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How can the online dating experience be improved for men? watch

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    (Original post by TorpidPhil)
    Without discussing your sexuality specifically. Why is it that so many females on dating site claim to be bisexual? No way whatsoever is the dating site population for females so queer that ~50% are bisexual. It's absurd. Do women think this is a turn on for guys or something?
    Well I can't say I've noticed that tbh I haven't come across many bi women who live near me on okc.
    Hmm that would be a pretty sad reason, I've found it has put guys off, "so I would have to worry about other women and men".
    But I'm not going to say I'm not attracted to some girls when I am .
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    What exactly do you find difficult about going out and talking to people?

    I'm genuinely curious. Its not something I've ever heard anyone describe as difficult in real life.
    I'm not saying that talking to people is difficult per se. If however you want to go and meet others who are single and interested then things become more difficult.

    The difficulties that arise:
    1) What is the location of this "out" that you're referring to? Is there some magical mingling spot somewhere for single people? Where do I go to?
    Restaurants- can't everyone is sitting at their own table.
    Concerts, theater- I suppose you could talk to someone during the breaks or something but usually people go to these things with their friends or dates
    Clubs- can't really talk since you can't hear anything. Though if you just want a one night stand, it could be your best shot.
    Pubs/bars- theoretically could work but again people often come with friends and are not there necessarily to meet someone.

    Female friends have told me how they find it annoying sometimes (though not necessarily always) when guys come up to talk to them when they're out somewhere. Sometimes they just want to be with their friends.

    2) Now assuming you have somehow overcome all those obstacles, that still doesn't quite solve the issue. Firstly, not every guy is so suave as to pull off getting a date (or shag) with someone they just met. Secondly, how do you even know that the person you're chatting up is available? Most people are polite and won't automatically shoot you down but you could spend a fair bit of time chatting someone up who you had snowball's chance in hell with anyway. Thirdly, what if the particular location you've chosen to go to doesn't have anyone in it that you find attractive (or attractive and isn't there with someone who's clearly their partner).

    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    Really? How many people have evening jobs?

    Online dating is incredibly inefficient. Look at how many people say its a numbers game and that you have to spend hours contacting hundreds of people only to get one date every few weeks. What a waste of time.

    Whereas if you go out for a few hours, you can easily go home with someone that very night. Its a far more efficient and effective way of finding a relationship.
    What about all the people who work in service industries who have to work shifts on weekends/the evenings?

    Of course not everyone is like that. Take me: I'm your typical white collar office junkie.
    1) Firstly my hours can be long sometimes, I don't always finish at 5.30. I can work much longer than that.
    2) I do like to do things outside of 'going out'. For example I'm very dedicated to my training schedule and that will take up a fair few evenings. What if I want to read, watch a movie, need to do chores around the house, got a company event?
    3) Sometimes you're just dead tired from a long day at work and don't really have the energy.
    4) Going 'out' costs money. Drinks, food, tickets- they all cost money and after a while that adds up to a lot. And there's the annoying commute (depending on where one lives).

    For these reasons just "going out" is not something that works so easily in the real world. And "easily go home with someone"- well there you've reached a James Bond level of womanizing skills that perhaps a mere fraction of the male population can ever hope to attain. Most people just don't have that ability.

    I fundamentally disagree with your statement that online dating is inefficient. If anything, I'd say it's far more efficient than....well whatever the alternative is.
    1) In online dating all the clutter is taken away. Everyone on there is looking to meet someone. You don't need to guess who is with their bf and whether they've got an engagement ring, it's all people who are interested.
    2) You can easily browse through hundreds of profiles, picking out the ones you're most attracted to. You don't need to pray that the bar you've chosen to visit that night has attractive girls present.
    3) Cheap and easy: no need to buy drinks or meals (as you'll do that anyway once you go on your date), no need to go anywhere. For the socially shy, much easier to make an approach.

    And although it is true that I may have to go through many profiles before I get a match or a response (though the results of that may vary depending on how attractive one's profile is), it really isn't that bad. Generally I do ultimately get responses and from there securing a face to face meet up is quite easy. And once you've met for the first time, everything can progress as normal.
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    (Original post by keturah)
    What superficial behaviour?
    Having a list of requirements that a guy has to meet to be worthy a response to an initaited convo.
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    (Original post by chosenone93)
    Having a list of requirements that a guy has to meet to be worthy a response to an initaited convo.
    However equivalently you as the guy would also only ever message girls that met your criteria. So it works both ways: girls don't get messages from guys not attracted to them just as guys don't get replies back from girls not attracted to them.
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    (Original post by chosenone93)
    Having a list of requirements that a guy has to meet to be worthy a response to an initaited convo.
    Depending on what the requirements are, it's hardly superficial.

    For example if one of the requirements is that you're looking for a committed relationship and he is looking for casual. That's a good reason to pass on talking to him. Or if one of the requirements if not wanting children, but he wants children. Another good reason to pass up on talking to that guy. Or if you're looking for someone close to where you currently live (for whatever reason), but the guy who messages you lives on the other side of the country, Again a pretty good reason to not respond. The only superficial things would be rejecting someone because they don't have blond hair or earn above 50k. But you'd be naive to think some people don't reject people in real life for these reasons too. Superficial people exist in both online and offline dating pools.

    That's one of the few things I actually like about online dating, you can state very clearly what you are looking for. Only downside is a lot of users ignore them.
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    (Original post by snakesnake)
    I'm not saying that talking to people is difficult per se. If however you want to go and meet others who are single and interested then things become more difficult.

    The difficulties that arise:
    1) What is the location of this "out" that you're referring to? Is there some magical mingling spot somewhere for single people? Where do I go to?
    Restaurants- can't everyone is sitting at their own table.
    Concerts, theater- I suppose you could talk to someone during the breaks or something but usually people go to these things with their friends or dates
    Clubs- can't really talk since you can't hear anything. Though if you just want a one night stand, it could be your best shot.
    Pubs/bars- theoretically could work but again people often come with friends and are not there necessarily to meet someone.


    yes, pubs and bars. Pubs and bars exist specifically for young, often single, people to meet each other. Its almost impossible to spend a few hours in a pub or bar and not get talking to people.


    Female friends have told me how they find it annoying sometimes (though not necessarily always) when guys come up to talk to them when they're out somewhere. Sometimes they just want to be with their friends.

    Its very easy to tell whether someone wants to chat or not. So chat to the people who want to chat, and not to the people who don't


    2) Now assuming you have somehow overcome all those obstacles, that still doesn't quite solve the issue. Firstly, not every guy is so suave as to pull off getting a date (or shag) with someone they just met.

    I disagree. With a little practice, its very easy to become "suave" as you call it. Socially competent would be how I would describe it. I don't know anyone in real life who can't chat to a stranger and come across as a nice, interesting attractive person.

    Secondly, how do you even know that the person you're chatting up is available? Most people are polite and won't automatically shoot you down but you could spend a fair bit of time chatting someone up who you had snowball's chance in hell with anyway.

    This is a bit of a noob question. Its very easy to tell if someone is interested in you, and if they're not... so what? You're just having fun chatting to them. People are nice, they're good to talk to. I have a gf, but I still enjoy chatting with strangers in pubs and having a bit of a joke etc. Its just a good thing to do.


    Thirdly, what if the particular location you've chosen to go to doesn't have anyone in it that you find attractive (or attractive and isn't there with someone who's clearly their partner).

    Don't worry about it. Just enjoy yourself with the company that is there. Maybe they have a hot friend they will introduce you to later. If you're really that desparate, go to a different pub. There are like 100 pubs in every city, some must have attractive single girls in them.




    What about all the people who work in service industries who have to work shifts on weekends/the evenings?

    Of course not everyone is like that. Take me: I'm your typical white collar office junkie.
    1) Firstly my hours can be long sometimes, I don't always finish at 5.30. I can work much longer than that.

    So do I, fortunately pubs are open until late.


    2) I do like to do things outside of 'going out'. For example I'm very dedicated to my training schedule and that will take up a fair few evenings. What if I want to read, watch a movie, need to do chores around the house, got a company event?

    Do that first, and then go out. For example, I play squash twice a week, and then go to the pub afterwards.


    3) Sometimes you're just dead tired from a long day at work and don't really have the energy.

    Well, drink a cup off coffee. Unless you're a lumberjack, then your work is really not that tiring.

    4) Going 'out' costs money. Drinks, food, tickets- they all cost money and after a while that adds up to a lot. And there's the annoying commute (depending on where one lives).

    Three pints is about a tenner. Its really not that expensive, especially if you work full time.


    For these reasons just "going out" is not something that works so easily in the real world. And "easily go home with someone"- well there you've reached a James Bond level of womanizing skills that perhaps a mere fraction of the male population can ever hope to attain. Most people just don't have that ability.

    Not true - the vast majority of 18 year olds can not pull on your average night out, but the vast majority of 25 year olds can - its just a skill you pick up with practice.


    I fundamentally disagree with your statement that online dating is inefficient. If anything, I'd say it's far more efficient than....well whatever the alternative is.
    1) In online dating all the clutter is taken away. Everyone on there is looking to meet someone. You don't need to guess who is with their bf and whether they've got an engagement ring, it's all people who are interested.

    Except...you have absolutely no idea whether the profiles are real, and they have absolutely no idea whether you're a serial killer or a weirdo or anything. Whereas in a pub, you can tell this instantly.

    2) You can easily browse through hundreds of profiles, picking out the ones you're most attracted to. You don't need to pray that the bar you've chosen to visit that night has attractive girls present.

    Its impossible to tell who you are actually attracted to before meeting them. Hence most blind dates are a complete bust. In a pub, you can chat to a group of10 single girls and instantly see which one you have chemistry with, but online, you might not have picked her.

    3) Cheap and easy: no need to buy drinks or meals (as you'll do that anyway once you go on your date), no need to go anywhere. For the socially shy, much easier to make an approach.

    If you meet them, you're going to have to, so it works out the same in the end.

    And although it is true that I may have to go through many profiles before I get a match or a response (though the results of that may vary depending on how attractive one's profile is), it really isn't that bad. Generally I do ultimately get responses and from there securing a face to face meet up is quite easy. And once you've met for the first time, everything can progress as normal.

    It all sounds like a hell of a lot of work compared to just having some fun with your mates.
    Wow long post. See replies in text.
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    Wow long post. See replies in text.
    Seems like you are a very unique person that can easily pick up girls in and socialize without difficulty in any scenario or location. That is an amazing skill to have but most people just aren't like that. Hence why online dating kicks in to help.

    That's why you think just going out is the easiest way to find a girl while as for others online dating is far easier. Different strokes for different folks.
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    (Original post by snakesnake)
    Seems like you are a very unique person that can easily pick up girls in and socialize without difficulty in any scenario or location. That is an amazing skill to have but most people just aren't like that. Hence why online dating kicks in to help.

    That's why you think just going out is the easiest way to find a girl while as for others online dating is far easier. Different strokes for different folks.
    No no no no no.

    This is the point. I'm not unique. I'm not even better than average. Everyone can pick up girls and socialise without difficulty in any scenario provided they actually try.

    Unfortunately in the past 5 years, guys seem to have given up trying, and they're all miserable and lonely instead. For ****s sake you pathetic bunch, snap out of it. Go out and socialise, its incredibly easy and incredibly rewarding.
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    (Original post by keturah)
    I'm on ok cupid too. That sucks that they don't engage in conversation. When I've started conversation first they never reply though so I have stopped doing it.
    Girls get more messages but I get guys not replying mid conversation so maybe it's not just a gender specific thing.
    I have a feeling the fact you're not getting replies might have something to do with you having a higher standard of guy in mind. You're aiming for that guy, but that guy has his own standard, so is ignoring you, much like you're ignoring the guys messaging you, who may actually be at your standard; a vicious pecking order, of sorts. Is that true, do you tend to aim for the better-looking guys? It's the only logical explanation I can think of for why a guy on one of those sites wouldn't reply to conversation, aside from the girl being a bad conversationalist.
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    No no no no no.

    This is the point. I'm not unique. I'm not even better than average. Everyone can pick up girls and socialise without difficulty in any scenario provided they actually try.

    Unfortunately in the past 5 years, guys seem to have given up trying, and they're all miserable and lonely instead. For ****s sake you pathetic bunch, snap out of it. Go out and socialise, its incredibly easy and incredibly rewarding.
    I'll admit that I fall into the very category you describe: I don't go out to socialize, have never approached a girl "in real life" and I am quite lonely.

    Which is exactly why online dating works perfectly for me. And once I'm going out with a girl, I'm already socializing 'as normal' as I'll be taking her to a bar/restaurant/show/whatever.

    For the reasons I listed above, I have found online dating to be the perfect solution for me. And if it has the same end result as you going out and chatting up girls in a bar, then why would I change a winning formula?
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    (Original post by SophieSmall)
    Nope, women are everywhere online. But for some reason (a study was done on this) if there is no identifying gender, most people will automatically assume the person behind the screen is male.

    Weird.
    Having used anonymous chat sites like Omegle, it's usually really easy to tell whether someone you're messaging is a guy or girl in my experience.
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    (Original post by snakesnake)
    I'll admit that I fall into the very category you describe: I don't go out to socialize, have never approached a girl "in real life" and I am quite lonely.

    Which is exactly why online dating works perfectly for me. And once I'm going out with a girl, I'm already socializing 'as normal' as I'll be taking her to a bar/restaurant/show/whatever.

    For the reasons I listed above, I have found online dating to be the perfect solution for me. And if it has the same end result as you going out and chatting up girls in a bar, then why would I change a winning formula?
    but you admit that you're lonely, so its clearly not a winning formula at all, is it...
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    but you admit that you're lonely, so its clearly not a winning formula at all, is it...
    Well I'm only talking about it from the perspective of finding a girl to go out with. My social life may be otherwise poor but I don't have an issue with dating.
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    (Original post by snakesnake)
    For these reasons just "going out" is not something that works so easily in the real world. And "easily go home with someone"- well there you've reached a James Bond level of womanizing skills that perhaps a mere fraction of the male population can ever hope to attain. Most people just don't have that ability.

    I fundamentally disagree with your statement that online dating is inefficient. If anything, I'd say it's far more efficient than....well whatever the alternative is.
    1) In online dating all the clutter is taken away. Everyone on there is looking to meet someone. You don't need to guess who is with their bf and whether they've got an engagement ring, it's all people who are interested.
    2) You can easily browse through hundreds of profiles, picking out the ones you're most attracted to. You don't need to pray that the bar you've chosen to visit that night has attractive girls present.
    3) Cheap and easy: no need to buy drinks or meals (as you'll do that anyway once you go on your date), no need to go anywhere. For the socially shy, much easier to make an approach.

    And although it is true that I may have to go through many profiles before I get a match or a response (though the results of that may vary depending on how attractive one's profile is), it really isn't that bad. Generally I do ultimately get responses and from there securing a face to face meet up is quite easy. And once you've met for the first time, everything can progress as normal.
    I hear what you're saying, but online dating totally ignores the reality of human relations. If you meet a girl in real life you can more easily develop a rapport, it's hard for her to leave and there is usually some kind of environmental cue or shared interest to spark conversation. You get far more of a chance to impress her and she will remember you far easier than if you're just an avatar.

    Plus even if the girl turns out to have a boyfriend you have clearly got on well. Let's say you exchange Facebook and message each other on occasion over the next few months, just casually. Eventually she will break up with her boyfriend and you are then in a position where you are ahead of 90% of other suitors. Also meeting new people can lead to your being inducted into another friendship group which has eligible people in it.

    It's probably unfair to compare with cold approaches in any case. I'd wager most dating happens in extended social circles which means there is a barrier to entry so less competition.

    Based on that, I think a fun thing might be an app that integrates with Facebook and matches you at random with someone connected with you via mutual friendship or common membership of a group, helping people to make new connections, be they friendships or dates. Dating apps which are explicitly for dating are always going to be counter-productive for the same reason cold approaches at clubs are: women know men are looking for sex with strangers so are immediately on their guard.
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    (Original post by snakesnake)
    Well I'm only talking about it from the perspective of finding a girl to go out with. My social life may be otherwise poor but I don't have an issue with dating.
    Just so I can get an idea, what % of your adult life (ie 18+) have you been in a relationship (whether long term or short term).
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    (Original post by Hashim123)
    I have a feeling the fact you're not getting replies might have something to do with you having a higher standard of guy in mind. You're aiming for that guy, but that guy has his own standard, so is ignoring you, much like you're ignoring the guys messaging you, who may actually be at your standard; a vicious pecking order, of sorts. Is that true, do you tend to aim for the better-looking guys? It's the only logical explanation I can think of for why a guy on one of those sites wouldn't reply to conversation, aside from the girl being a bad conversationalist.
    Not at all 😂
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    Just so I can get an idea, what % of your adult life (ie 18+) have you been in a relationship (whether long term or short term).
    Not much. I was very much a typical foreveralone type guy (and still am largely) until I discovered online dating. And there are definitely many others like me out there for whom online dating has been a saving grace.
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    (Original post by snakesnake)
    Not much. I was very much a typical foreveralone type guy (and still am largely) until I discovered online dating. And there are definitely many others like me out there for whom online dating has been a saving grace.
    Do you not think that perhaps you would be better off trying to actually get yourself a real social life? using online dating as a crutch is actually doing you no favours at all; its just disguising your problem and putting you off actually doing something about it and improving your life.
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    Do you not think that perhaps you would be better off trying to actually get yourself a real social life? using online dating as a crutch is actually doing you no favours at all; its just disguising your problem and putting you off actually doing something about it and improving your life.
    I would agree to an extent. I have been trying to become more social, going to more work socials for example and doing things together with friends (which I almost never did before).

    But online dating is not a crutch. You seem to describe it as almost an evil. It is not that at all, it helps me get to the same end result but via another mechanism.
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    Men could work to become more desirable so that the women of the dating sites actually want to talk to the men?
 
 
 
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