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  • View Poll Results: Have you made up your mind about how to vote yet?
    Yes I'm definite about my vote
    128
    75.29%
    No- I've not decided yet
    9
    5.29%
    I'm not going to vote
    16
    9.41%
    I keep changing my mind
    17
    10.00%

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    (Original post by EuanF)
    Eh? Tell me how us leaving would benefit ISIS in any way.
    Read the TIME article.
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    (Original post by jneill)
    Not if they don't have residency.
    And even then...
    http://www.connexionfrance.com/Vienn...w-article.html
    The question was on their right to stay not their right to benefits lol. Of course they have no right to benefits but they will not be made to leave and no one in this country can say it would be a good idea to deport them all.

    Stop scaremongering.
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    (Original post by jneill)
    Read the TIME article.
    Would you like to link it?

    Us leaving the EU makes it more difficult for ISIS to move soldiers here, has no bearing on our ability to fight in Syria and may in fact improve it as we don't need to commit troops to an EU battle group any more.
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    (Original post by EuanF)
    Would you like to link it?

    Us leaving the EU makes it more difficult for ISIS to move soldiers here, has no bearing on our ability to fight in Syria and may in fact improve it as we don't need to commit troops to an EU battle group any more.
    I already did earlier in this thread.
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    (Original post by Trill)
    I'm voting remain. There's fear too much scaremongering and politicians feeding off people being anti immigration.


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    Not sure you've been following the campaign... Remain have been scaremongering.

    Besides, there's a million good reasons to leave the EU that aren't based on fear and that are based on hope and a brighter future for both us and the European peoples.
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    ffs LEAVE! goddamn it
    we can't continue to be a member of this horrific detached dead-hand institution
    we will get more and more immigration now that more and more former communist countries are set to join (and turkey)
    we will continue to be weighed down by the anchor of anti-global protectionism and corporatist clientalism which forces us (the consumers of europe) to have to pay more for international goods via EU tariffs and EU VAT
    we will continue to to have more and more of our laws originating from the EU instead of our own elected parliament (the EU parliament while elected has almost no power)
    why can't you people see this? you might like the EU now but just you wait - it's going to grow and devolve just like it did between 1975 and 2005. this is the trend, my friends. the trend towards "EVER-CLOSER-UNION". you are on the bus and the monitor is saying "next stop: united states of europe" and you are staying put, thinking "nah I don't believe that" - the bus driving is telling you himself! and in this situation, the EU commission have CONTINUOUSLY expressed their motivations to turn this organisation into a federation, as if it wasn't already so:
    Spoiler:
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    “One must never forget that monetary union, which the two of us were the first to propose more than a decade ago, is ultimately a political project. It aims to give a new impulse to the historic movement toward union of the European states”
    (Giscard d’Estaing, who drafted the EU Constitution 1997)

    “The process of monetary union goes hand in hand, must go hand in hand, with political integration and ultimately political union. EMU [economic and monetary union] is, and always was meant to be, a stepping stone on the way to a united Europe”
    (Wim Duisenberg, first president of the EU Central Bank)

    “Once the interlude of [WWI] was over, [countries] all went back to the rules and customs of traditional parliamentary democracies. I felt out of my depth.”
    (Jean Monnet ‘Father of Europe’)

    “We need to build a United States of Europe with the [EU] Commission as government.”
    (Viviane Reding, EU Commissioner 2014)

    “We had imagined a political ‘grand design’, a new international order…”
    (Jean Monnet ‘Father of Europe’)

    "“I believe neither the French nor the Dutch really rejected the constitutional treaty. (they did, by the way)”
    (Jean-Claude Juncker, Prime Minister of Luxembourg)"

    "The United Kingdom belongs to the European Union"
    (Martin Shultz, President of the European Parliament)


    whether they've promised us a "special deal" or not, more and more countries will join, making our immigration levels grow, and more and more laws will be made in the same departments, adding to the %
    the super state IS the end goal. you people keep saying, on the remain side, that you don't want one, but THIS IS WHAT YOU WILL GET, AND YOU ARE VOTING FOR IT.
    the EU is like a drug addiction - you think it's good now and you think "what could it hurt" but you'll wake up in a few years time thinking "oh god what am I doing (inside this institution)?"
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    (Original post by tootles)
    :yawn:


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    (Original post by jneill)
    I do, but why is this a public poll?
    I've changed it
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    (Original post by AccountingBabe)
    The question was on their right to stay not their right to benefits lol. Of course they have no right to benefits but they will not be made to leave and no one in this country can say it would be a good idea to deport them all.

    Stop scaremongering.
    Oh that's ok then...
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    (Original post by Queen Cersei)
    I've changed it
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    (Original post by the bear)
    any disharmony and weakening among their enemies is welcome to the Daesh plotters.
    Is that your sole priority?

    What about the economic arguments and the argument of where the sovereignty lies; with the more democratic or the less democratic?

    (Original post by Trill)
    I'm voting remain. There's fear too much scaremongering and politicians feeding off people being anti immigration.


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Okay, you don't need to say this in every thread you go through; you're practically inviting people to ask you to support your claim.

    And so this is your reason? There's politicians gaining on political grounds if we remain in the EU too; I don't see why you've made it exclusive to one of the arguments in the leave camp.
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    (Original post by Queen Cersei)
    With mixed messages and campaign propaganda hitting us from all angles, it can be a tough decision to make... do you know how you're going to vote in the EU referendum yet?
    We actually study the benefits and costs of being in the EU in economics A-level directly so it's quite clear to see just how much the leave campaign relies on misinformation - whilst deciding how to vote I have always been of the opinion that leaving would harm our economy.

    Since then, I've seen how staying will benefit us in so many other ways - being part of a collaborative union designed primarily to instigate lasting peace can help us to fight crime and terrorism; it provides a multitude of opportunities for students (this is especially convincing as someone who wants to take full advantage of the ERASMUS scheme); it hugely benefits our scientific community.

    I do understand the reasons people want to leave - concerns about democracy, immigration and regulation, however, I haven't found any reasonable grounds on calling the EU undemocratic, I am completely pro-immigration and I don't think deregulation would be an effective or responsible policy for the UK.

    Even if I were to change my mind, I don't think I could vote leave. I think calling it a vote to leave is misleading - no one knows what you'd actually be voting for. People are very quick to ignore how badly Europe has taken the referendum and how reluctant they'd be to give us a decent deal. Further, even if a vote to leave would benefit us in the long-term, I don't think our country can afford the years of uncertainty that the negotiations would cause. FDI has already come to a stand-still since we announced the referendum, imagine how much worse the fall in investment will hit us if we vote to leave.
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    (Original post by XcitingStuart)
    Is that your sole priority?

    What about the economic arguments and the argument of where the sovereignty lies; with the more democratic or the less democratic?
    tbh we have reached the point where Sovereignty is just a quaint anachronism like tithes or trial by combat... it is time to grow up and join up with other countries.
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    (Original post by nverjvlev)
    We actually study the benefits and costs of being in the EU in economics A-level directly so it's quite clear to see just how much the leave campaign relies on misinformation - whilst deciding how to vote I have always been of the opinion that leaving would harm our economy.

    Since then, I've seen how staying will benefit us in so many other ways - being part of a collaborative union designed primarily to instigate lasting peace can help us to fight crime and terrorism; it provides a multitude of opportunities for students (this is especially convincing as someone who wants to take full advantage of the ERASMUS scheme); it hugely benefits our scientific community.

    I do understand the reasons people want to leave - concerns about democracy, immigration and regulation, however, I haven't found any reasonable grounds on calling the EU undemocratic, I am completely pro-immigration and I don't think deregulation would be an effective or responsible policy for the UK.

    Even if I were to change my mind, I don't think I could vote leave. I think calling it a vote to leave is misleading - no one knows what you'd actually be voting for. People are very quick to ignore how badly Europe has taken the referendum and how reluctant they'd be to give us a decent deal. Further, even if a vote to leave would benefit us in the long-term, I don't think our country can afford the years of uncertainty that the negotiations would cause. FDI has already come to a stand-still since we announced the referendum, imagine how much worse the fall in investment will hit us if we vote to leave.
    Have they taught you about opportunity costs? I am pro immigration also but I'm voting leave.
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    When remain says it will be a recession what they are really saying is that it will be a 0.1% recession not at FC 07/08 7% gdp recession and yet they say more jobs will be lost compared to the financial crisis. This is scaremongering.
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    (Original post by AccountingBabe)
    Have they taught you about opportunity costs? I am pro immigration also but I'm voting leave.
    I think we covered opportunity cost in my second ever economics lesson haha. Are you suggesting that our net contribution isn't worth the opportunity cost? Because I think that being part of the EU provides opportunities for growth that actually offset that cost.

    For example, the billions we earn from immigration due to an increase in our workforce and growth in labour-intensive, low-paid industries such as fruit picking and nursing.
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    I'm honestly surprised at how many people here are voting for Brexit, I thought it was mainly the older generation who wanted to leave Europe. Maybe the leave supporters are just louder on social media haha.
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    (Original post by nverjvlev)
    I think we covered opportunity cost in my second ever economics lesson haha. Are you suggesting that our net contribution isn't worth the opportunity cost? Because I think that being part of the EU provides opportunities for growth that actually offset that cost.

    For example, the billions we earn from immigration due to an increase in our workforce and growth in labour-intensive, low-paid industries such as fruit picking and nursing.
    We don't need to be in the eu to have immigration at the same level but we do need to know in advance the amount we intend to let in to train doctors, build enough houses etc which takes at least 5 years planning.

    No one is saying lowering immigration except Nigel Farage we want the same but better quality and good estimates so we can plan in the future.
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    (Original post by nverjvlev)
    I'm honestly surprised at how many people here are voting for Brexit, I thought it was mainly the older generation who wanted to leave Europe. Maybe the leave supporters are just louder on social media haha.
    They say that because it will make students not speak up if they think they are a minority in their peers.
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    (Original post by AccountingBabe)
    We don't need to be in the eu to have immigration at the same level but we do need to know in advance the amount we intend to let in to train doctors, build enough houses etc which takes at least 5 years planning.

    No one is saying lowering immigration except Nigel Farage we want the same but better quality and good estimates so we can plan in the future.
    Actually, we do. Free movement of people is part of our trade deal with the EU. If we vote to leave, all the eastern European workers will move to countries like France and Germany for work because they would need work visas to work here. Also, you forget that we have a right-wing government who tend to oppose immigration.
 
 
 
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