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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    He would rather blame the EU than look at how other speaker manufacturers have dealt with the challenge.
    From his description i hardly see it as a challenge at all. Like come on, if cheap chinese manufacturers can get around the problem with ease and keep prices low then this simpleton has nothing to complain about.
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    (Original post by Betelgeuse-)
    "Potentially" -

    A food blender 3ft away is 90db - I dont hear many people becoming deaf thanks to their nutribullet - A rock band is about 110db yet i dont see support for people having THEIR CHOICE to attend rock concerts being taken away from them...

    Yet we cant buy a pair of headphones that exceeds 80db. Like i said, treated like small impoverished children who cant and shouldnt be allowed to make decisions for ourselves. You might want that, most people do not. No thankyou
    We have a vote on these decisions. If we leave, we still have to comply with the regulations without having a say at all.
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    (Original post by lolatmaths)
    We have a vote on these decisions. If we leave, we still have to comply with the regulations without having a say at all.
    A vote on these decisions .. LOL

    No we would not, dont lie
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    (Original post by Betelgeuse-)
    A vote on these decisions .. LOL
    I'm afraid "LOL" has not yet been accepted as a valid argument for, well, anything.

    No we would not, dont lie
    We would if we wanted to sell the things in the EU, which I assume most UK businesses would.
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    (Original post by Betelgeuse-)
    "Potentially" -

    A food blender 3ft away is 90db - I dont hear many people becoming deaf thanks to their nutribullet - A rock band is about 110db yet i dont see support for people having THEIR CHOICE to attend rock concerts being taken away from them...

    Yet we cant buy a pair of headphones that exceeds 80db. Like i said, treated like small impoverished children who cant and shouldnt be allowed to make decisions for ourselves. You might want that, most people do not. No thankyou
    So you're annoyed that the EU prevents us from damaging our hearing?
    Back in my day businesses were free to make damaging products which mad people deaf but it was worth it because of soveriegnty or something...

    The brexit camp really are laughable.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Ofc you have a right just as others do to say you are whining rather than finidning a real life solution.
    The point is: I SHOULDN'T have to be looking for a solution.

    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Its man made just like other legal laws. EU law is as natural as those laws.
    Exactly, and we criticise national laws all the time.


    (Original post by 999tigger)
    For a small company like creative it makes sense to have one product they cna just ship to the European region. If they find that the sale of their speakers is suffering, then they should look at the design and how other manufacturers arent letting the regulation hold them back from making sales.
    Again you fail to show how it would be difficult for them to ship a different version to the UK. All they need is a sticker on the box: "NON-EU Version". It seems pretty trivial to me.
    We don't know what other manufacturers are doing. Maybe they are ignoring the regulation altogether.
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    (Original post by lolatmaths)
    So? You cant make a claim that other companies are suffering too. My Bose speakers work fine, and my cheap bluetooth speakers work fine too.

    As i said, this is an issue that isnt felt by other speakers. It seems pretty easily solvable if other companies seem unaffected.
    Here you have other speakers that are forced into standby mode:

    http://www.juno.co.uk/products/genel...dio/490221-01/

    That other speakers work says nothing because we don't know how they are made compared to Creative speakers or if the companies are even paying attention to the regulation.
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    If we all chip together maybe we can just buy this guy a decent pair of speakers?
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    Damn British people will blame anything on the EU. And I mean anything.
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    (Original post by offhegoes)
    I'm afraid "LOL" has not yet been accepted as a valid argument for, well, anything.



    We would if we wanted to sell the things in the EU, which I assume most UK businesses would.


    So you are telling me every single country that sell things to the EU has to comply with EU directives such as the speakers on their headphones on all their IMPORTS regardless of where they bought them from? How do Americans have headphones that can exceed 80db then?
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    (Original post by Betelgeuse-)
    So you are telling me every single country that sell things to the EU has to comply with EU directives such as the speakers on their headphones on all their IMPORTS regardless of where they bought them from? How do Americans have headphones that can exceed 80db then?
    No, but the things that we sell to the EU would need to meet EU requirements, which is clearly what I was saying.
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    (Original post by offhegoes)
    No, but the things that we sell to the EU would need to meet EU requirements, which is clearly what I was saying.
    Which is not a problem. I will be able to enjoy my music unlike my EU amigos
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    (Original post by plstudent)
    The point is: I SHOULDN'T have to be looking for a solution.
    Blame Creative for failing to design its product to cope better and yourself for failing to resarech properly and pick a more appropriate product. You just enjoy complaining when most people would do soemthing practical about it. You could have returned the speakers under the CRA, but you'd prefer to moan.

    (Original post by plstudent)
    Exactly, and we criticise national laws all the time.
    Again you fail to show how it would be difficult for them to ship a different version to the UK. All they need is a sticker on the box: "NON-EU Version". It seems pretty trivial to me. We don't know what other manufacturers are doing. Maybe they are ignoring the regulation altogether.[/QUOTE]

    Its easier just to have one version and more cost effective. Benefit of mass production. and limiting storage locations. Its up to you to complain to Creative enough to impress upon them how much it has ruined your life and you will be taking your custom elsewhere. If enough people in the UK do it, then they might change or find an alternate solution.
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    (Original post by Betelgeuse-)
    Which is not a problem. I will be able to enjoy my music unlike my EU amigos
    Great, but which is of more importance when it comes to the EU referendum? (Because, hey, that's what this is all about right? )

    You damaging your hearing to your heart's content, or UK businesses selling in the EU?
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    (Original post by offhegoes)
    Great, but which is of more importance when it comes to the EU referendum? (Because, hey, that's what this is all about right? )

    You damaging your hearing to your heart's content, or UK businesses selling in the EU?
    The UK businesses will sell to the EU and the world. No problem there

    My hearing will be undamaged but more importantly i will have the choice to purchase an effective and enjoyable product :bath:
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Blame Creative for failing to design its product to cope better and yourself for failing to resarech properly and pick a more appropriate product. You just enjoy complaining when most people would do soemthing practical about it. You could have returned the speakers under the CRA, but you'd prefer to moan.
    Yeah, blame productive engineers and customers who buy from a trusted brand. Never blame parasitic overpaid bureaucrats.

    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Its easier just to have one version and more cost effective. Benefit of mass production.
    They already have two versions. They would only need to ship the American version to the UK and I expect that to happen as soon as the UK breaks free from the European Union of Socialist Republics.
    (Original post by 999tigger)
    and limiting storage locations.
    They are the same size. All you need is a sticker or some other distinctive on the boxes.

    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Its up to you to complain to Creative enough to impress upon them how much it has ruined your life and you will be taking your custom elsewhere. If enough people in the UK do it, then they might change or find an alternate solution.
    Easier for them to just get GB out of the EU and then they can send over the American version. :yes:
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    (Original post by SW19!)
    Cheers for your reply. The UK population can't decide however, for example, that Donald Tusk and Jean Claude Juncker are not acting in the best interests of the UK therefore we're going to vote to remove them. Only action we can take as a country is to the leave the EU. Hence why we're having this Referendum.

    My 7th point was valid as the EU added Estonia and Latvia in 2004 to the ever growing list of EU membership countries. These countries border Russia. This is an example of the West (namely the EU) being in expansive mode.

    You are correct to mention NATO however as these countries will more than likely host the NATO Anti Ballistic Missile Defence Shield (this is seriously being considered at the highest levels of NATO.) Thus destabilising MAD. Russia's land based Nukes will become almost non effective due to this. A major War between superpowers becomes more likely.

    Also, yeah I agree on the membership fees but not when we are paying in a much higher amount than other countries. In essence, a country such as the UK will be financially penalised for having a strong economy.

    The EU is a nice idea (freedom to move around etc) but it's being conducted by the wrong people in the wrong way for the wrong reasons.
    I completely agree with you. Although I think we need a defense mechanism against possible long rage attacks (coming from either russia or middle east.

    I completely agree that EU is not being run in the best correct way however, the only ones who can save it are the ones who are in it.
    It's about solidarity, we need to get together as one and fight for the best interests of everyone involved.

    I agree getting new countries might not be a good strategy to cope economic issues, and I surely hope Turkey and Ukraine won't be voted in however in order to make a difference we need to participate and take part.

    If UK leaves you will be watching a house burn, after UK other countries will probably leave too (speculative), and then we will be easy targets.

    In Portugal, we say: "The unity makes the strength". We are stronger together.
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    As said you do like to moan instead of getting off your backside and solving the issue. A bit of googling will reveal answers as to what other people have done to solve the issue, but you enjoy whining more.

    At the moment, it doesnt look like we will leave, but really you should be blessing Creative with how they should be running their business.
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    (Original post by lolatmaths)
    Good for you mate but there are 16 yr olds who've learnt this stuff.

    So what? I began learning economics when I was twelve. It makes no difference. What matters is the theory itself, not at what age an individual has learned it.

    (Original post by lolatmaths)
    I didnt say that is my only reason. In economic terms, that is one aspect of it. This isnt a remain or leave argument thread.

    your trade theory is irrelevant. It maybe price inelastic, high tech etc etc but how is that relevant when we already have trade deals with the EU that accumulate to 44% of our international trade? surely leaving would put this at risk, considering that all we can do is speculate?
    It is not irrelevant. The reason that 44% of the value of UK exports goes to the EU is not due to trade agreements. It is due to the EU being the largest market for the types of goods that the UK produces. The UK doesn't choose what it produces, but rather produces what there is demand for.

    The EU isn't going to stop wanting to purchase UK exports, for which few substitutes exist. The firms consuming UK goods aggregate a very potent lobby in the EU. The EU needs UK exports, and therefore a desirable trade agreement will be established if the UK leaves the EU. Why would the EU impose tariffs that would cause more harm to their businesses than good? That would counter the entire purpose of protectionism.

    (Original post by lolatmaths)
    Im sure we can sit here and argue about more complex issues like liquidity trap (hardly relevant but whatever) but ultimately the remain side has the economic argument as its strongpoint and when most respectable economists have said staying is better than leaving economically, it shows how leaving could be a reckless decison. For starters we can fall into a recession so bad that we may never recover from it and reach the levels of prosperity that we are experiencing now.
    I mentioned the liquidity trap precisely because it is irrelevant - just like almost all degree-level and further economics. What is relevant here is basic econ 101.

    What is the opportunity cost of not conducting UK focused trade agreements with China, USA, Australia, Canada, Japan, India, Brazil, South Korea, Russia, Mexico, Indonesia, Turkey, Switzerland, etc? It is most certainly greater than the cost of foregoing EU free-trade agreements, especially when combined with EU budget current transfers.

    Economic predictions are not made more accurate by the number of economists who support them. This is an irrelevance. We could crunch the numbers for past predictions if you really wanted (the Euro crisis for instance), but it would take for too long for a petty internet forum discussion (the forum being petty, not the discussion). What matters is sound economic analysis with empirical support. The problem with that is that economists require something to have already happened before they can analyse it.
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    (Original post by Anno007)
    basis econ 101
    As opposed to complicated economics 101?
 
 
 
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