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    (Original post by miavdbt)
    Stop taking selfies!
    Shouldn't you be telling that to these people who were taking selfies like these people:




    It's a shame that this child will not grow up to take selfies:



    I also replied but did not quote you above.
    Could you be a decent chap and at least address the quote to me given your reluctance to quote me? I don't know why you would choose to respond by not quote me. Seems strange to not to want to engage in a debate in a discussion forum...

    1. Hamas is a terrorist organization. Israel is a state made up of civilians. There is a difference between wanting to destroy Hamas and wanting to destroy a state filled with people of different political leanings.
    Tomorrow's states are today's terrorists...

    2. As for your last sentence, note the irony. It could apply to either side.
    Clearly people are not stupid enough to target trees. I mean, it can't fight back, can it?

    Also, Palestinians have been evacuating further south
    The Gaza Strip is nearly 60 times smaller than Israel (360 km2). How much "further south" can one go? And if they do go "further south", what if Israel decides to carry out operations there? Will they flee "further north"?

    or even to Israel.
    I believe I have asked you twice now for a source for this. Could you give me a source?

    Those with dual citizenship, are leaving altogether.
    But what about the Palestinians with no dual citizenship? Where will they run to?

    Oh, and for you defending your source. The same could apply to my sources with the videos. They did not detract from the point, they just weren't up to your standard of reliability.
    Well done! You've started criticising your own sources. That's the first step to "enlightenment"...

    And I suppose your irrelevant Stanford study about people's looks was somehow relevant of course.
    I did inform you that I had digressed in order to make a point about self perceived pretty people and their politics...

    If they controlled the land, if it was part of the Ottoman Empire, they owned it, too. It was under their control. They could do as they like with it. I have no idea what you want exactly.
    So by the same reasoning, if Israel suddenly happened to be destroyed tomorrow, all the land which Israel currently encompasses will be forfeit and the "new owners" can do whatever they like with that land?

    Interesting how every source which backs up Israel is propaganda and brainwash, yet every source supporting Hamas and terrorists is the Gospel in your world.
    I d not use propagandist sources unless it is actually pertinent. You seem to rely solely on biased and propagandist sources which calls into question, your credibility and supposedly impartial view on the topic at hand.
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    (Original post by Chindits)
    Israel accepts ceasefire, Hamas doesn't

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-28305830

    Hamas have fired 25 rockets since the ceasefire.

    Even the Arab world is so utterly fed up with them

    The situation is ludicrous.

    How can you "accept a ceasefire" if you haven't sat down to negotiate the terms of the ceasefire?

    It's a bit like your Mafia uncle coming in to settle a fight between you and the other neighborhood kid. Your uncle proposes terms and you, finding them favorable accept and then turn around and claim that "the other person hasn't accepted them"....
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    tsr1269

    Your arguments making the case for 'palestinians' is basically moot.

    They have rejected a ceasefire and launched 25+ rockets at Israeli towns and cities since it came into effect with Israel holding fire.

    The whole world is now seeing their true face.
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    The situation is ludicrous.

    [COLOR=#FF0000][B]How can you "accept a ceasefire" if you haven't sat down to negotiate the terms of the ceasefire?

    The Egyptians mediated it.
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    (Original post by Chindits)
    The Egyptians mediated it.
    As I said, your "Mafia Uncle" proposes terms...
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    (Original post by Chindits)
    tsr1269
    Would you mind quoting me?

    Your arguments making the case for 'palestinians' is basically moot.
    Why?

    They have rejected a ceasefire and launched 25+ rockets at Israeli towns and cities since it came into effect with Israel holding fire.
    Please explain to the rest of us exactly how one is able to "reject the terms of ceasefire" if:

    a) HAMAS wanted either Qatar or Turkey to mediate.
    b) HAMAS had no input in the Egyptian mediation?

    It is not a "ceasefire", it is an ultimatum.

    The whole world is now seeing their true face.
    Will you allow your best friend "Dave" who is shagging your soon to be ex-wife to finalize your divorce settlement?
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    (Original post by Chindits)
    They have rejected a ceasefire
    The BBC have now got their act together and are calling it for what it is: A "TRUCE PROPOSAL"...

    and launched 25+ rockets at Israeli towns and cities
    It's now 39. By the time I finish this post, it'll have been 42.

    since it came into effect with Israel holding fire.
    Nothing came into effect because there was nothing to effect. It's simply Israel withholding fire. It means nothing, diddly squat.

    Israel doesn't need to "hold fire". In fact, Israel decided of it's own accord to "hold fire".

    The whole world is now seeing their true face.
    Seems like the world's media is finally waking up to the games played by Israel.
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    (Original post by tsr1269)

    a) HAMAS wanted either Qatar or Turkey to mediate.
    b) HAMAS had no input in the Egyptian mediation?
    ]


    Ah yes

    Qatar who are currently funding ISIS and Hamas.

    Then we have Turkey - whose Islamist leader has called the rocket attacks on Israel a "hoax"

    Yes, I can see why Hamas would want those two to 'mediate'.

    Egypt has traditionally been the one that mediates a ceasefire. They have mediated the previous flare-ups.

    No one is buying what you're selling here.

    You're clinging onto your pro-Hamas stance despite the fact that they have flat out refused a ceasefire. They're hiding in a bunker which is situated under a hospital.

    They are cowards and enablers like you are just as unwelcome in civilised society.
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    (Original post by Chindits)
    Ah yes

    Qatar who are currently funding ISIS and Hamas.
    So you are saying that they will not be impartial?

    Then we have Turkey - whose Islamist leader has called the rocket attacks on Israel a "hoax"
    Evidence?

    Yes, I can see why Hamas would want those two to 'mediate'.
    And one could see why Israel wouldn't, right?

    Egypt has traditionally been the one that mediates a ceasefire. They have mediated the previous flare-ups.
    As I have said, the same guy who is targeting you now offers to be your mediator?

    No one is buying what you're selling here.
    Not now, but they will.

    You're clinging onto your pro-Hamas stance despite the fact that they have flat out refused a ceasefire. They're hiding in a bunker which is situated under a hospital.
    They have refused a "truce proposal", not a ceasefire.

    It's ironic that you have said that "they are hiding in a bunker" because Qatar wanted to send building supplies but Israel was worried HAMAS will use them to build bunkers. So where have these bunkers come from?

    They are cowards and enablers like you are just as unwelcome in civilised society.
    I'll let Noam Chomsky speak again:

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    BREKAING: Israel have broken the "ceasefire agreement" and have started attacking Gaza again...
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    BREKAING: Israel have broken the "ceasefire agreement" and have started attacking Gaza again...

    Why would they hold to a ceasefire that only they were observing?

    The 'palestinians' rejected the ceasefire and fired 30 rockets into Israel.

    No sympathy now. Go and get them Israel
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    (Original post by Chindits)
    Why would they hold to a ceasefire that only they were observing?
    Which proves my point that it wasn't a "ceasefire" as you tried desperately, oh so desperately to claim?! Hello?!

    The 'palestinians' rejected the ceasefire and fired 30 rockets into Israel.
    How can they "reject a ceasefire" if there was no ceasefire? You can't reject something which doesn't exist...

    No sympathy now. Go and get them Israel
    Was there even "sympathy" in the first little skirmish? I dread to think of what horrible actions Israel would resort to in order to commit genocide against the Palestinian people.
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    Shouldn't you be telling that to these people who were taking selfies like these people:




    It's a shame that this child will not grow up to take selfies:





    Could you be a decent chap and at least address the quote to me given your reluctance to quote me? I don't know why you would choose to respond by not quote me. Seems strange to not to want to engage in a debate in a discussion forum...



    Tomorrow's states are today's terrorists...



    Clearly people are not stupid enough to target trees. I mean, it can't fight back, can it?



    The Gaza Strip is nearly 60 times smaller than Israel (360 km2). How much "further south" can one go? And if they do go "further south", what if Israel decides to carry out operations there? Will they flee "further north"?



    I believe I have asked you twice now for a source for this. Could you give me a source?



    But what about the Palestinians with no dual citizenship? Where will they run to?

    UN shelters. Sources below.

    Well done! You've started criticising your own sources. That's the first step to "enlightenment"...

    You, on the other hand, have not.



    I did inform you that I had digressed in order to make a point about self perceived pretty people and their politics...

    Still pointless.


    So by the same reasoning, if Israel suddenly happened to be destroyed tomorrow, all the land which Israel currently encompasses will be forfeit and the "new owners" can do whatever they like with that land?



    I d not use propagandist sources unless it is actually pertinent. You seem to rely solely on biased and propagandist sources which calls into question, your credibility and supposedly impartial view on the topic at hand.

    ​REALLY? What about the photo attached here? Also, among others, I have included sources from the BBC, CNN and New York Times. I suppose they are solely biased and propagandist sources, because they might have included the Israeli point of view, instead of completely ignored it like your Al Jazeera sources. Whereas you using Al Jazeera and fake photos of dead kids, and making claims that Israel is now targeting children from Gaza is very impartial and completely unbiased.


    Here is an article stating that a UN report confined that the IDF notified Gazan civilians prior to bombings:

    http://www.worldtribune.com/2014/07/...cuate-attacks/


    Here is an article outlining where the Gazans are looking for shelter, including UN shelters and evacuating to countries such as Australia, Britain and the US if they have passports there. The evacuation procedure was aided by the IDF . This article also includes a statement by the UN Secretary General who condemns Hamas's targeting of civilians. It also explains that the Gaza rockets hit infrastructure in Israel which actually provided Electricity in Gaza. Way to shoot yourself in the foot.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/0...za-evacuation-
    raid_n_5581540.html

    ​At this stage, I can't find the article that stated that some Gaza civilians had evacuated to Israel. I admit that it must have been my mistake, and I must have misread something when I was looking for sources. If I do find it, I will provide a source, but for now, I admit I've made an error and this did not happen.





    '
    So by the same reasoning, if Israel suddenly happened to be destroyed tomorrow, all the land which Israel currently encompasses will be forfeit and the "new owners" can do whatever they like with that land?'



    No. That's not what happened. There was the British mandate after the Ottoman Empire. There was never a Palestinian government recognized by the International Community until 1964, when the PLO became the official representative of the Palestinians. There were some governing bodies which were not recognized, however. A Palestinian government, Palestinian control over the land did not happen officially until 1964. There were some attempts in the late 30s by some 'Arab authorities', but it came to nothing until the PLO. Israel is a SOVEREIGN state. Palestine was not under the Ottoman Empire and was not under the British Mandate. You need to learn about the difference between a sovereign state and an entity and the rights that come with each.

    After the Mandate ended, the UN came up with a partition plan allowing both Jews and Arabs to have their own respective independent states. The Jews accepted it, the Arabs did not. What's so hard to understand? There were both Arabs and Jews on the land to begin with, under the British mandate, many more Jews immigrated (though there were quotas placed by the British). The UN decided to partition the land so both groups would have their states. Some were happy, some weren't. Those who weren't started a war and lost it.

    Israel became an independent state as it accepted the offer, Palestine did not as it rejected it and fought and subsequently lost.




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    An IDF soldier speaks.
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    To be fair, even Al Jazeera has admitted that the 'palestinains' broke the ceasefire.


    By the way, the 'palestinians; managed to badly injure two Arab girls in Israel from rocket fire.

    Well done.
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    An IDF soldier speaks.
    You're really laying it on today. First with photos of dead kids, now with military stories. Please don't accuse the rest of us of using propaganda, when you yourself are falling for Palestinian propaganda.
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    Some of those who went out to demonstrate for 'palestinains' must feel like absolute idiots now that they have thrown it back in their faces by rejecting the ceasefire.

    I know that hard line leftists will never change their views, but some neutrals or supporters who aren't ideologically driven - will see the 'palestinians' refusal of the ceasefire as a slap in the face.

    Israel is not only winning militarily, but also in terms of public approval now.
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    (Original post by miavdbt)
    You're really laying it on today. First with photos of dead kids, now with military stories. Please don't accuse the rest of us of using propaganda, when you yourself are falling for Palestinian propaganda.
    IDF Soldier: I was simply putting out a viewpoint from the ground. I made no assertions nor did I even attempt to make any. I did so in order for people to make up their own minds.

    Dead Child: I was searching google images for the image of a child which I had seen killed in the attack but I couldn't find a picture of a child from the most recent conflict. The only image that seemed appropriate was what you consider to be a "propaganda" image.

    I was simply trying to find a picture of a child who was dead and therefore cannot take a selfie which is in relation to a point I had made earlier.

    I don't think anyone one of those what you claim to be propaganda material can ever be called such.


    On the other hand, you have made assertions based on the sources which you have read and you come here and plug that propagandist crap that the Israeli PR is "renowned" for...
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    IDF Soldier: I was simply putting out a viewpoint from the ground. I made no assertions nor did I even attempt to make any. I did so in order for people to make up their own minds.

    Dead Child: I was searching google images for the image of a child which I had seen killed in the attack but I couldn't find a picture of a child from the most recent conflict. The only image that seemed appropriate was what you consider to be a "propaganda" image.

    I was simply trying to find a picture of a child who was dead and therefore cannot take a selfie which is in relation to a point I had made earlier.

    I don't think anyone one of those what you claim to be propaganda material can ever be called such.


    On the other hand, you have made assertions based on the sources which you have read and you come here and plug that propagandist crap that the Israeli PR is "renowned" for...

    You mean the propagandist crap on the BBC, CNN and NYT?

    Gosh, I'm sorry. I didn't know they ALL work for the IDF. I will make sure to only source Al Aqsa TV and Al Jazeera from now on so you can approve my sources.

    As for what you THINK can be called propaganda and what IS, those appear to be two very different things.

    EDIT: It's not simply a dead child, it's a dead child with a claim that Israel is now targeting children in Gaza. You can't say it's not political. Even you can't be in that much denial over simple facts.

    This is cheap propaganda trying to appeal to the masses, who will be quick to point fingers to appease the emotions the picture will create. If you can't see how this is propaganda, then you're really delusional.
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    tsr1269 is relentless

    The fact remains Israel accepted a ceasefire and halted all operations.

    'palestinians' rejected a ceasefire and fired 30 rockets. The whole world knows this, every media is reporting it.
 
 
 
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