Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
x Turn on thread page Beta
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by JessThomas6)
    but non-EU immigrants need to have visas and be accepted!
    Yep - and we issue the visas. So why is it that we seem unable to stop 200,000 people coming in when the government set a target of 100,000? And following that small detail, what makes the Euro-sceptics think EU migration will be any different if we leave the EU?
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ByEeek)
    Yep - and we issue the visas. So why is it that we seem unable to stop 200,000 people coming in when the government set a target of 100,000? And following that small detail, what makes the Euro-sceptics think EU migration will be any different if we leave the EU?
    because they can't just walk in (almost literally!) they'll have to go through a process which is likely to be slow, and possibly deter them
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by JessThomas6)
    because they can't just walk in (almost literally!) they'll have to go through a process which is likely to be slow, and possibly deter them
    Would that be like the system that allowed 200,000 non-EU migrants in last year? And still you focus on EU migrants should we leave the EU.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ByEeek)
    But is that not worthy of a sneer? I am yet to hear anyone on here say anything about the fact that we let in 200,000 non-EU migrants last year. That is 200,000 migrants we could have legally stopped had we wanted to.

    Yet the debate always seems to be about all the EU migrants we can't do anything about.
    But the sneer is at UKIP and by association the "LEAVE"/"OUT" campaign. The BBC are trying to tar what is a campaign about sovereignty with the slur of racism. Most of the people that I know who are against the EU (largely educated people) are not racist and not UKIP.

    So please sign the petition.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by newpersonage)
    But the sneer is at UKIP and by association the "LEAVE"/"OUT" campaign. The BBC are trying to tar what is a campaign about sovereignty with the slur of racism. Most of the people that I know who are against the EU (largely educated people) are not racist and not UKIP.

    So please sign the petition.
    Fair dos. So have you got any examples of the BBC putting a racist slur on the out campaign?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ByEeek)
    Fair dos. So have you got any examples of the BBC putting a racist slur on the out campaign?
    The point is that on the few occasions that they cover the anti-EU lobby they focus on UKIP, which they have already daubed with "racism", and ask them about migration. At least half of anti-EU people are not UKIP and many UKIP supporters are anti-EU and not racist.

    (Just enter UKIP BBC EU migration in Google for hundreds of thousands of results.)

    The BBC should be covering items such as the loss of sovereignty to the EU in November 2014 and the huge Balance of Payments Deficit with the EU.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by newpersonage)
    (Just enter UKIP BBC EU migration in Google for hundreds of thousands of results.)
    Ok - have a look at this one. First hit based on your suggestion
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34110960

    A report about something Farage said. There is no interpretation or bias. It simply states what he said.

    Number two on the list was this
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34197707
    Again - a report stating that Farage says the EU is mad to accept more immigrants.

    (Original post by newpersonage)
    The BBC should be covering items such as the loss of sovereignty to the EU in November 2014 and the huge Balance of Payments Deficit with the EU.
    The reason the BBC doesn't cover this is because there are no politicians banging that drum. BBC News only reports things that happen. So if no one is banging on about British sovereignty, it doesn't get reported... because there is nothing to report. The BBC unlike newspapers does not have opinion pieces precisely to remain impartial. If you want to read about British Sovereignty I suggest you read the editorials in the Mail and Express.

    I did find this explaining the pros and cons of leaving the EU. Seems reasonable to me.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20448450

    I still can't anything that suggests they are biased though. Perhaps you can help?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ByEeek)
    The reason the BBC doesn't cover this is because there are no politicians banging that drum.
    Precisely my point. This is a referendum about whether or not the UK should be terminated, not a party political contest. The BBC should be providing fair and unbiased coverage of the issues, not playing personality politics.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by newpersonage)
    Precisely my point. This is a referendum about whether or not the UK should be terminated, not a party political contest. The BBC should be providing fair and unbiased coverage of the issues, not playing personality politics.
    But it is doing that. However, if no one is saying the things you think they should be saying, why should the BBC report it? You seem to be suggesting that the BBC should be reporting news that hasn't happened. To do so would surely be classed as propaganda and then you would be criticised for making the BBC biased to the Euro-skeptic side. You can't have it both ways.

    As shown above, I posted a link on the pros and cons of leaving the EU. Is that not enough?
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    Political Ambassador
    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Sure, if we can make SKY and every other mainstream news source do it.

    Why pick on the beeb? :dontknow:
    al beeb is more influential no?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ByEeek)
    ... You seem to be suggesting that the BBC should be reporting news that hasn't happened. To do so would surely be classed as propaganda and then you would be criticised for making the BBC biased to the Euro-skeptic side. You can't have it both ways.
    The Balance of Payments happens every month.



    It is catastrophic but never discussed.
    That rental and house prices are largely due to demand is never discussed

    And so on...

    The BBC is clearly biassed. The key issues are employment, balance of payments, trade, migration but the BBC never offers a fair analysis of the data or even presents the data.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by a noble chance)
    That isn't how a referendum works. The AV referendum was almost unanimously rejected by the public.
    The AV Referendum was managed by the media in the same way as the EU referendum. I am saying this is utterly unfair.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by pol pot noodles)
    The BBC is a public service broadcaster that is obliged to be impartial, regardless of all else.
    This is a myth. The BBC is required to be balanced, not impartial. There is a difference.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by newpersonage)
    The Balance of Payments happens every month.

    It is catastrophic but never discussed.
    I found an article on this from March this year
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32135154

    That it is catastrophic is your opinion. This article suggests "For advanced economies like the UK, current account deficits have a habit of not really mattering until such a time as investors decide they do matter. At which point they can matter a great deal."

    Which seems fair to me and certainly balanced.

    (Original post by newpersonage)
    That rental and house prices are largely due to demand is never discussed
    From yesterday
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34657232

    "But [Nationwide] warned house building needed to keep pace with increased demand."

    (Original post by newpersonage)
    The BBC is clearly biassed.
    Your view of the BBC is that it is biased, either because you are not viewing all the material released by the BBC as a whole, or because you are seeing a few articles that don't cover issues you feel are important and then conclude that this is down to bias.

    It feels like you are one of the blind men in the fable of the blind men and the elephant.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_men_and_an_elephant
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Sure, if we can make SKY and every other mainstream news source do it.

    Why pick on the beeb? :dontknow:
    Er, because it is biased?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ByEeek)
    I found an article on this from March this year
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32135154

    That it is catastrophic is your opinion. This article suggests "For advanced economies like the UK, current account deficits have a habit of not really mattering until such a time as investors decide they do matter. At which point they can matter a great deal."

    Which seems fair to me and certainly balanced.
    No, that is utterly biassed. It is taking the p*ss!

    Try looking up any economics site for the effect of a chronic balance of payments problem. Here is a quote from http://www.economicshelp.org/macroec...ments-deficit/
    • It depend on the size of the current account deficit as a % of GDP. For example, a deficit of over 5% would be cause for greater concern.
    • It depends on how you are financing the current account deficit. If a country is borrowing from abroad to finance consumption, this is damaging in the long-term. If it is financing the current account deficit through attracting long-term capital investment, this could have positive benefits.
    • It depends on the country in question. For example, the US probably has less reason to be concerned about a current account deficit. The US can attract a lot of capital flows to buy dollar securities. However, a developing economy may be more vulnerable to a current account deficit. This is because investors may be quicker to fear an economic downturn and remove their capital.
    The UK deficit is over 5%, the current account deficit IS being financed by borrowing. The deficit IS imbalancing the UK economy, the spending of investment money on imports rather than re-investment abroad is creating a long term liability etc..

    The coverage you quote is an excellent example of BBC bias. The effects of a long term balance of payments deficit is kiddies economics.

    The heart of the problem of BBC bias is that they are post-structuralist, they deal with news by setting up opposing sides and letting them fight it out, this allows them to put, say, Branson as a proEU person against a white van man as the antiEU person. A mature organisation would present the data clearly and get advice from several senior academics about a balanced presentation.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    But when you use words like "It depends" you are stating an opinion. What if all those "depends" don't happen? Your opinion disappears.

    The BBC doesn't have an opinion so it doesn't say if something is good or bad. That is for us to decide. However, if a politician or someone of standing states that it is a good or bad, that gets reported. EconomicsHelp have clearly stated their opinion. It doesn't mean they are right although you clearly agree with them.

    You still haven't shown me an example of the BBC being biased. Not stating your opinion as fact is not what being biased is about.

    Since you keep banging on about the trade deficit could you please point out what is biased about this report from April?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32231055
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Good bloke)
    This is a myth. The BBC is required to be balanced, not impartial. There is a difference.
    I would refer you to http://www.bbc.co.uk/editorialguidel...y-introduction :

    "The Agreement accompanying the BBC Charter requires us to do all we can to ensure controversial subjects are treated with due impartiality in our news and other output dealing with matters of public policy or political or industrial controversy. But we go further than that, applying due impartiality to all subjects."
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ByEeek)
    Since you keep banging on about the trade deficit could you please point out what is biased about this report from April?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32231055
    It is a reasonable article and encapsulates what I was saying about presenting data. "Bias" does not mean 100% of the time, just biassed to one side.

    Perhaps the problem is that BBC staff are too daft to enquire about primary and secondary income deficits and fdi and portfolio investment rather than saying "Balance of Payments, Uhh? Thats OK".
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by newpersonage)
    Perhaps the problem is that BBC staff are too daft to enquire about primary and secondary income deficits and fdi and portfolio investment rather than saying "Balance of Payments, Uhh? Thats OK".
    Or perhaps the BBC audience have absolutely no idea what primary and secondary income deficits and fdi and portfolio investments are... or care. That said if the contributors to Evan Davies' The Bottom Line last night entitled "Financial Engineering" are anything to go by, most investors, banks, bankers, politicians and political advisers don't know what these things are either.
 
 
 
Poll
Are you going to a festival?
Useful resources

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.