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France "must learn to live with terrorism" -French Prime Minister watch

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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    What can actually be done to stop it though other than what is already been done? Security services are already doing all they can. They can't stop every attack. You could tighten up boarders a bit but there are enough extremists already in the country like the last guy. Invading Syria or anywhere else isn't going to help.

    It's all well and good saying we must stand up and fight terrorism but what do people saying this actually suggest we do? It's all rhetoric as I'm concerned. There are likely to be further terror attacks and there is nothing the French government, or anyone else can do.
    What can be done to stop it?

    Close the effing borders.

    I know, sounds unsavoury, but stopping the problem from getting worse is the first step.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    No other western country has suffered an armed assault on its population on anything like the scale of France which has now suffered several such attacks. All other western countries have faced traditional bombings or much smaller scale events.

    There has not been a large scale attack launched in the UK since the Glasgow airport plot of 2007. Plenty have been disrupted by the security services. That is almost 10 years.
    There have been attacks in France. There have also been attacks in America and Belgium. You can't read too much into pasterns when these attacks happen once a year or so. You can't infer that French security services are worse. There is not enough data to make those conclusions. It could be down to bad luck.

    You know, if the guard didn't let the lorry through, if they were tipped off about the Paris attacks and there were a couple of successful attacks on the UK, you could well be saying how great the French security services are.
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    (Original post by welshiee)

    Why aren't Romania and Poland experiencing terrorist attacks?

    Because they have basically zero Muslim populations

    France has about 10% of it's population which class themselves as Muslim, colour me surprised they sent the largest group of foreign fighters to ISIS and have the most terror attacks in Europe.

    Your nation can't produce home grown Islamic terrorists when you have barely any Muslims in the first place.
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    (Original post by Fugggggg :DDD)
    What can be done to stop it?

    Close the effing borders.

    I know, sounds unsavoury, but stopping the problem from getting worse is the first step.
    They could do that but it would be extremely costly both economically and politically. And like I said, 1000s have already entered France and there are extremists who have been in France for years. So they may stop 1 or 2 attacks by closing the boarders but there will still be attacks. There is not the political will to do it because it because the cost of closing the boarders is too high. It is worth taking the risk of extra attacks.
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    (Original post by remiremi)
    Because they have basically zero Muslim populations

    France has about 10% of it's population which class themselves as Muslim, colour me surprised they sent the largest group of foreign fighters to ISIS and have the most terror attacks in Europe.

    Your nation can't produce home grown Islamic terrorists when you have barely any Muslims in the first place.
    Exactly.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    They could do that but it would be extremely costly both economically and politically. And like I said, 1000s have already entered France and there are extremists who have been in France for years. So they may stop 1 or 2 attacks by closing the boarders but there will still be attacks. There is not the political will to do it because it because the cost of closing the boarders is too high. It is worth taking the risk of extra attacks.
    Europe has already betrayed too many of its member states and citizens. I only hope the ex communist block decide to leave and protect their own homogenous population as that is the key to long term stability with less tensions.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    They could do that but it would be extremely costly both economically and politically. And like I said, 1000s have already entered France and there are extremists who have been in France for years. So they may stop 1 or 2 attacks by closing the boarders but there will still be attacks. There is not the political will to do it because it because the cost of closing the boarders is too high. It is worth taking the risk of extra attacks.
    "Too costly."

    And loss of innocent life is a price worth paying for? And what if the next attack is another 100 lives lost?

    I think you need to get your head out of your ass and realise there is more to life then money, wealth and economy. No country ever has a good economy during a war.

    It's time for the 2nd French Revolution. I really am baffled how the French continue to go on with their day to day lives while knowing that everyday they could get shot, run over or blown to pieces.
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    (Original post by welshiee)
    Our foreign policy has been akin to using chemo on the cancer only to then let even more extreme mutations of it take over and manifest. I am not refuting our part in allowing even more extremist factions of Islam to form but the reality is these branches of Islam will always grow out of corrupted roots.

    Replace those corrupted roots with peaceful ones and you would see more branches of peaceful Islam manifest in the future but that will never happen as the word of Allah cannot be changed and is deemed perfect.
    I don't think that is the case personally. What we see now I feel appears to be an expression of environment more than ideology (but nevertheless a significant interaction between them).

    You tend to find that with increasing levels of education, religious identification and strength of association with their religious beliefs tend to decline considerably (well, apart from those highly educated that feel like they have wasted so much of their time educating themselves for it to be pointless, to digress).

    Such displays of hatred towards considerable numbers of people can only serve to drive a wedge between people - and who knows, maybe even a self-fulfilling effect.
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    (Original post by hellodave5)
    I don't think that is the case personally. What we see now I feel appears to be an expression of environment more than ideology (but nevertheless a significant interaction between them).

    You tend to find that with increasing levels of education, religious identification and strength of association with their religious beliefs tend to decline considerably (well, apart from those highly educated that feel like they have wasted so much of their time educating themselves for it to be pointless, to digress).

    Such displays of hatred towards considerable numbers of people can only serve to drive a wedge between people - and who knows, maybe even a self-fulfilling effect.
    The problem is we'll never have a world or even countries of highly educated people. Even in Sweden where they practised eugenics to stop the stupid from breeding they face massive issues there. Liberal tolerance of intolerant ideologies is the main problem.
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    (Original post by Fugggggg :DDD)
    "Too costly."

    And loss of innocent life is a price worth paying for? And what if the next attack is another 100 lives lost?

    I think you need to get your head out of your ass and realise there is more to life then money, wealth and economy. No country ever has a good economy during a war.

    It's time for the 2nd French Revolution. I really am baffled how the French continue to go on with their day to day lives while knowing that everyday they could get shot, run over or blown to pieces.
    Easy.

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    (Original post by welshiee)
    Easy.


    Reminds me a lot of this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeMZGGQ0ERk
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    (Original post by Fugggggg :DDD)
    Reminds me a lot of this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeMZGGQ0ERk
    Or you can use this one - everyone knows filters and hashtags fix everything :rolleyes:

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    (Original post by Fugggggg :DDD)
    "Too costly."

    And loss of innocent life is a price worth paying for? And what if the next attack is another 100 lives lost?

    I think you need to get your head out of your ass and realise there is more to life then money, wealth and economy. No country ever has a good economy during a war.

    It's time for the 2nd French Revolution. I really am baffled how the French continue to go on with their day to day lives while knowing that everyday they could get shot, run over or blown to pieces.
    Life has a price unfortunately. We don't have unlimited resources. If it would cost billions to close the boarders. You could save more than 100 lives putting billions into healthcare.

    At my work we had training on what do do in a terror attack. 500 of us on £15 an hour for half a day. That's a lot of money. Plus the venue and everything. The chance of any of us ever being caught in a terror attack is so small and even if one of us was, I don't think that training would have been much use.

    They would have been better doing testicular cancer awareness or road safety awareness. That would have been more likely to save lives.

    You have to put these risks into perspective.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    Life has a price unfortunately. We don't have unlimited resources. If it would cost billions to close the boarders. You could save more than 100 lives putting billions into healthcare.

    At my work we had training on what do do in a terror attack. 500 of us on £15 an hour for half a day. That's a lot of money. Plus the venue and everything. The chance of any of us ever being caught in a terror attack is so small and even if one of us was, I don't think that training would have been much use.

    They would have been better doing testicular cancer awareness or road safety awareness. That would have been more likely to save lives.

    You have to put these risks into perspective.
    It would not cost much at all, you could do what Trump is proposing for example and have bans on certain people, nobody is calling for a ban on South Koreans etc. Also, if the amount of terrorism is reduced, some money is saved, so its not an entire loss.
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    (Original post by The_Opinion)
    It would not cost much at all, you could do what Trump is proposing for example and have bans on certain people, nobody is calling for a ban on South Koreans etc. Also, if the amount of terrorism is reduced, some money is saved, so its not an entire loss.
    Just securing the boarders alone would be a big task. France has a lot of land boarders. The volume of traffic that crosses in and out of France all the time makes checking all of them completely unfeasible.

    We check about 10 percent of lorries at Dover and even fewer cars and we have a sea to protect us.

    So unless you were prepared to stop the majority of the trade, which would be too costly, you can't stop people entering France over its land boarders.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    Just securing the boarders alone would be a big task. France has a lot of land boarders. The volume of traffic that crosses in and out of France all the time makes checking all of them completely unfeasible.

    We check about 10 percent of lorries at Dover and even fewer cars and we have a sea to protect us.

    So unless you were prepared to stop the majority of the trade, which would be too costly, you can't stop people entering France over its land boarders.
    Stopping refugees and immigration from high risk areas is incredibly easy to do. All borders are easy to protect, you just put people along the edge with cameras, walls etc, it is not hard to do.
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    (Original post by The_Opinion)
    Stopping refugees and immigration from high risk areas is incredibly easy to do. All borders are easy to protect, you just put people along the edge with cameras, walls etc, it is not hard to do.
    Its not while the rest of Europe isn't following that policy. French citizens could just go to German, pick up a load of refugees and bring them into France in the boot. As I explained, it is not feasible to check every boot without a huge reduction in trade.
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    Its not while the rest of Europe isn't following that policy. French citizens could just go to German, pick up a load of refugees and bring them into France in the boot. As I explained, it is not feasible to check every boot without a huge reduction in trade.
    That is not happening though is it, you are being ridiculous. It is called people smuggling, and people don't tend to do that, especially if you give them huge prison sentences for doing it, you are just being silly. I am not even referring to people sneaking into France, I am talking about people that the French government are stupid enough to allow in.

    If France didn't have such a large Muslim population, it would not have the problems that it now has, allowing even more Muslims into the country will only make things worse, only a moron could not see that.
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    (Original post by welshiee)
    I'm not blaming immigrants. I'm blaming politicians who have purposefully flooded Europe to suit their own political and economic aims. The same as America did with exploitation of Mexicans in the South.
    I don't agree with what you've been saying and agree with SLF but I just want to ask why you blame politicians if what you say is true?

    I blame the ******* 'idiots' who VOTE for them. If things are as bad as has been portrayed on this thread why do these 'sheep' keep supporting people like Merkel etc?
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    (Original post by Sternumator)
    You can't infer that French security services are worse.
    Yes you can, and the French Commission of Enquiry has. You are seeking a level of proof that is unattainable in what amount to a (very recent) historical enquiry.
 
 
 
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