Capital.
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beanstalkgirl_24
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#74
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(Original post by nulli tertius)
But Birmingham still does civic grandeur on the heroic scale



That is where the child protection budget went.
The library was paid for with a loan from central government...
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username917703
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#75
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(Original post by SaFa1237)
Yes! Plus Cadbury's, Edgbaston cricket ground, canal hill park, the german markets, broad street, jewellery quater, mailbox. etc
Also JRR Tolkien lived in Birmingham for a while and got his inspiration for LOTR from near Moseley.
Duran Duran and Georige Osbourne as well as George and Oliver Phelps and Arthur Darvill are some amazing actors and musicians. Oh and the Rep theatre.
http://www.myoldmansaid.com/weekend-...nted-football/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History...all_in_England

The new professionals needed more regular competitive football in which they could compete, which led to the creation of the Football League in 1888 by Aston Villa director William McGregor. This was dominated by those clubs who had supported professionalism, and the twelve founding members consisted of six from Lancashire (Blackburn Rovers, Burnley, Bolton Wanderers, Accrington, Everton and Preston North End) and six from the Midlands (Aston Villa, Derby County, Notts County, Stoke, West Bromwich Albion and Wolverhampton Wanderers). No sides from the South or London initially participated.
Don't forget the world's most historically significant football club.
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thesabbath
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#76
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Third world city, more like:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/439...-in-Birmingham
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news...report-6232489

To think of Birmingham as part of England one has to go decades back.
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Rakas21
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#77
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(Original post by thesabbath)
Third world city, more like:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/439...-in-Birmingham
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news...report-6232489

To think of Birmingham as part of England one has to go decades back.
And why does make them third world? Do you have any evidence that Birmingham got poorer pre-recession.
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hasaandoo1
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#78
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do you know when in ww2 and ww1 what was manchester doing during then the midlands was a power house for the whole uk making spitfire and merlin engines let not forget that lewis machince guns too. It has rich history something that other cities claiming to be the second city.
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username917703
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#79
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(Original post by hasaandoo1)
do you know when in ww2 and ww1 what was manchester doing during then the midlands was a power house for the whole uk making spitfire and merlin engines let not forget that lewis machince guns too. It has rich history something that other cities claiming to be the second city.
Birmingham was building the Spitfires.

Manchester was stitching the pilot's pants.

(Thread is old btw)
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nulli tertius
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#80
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(Original post by hasaandoo1)
do you know when in ww2 and ww1 what was manchester doing during then the midlands was a power house for the whole uk making spitfire and merlin engines let not forget that lewis machince guns too. It has rich history something that other cities claiming to be the second city.
(Original post by Wilfred Little)
Birmingham was building the Spitfires.

Manchester was stitching the pilot's pants.

(Thread is old btw)
I am not quite sure where you have these rather silly notions from.

The Merlin engine was a product of Derby; the Spitfire of Southampton. The Lewis gun, not heavily used during WWII, was an American invention. A lot of surplus industrial capacity in Birmingham was diverted during the war to shadow factories producing additional capacity e.g. Hurricanes at Longbridge, Spitfires at Castle Bromwich, but to suggest they were the product of Birmingham innovation is nonsense.

You may also wish to look at the aviation heritage of A V Roe of Manchester,
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