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    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    You'll learn when you're a bit older.
    Great way to win people over to your side. Patronise them. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by clh_hilary)
    Neither islam nor the Arabic language is a race.
    Yeah, but both are racialised to an extent, aren't they? Like, the country that's got the most Muslims in it is Indonesia, yet most anti-Islam crap is usually thrown at Arab-looking people.
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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    Unfortunately there are irrefutable differences between the races; however, I have not come to any firm conclusions as to which race is broadly 'superior' (and it would be more likely to be the sino race than my own, if I had, tbh) and to make people feel bad/inferior for something they can do nothing about is unethical. Ergo, I am an intellectually honest, if relatively ethical, racialist,* but not quite a racist, and certainly not a bigot
    Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't 'race' a concept massively pedalled by Nazi scientists in order to justify their own hardcore racial discrimination? i.e. there's no such thing as 'race', people just have different skin colours as they would different hair colours?

    Also, this kind of tendency towards biological determinism worries me. What kind of person would sit there and try and evaluate which race is 'superior'? Like, why would you even want to do that, honestly?
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    (Original post by DouglasAdams)
    I am not a racist, but the news is filled with those who are.
    So are you? Be honest.


    Or do you know any racists or have you yourself been the subject of racial discrimination?
    I'm not racist. I hate everyone equally
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    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    Everyone's a little bit racist. If you deny it you're a liar and probably a full blown racist.
    I think you're turning this into a self-fulfilling prophecy kind of thing. Or just hanging out with weird, weird people.
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    (Original post by молодой гений)
    I think you're turning this into a self-fulfilling prophecy kind of thing. Or just hanging out with weird, weird people.
    Or both?
    (Original post by Asexual Demigod)
    Great way to win people over to your side. Patronise them. :rolleyes:
    Who said I was doing it to win people over? *headpat*
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    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    Or both?
    Or both, I don't care. I'm just saying that those kinds of statements are gross.

    "But everyone really does think that all Arabs are terrorists!" smh
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    (Original post by молодой гений)
    Yeah, but both are racialised to an extent, aren't they? Like, the country that's got the most Muslims in it is Indonesia, yet most anti-Islam crap is usually thrown at Arab-looking people.
    This is absurd.

    Surely people have the islam stereotype to be an Arab-looking man because that's why they see on TV or around their neighbourhood? How many Indonesians are there in the UK or the US? Do you have evidence to suggest that people only attack Arabic muslims and Arabic non-muslims but not Indonesian muslims?

    Attacking or making fun of a religion is very different from doing it to a race. You cannot leave your race, but you can leave your religion; religion is a set of ideas, but race is mere biological facts.

    To even attempt to claim attacking islam equals to attacking Arab people is silly.
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    (Original post by DouglasAdams)
    I am not a racist, but the news is filled with those who are.
    So are you? Be honest.


    Or do you know any racists or have you yourself been the subject of racial discrimination?
    Im not really racist, Im just colour blind.
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    (Original post by clh_hilary)
    This is absurd.

    Surely people have the islam stereotype to be an Arab-looking man because that's why they see on TV or around their neighbourhood? How many Indonesians are there in the UK or the US? Do you have evidence to suggest that people only attack Arabic muslims and Arabic non-muslims but not Indonesian muslims?

    Attacking or making fun of a religion is very different from doing it to a race. You cannot leave your race, but you can leave your religion; religion is a set of ideas, but race is mere biological facts.

    To even attempt to claim attacking islam equals to attacking Arab people is silly.
    This might just be the people I know, but whenever I see anti-Muslim spiel thrown about, it's always followed by something about 'the pakis' or 'we should just bomb all of the Middle East'.
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    (Original post by молодой гений)
    This might just be the people I know, but whenever I see anti-Muslim spiel thrown about, it's always followed by something about 'the pakis' or 'we should just bomb all of the Middle East'.
    That's just the people you know. It's not even like that on TSR.

    If you think a certain attack on muslims is actually a racial attack packaged as the former, you should point out why and how; not to come up with reasons trying to suggest that either islam is a race or that an attack on islam is automatically an attack on a race.

    There's also a difference between attacking muslims in a certain geographical location. Indonesians haven't been attacking the west so I don't see why anyone would even think of them. Many people in the west probably don't even know it exists.
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    (Original post by clh_hilary)
    That's just the people you know. It's not even like that on TSR.

    If you think a certain attack on muslims is actually a racial attack packaged as the former, you should point out why and how; not to come up with reasons trying to suggest that either islam is a race or that an attack on islam is automatically an attack on a race.

    There's also a difference between attacking muslims in a certain geographical location. Indonesians haven't been attacking the west so I don't see why anyone would even think of them. Many people in the west probably don't even know it exists.
    I'm well aware that Islam is not a race, thanks; my point is that the most common place to see the 'Islam isn't a race, so it's not racist to say that we should kill all Muslim paki scum" is, well, on Britain First's Facebook page. So I tend to have a snap reaction to whenever I see that.

    Sikhism, for instance, gets nowhere near the same amount of ****.
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    (Original post by молодой гений)
    I'm well aware that Islam is not a race, thanks; my point is that the most common place to see the 'Islam isn't a race, so it's not racist to say that we should kill all Muslim paki scum" is, well, on Britain First's Facebook page. So I tend to have a snap reaction to whenever I see that.

    Sikhism, for instance, gets nowhere near the same amount of ****.
    So let put us back into the original context, where the poster I responded to said 'god is great' in Arabic every time he tossed something into the bin.

    In what way is that racist?

    In your context, it's quite obvious why there was a problem. Islam is not a race, and 'paki' is an ethnicity. So logically both 'paki' and 'islam' need to be not a race or an ethnicity for that comment to not be racist. The use of 'muslim' as the adjective instead of the noun also suggests that the focus is on the ethnicity, not the religion.

    However, even with that, we cannot then conclude it was racist. We need more information. What is the reason behind that comment? Are they specifying people who actually are muslims, but not all of Pakistan people? This is significant because it is possible for muslims in a geographical region to have a particular belief or idea (but I don't know if there is any).

    The biggest problem with that comment, however, is not with the religion or the ethnicity, but the fact that they are calling for anyone to be killed.
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    Everyone has prejudice to some extent, it's just a case of whether you realise what your prejudice is and choose to overcome it. Prejudice is natural.
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    (Original post by xleoanimusx)
    Prejudice is natural.
    I highly doubt this. People are not born with social prejudices pre-installed in them. People are born as a blank canvas, and then they are raised. If they are raised in a society in which it is 'natural' to be racist, then by all means...
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    This thread is making me hate people.
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    (Original post by молодой гений)
    I highly doubt this. People are not born with social prejudices pre-installed in them. People are born as a blank canvas, and then they are raised. If they are raised in a society in which it is 'natural' to be racist, then by all means...
    I'm not sure. Though I admit, I can't swear by it as I don't know the science, my opinion is that it's a natural instinct to prefer to be with your own kind. As you grow up you realise that mixing with others is completely natural. Just my two cents though.
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    (Original post by молодой гений)
    Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't 'race' a concept massively pedalled by Nazi scientists in order to justify their own hardcore racial discrimination? i.e. there's no such thing as 'race', people just have different skin colours as they would different hair colours?
    No, that sort of "race is just a social construct" nonsense is commonly believed in the social 'sciences' but it has no scientific accuracy. The modern genetics literature tends to suggest that race has biological existence, can be identified at the genome level, and predicts geographical ancestry very well. It affects a lot more than just skin colour (obvious example)

    See:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1196372/
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18559547
    http://genetics.plosjournals.org/per...l.pgen.0030236

    We have analyzed genetic data for 326 microsatellite markers that were typed uniformly in a large multiethnic population-based sample of individuals as part of a study of the genetics of hypertension (Family Blood Pressure Program). Subjects identified themselves as belonging to one of four major racial/ethnic groups (white, African American, East Asian, and Hispanic) and were recruited from 15 different geographic locales within the United States and Taiwan. Genetic cluster analysis of the microsatellite markers produced four major clusters, which showed near-perfect correspondence with the four self-reported race/ethnicity categories. Of 3,636 subjects of varying race/ethnicity, only 5 (0.14%) showed genetic cluster membership different from their self-identified race/ethnicity. On the other hand, we detected only modest genetic differentiation between different current geographic locales within each race/ethnicity group. Thus, ancient geographic ancestry, which is highly correlated with self-identified race/ethnicity—as opposed to current residence—is the major determinant of genetic structure in the U.S. population. Implications of this genetic structure for case-control association studies are discussed.
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    No I certainly am not.
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    (Original post by молодой гений)
    Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't 'race' a concept massively pedalled by Nazi scientists in order to justify their own hardcore racial discrimination? i.e. there's no such thing as 'race', people just have different skin colours as they would different hair colours?
    Duly corrected, as requested

    Like, why would you even want to do that, honestly?
    Divisive/bigoted/racist agenda, would seem most the likely possible explanations (take your pick)
 
 
 
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