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    There is no organisation more hypocritical than the Catholic Church, and I say this from personal experience with accompanying scars- physical, sexual and emotional. 'Don't do as I do - do as I say' comes to mind.
    Perhaps all these large families on benefits could become Catholics, then the Church could feed them. After all, 'Suffer little children to come unto me, for theirs is the Kingdom of Heaven.' An open invite. It would relieve the State of its obligations and the Catholic Church can afford it.
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    (Original post by frankielogue)
    They want:
    - The joy of bringing up a child
    - The joy of seeing their child having opportunities they couldn’t
    - To have kids for the exact same reasons as rich people

    You don’t call rich people selfish for wanting kids, so why poor people? They literally just want to live a decent, fulfilling life.
    And others must pay for that?
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    Lol god damn catholics , that **** is corrupted from the core
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    (Original post by catholicgirl)
    I'm not bitter actually. Plus I have been happily married for a year and a half now
    As a Catholic and as part of your marriage preparation, you will know that 'openness to life' (I.e Children) is necessary for a Catholic marriage to be valid. (Can. 1055 §1)**

    If you're a Catholic, got married in a Catholic wedding ceremony and never want children in your marriage, your marriage is invalid.


    I'm only taking umbrage at this because people will look at your name and assume you represent the views of Catholics. You don't.

    I'll also state more explicitly that which I mentioned earlier, Jesus Christ was dirt poor and so were His parents. If you sincerely believe that poor people shouldn't have children - Jesus Christ would never have entered the world.


    TLDR; Stop chatting sh*t.

    SS

    ** This is a reference to Canon Law (The law that guides marriages, baptisms, for Catholics)
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    It really wasn't that long ago that middle class people were crying into their Egyptian cotton bedsheets because the government suggested that if little timmy's parents earned £30k then they probably didn't need £80 a month in child benefit.

    "But how could we afford Timmy without this money?"

    So you're suggesting that anyone who qualifies for child benefit shouldn't have children? No you're not are you. You're being judgy about the poverty class. I grew up on the bread line and whilst my upbringing was tough for many reasons, like my parents being a-holes. Money and lack of it didn't really factor in. Even when my dad was seriously injured at work and couldn't work for ages. Or when the 90s happened and loads of people lost their job and needed to claim Jobseeker's Allowance. He used the help available and retrained in a different field. He now works in high position of a global company.

    He pays more in taxes each year (now) than you'll ever pay in contribution to the nations children.
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    Some people want a bundle of joy in there lives but only if they're lucky bc children can be so annoying.

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    Because having children is important. Why would you want to live a life where you don't continue your family?
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    (Original post by Pudge666)
    Lol god damn catholics , that **** is corrupted from the core
    u know nothing
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    (Original post by Supersaps)

    I'll also state more explicitly that which I mentioned earlier, Jesus Christ was dirt poor and so were His parents. If you sincerely believe that poor people shouldn't have children - Jesus Christ would never have entered the world.

    hmmm Our Lord was born into a prosperous family in the building trade; they would have been pillars of the Nazarene community.
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    (Original post by frankielogue)
    I don’t think you understand how little child benefits are.
    Eldest/Only child = £20.70 a week
    Other children = £13.70
    Don’t forget the benefit cap.
    So personally you are bearing a tiny part of this, considering over 30million people are working and paying taxes
    currently working tax credits can be up to £60 per child per week depending on what you earn.

    thats about £3000 per child, per year. starts to look very attractive to have lots of children if you are poor.

    someone on £10,000 per year could easily double or triple his 'income' depending on how many children he has.
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    (Original post by the bear)
    hmmm Our Lord was born into a prosperous family in the building trade; they would have been pillars of the Nazarene community.
    It's debatable. Some modern scholars have taken different opinions on the issue but I didn't want to give a detailed exegesis.

    I don't mean to say that Jesus' family were beggars but that they were probably equivalent to working class families of today. Joseph was a 'righteous' man and certainly a good carpenter. However, I don't doubt if they were wealthier they would have given much of it to the poor and the to the temple.

    Our Lady & Joseph offer the poor gift of two pigeons rather than a lamb in Luke 2. The wealthy would offer a lamb but the poor can replace it with two doves. (somewhere in Lev: and the current Jewish practice at the time.)

    I doubt if the Holy Family were big ballers, they would have skimped on their purification sacrifice.

    Given Jesus' comments in various parts of gospels, it is difficult to believe that He was rich. Camels, needles, the young man saying 'What must I do to inherit eternal life?' etc

    In Christo,

    SS
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    (Original post by ~Tara~)
    It really wasn't that long ago that middle class people were crying into their Egyptian cotton bedsheets because the government suggested that if little timmy's parents earned £30k then they probably didn't need £80 a month in child benefit.

    "But how could we afford Timmy without this money?"

    So you're suggesting that anyone who qualifies for child benefit shouldn't have children? No you're not are you. You're being judgy about the poverty class. I grew up on the bread line and whilst my upbringing was tough for many reasons, like my parents being a-holes. Money and lack of it didn't really factor in. Even when my dad was seriously injured at work and couldn't work for ages. Or when the 90s happened and loads of people lost their job and needed to claim Jobseeker's Allowance. He used the help available and retrained in a different field. He now works in high position of a global company.

    He pays more in taxes each year (now) than you'll ever pay in contribution to the nations children.
    sure people should be able to have children. the issue, of course, is whether it is fair to the taxpayer to fund your choice, many of whom will be paying taxes to fund the upbringing of children whilst putting off having a family of their own as they cannot afford it themselves.

    should we need to be encouraging couples to have more children than they can afford with UK birthrates amongst the highest in europe?

    you'd be surprised how much tax credits low income, high children families get from the taxpayer (see my previous post). that is money given to you that has been earned by someone else, it didnt appear out of thin air. if we can put a price on life, as the NHS does, then does cutting child tax credits and the like to the first child or two seem so bad?

    personally i believe everyone should have the first child or two paid for, but after that, in this day and age with people dieing every day because we are told we cannot afford their treatment, and most students now expected to fund all of their degree through loans, difficult choices have to be made. if people wish to have more children, fine. just don't expect the taxpayer to pick up the tab, i know i wouldn't.
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    (Original post by catholicgirl)
    I don't understand why people who can barely afford to look after themselves will then bring children into the world who will grow up with a low standard of living.
    Cos people are thick, Cos the state provides for them. Cos it seemed a good idea at the time
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    This is a phenomenon I also struggle to grasp without recourse to my most cynical views of human nature.
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    (Original post by frankielogue)
    Because they want children????? Just because they have a deprived socio-economic status shouldn’t mean they are denied the chance of parenthood. Live n let live
    He says whilst then demanding / forcing everybody else to pay for those kids
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    (Original post by the bear)
    u know nothing
    And you do, I suppose.
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    (Original post by Seamus123)
    And you do, I suppose.
    ofc
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    (Original post by frankielogue)
    I don’t think you understand how little child benefits are.
    Eldest/Only child = £20.70 a week
    Other children = £13.70
    Don’t forget the benefit cap.
    So personally you are bearing a tiny part of this, considering over 30million people are working and paying taxes
    Throw in Free healthcare, free prescriptions, free dentisry, free school clothes, free education, free house, Free childcare, energy / clothes / food subsidies and add more roads, hospitals, schools, houses, infrastracture... NOW do the maths. This guy makes it out like its £33 quid a week whilst positively alluding the Tory benefit cap as something good, when its likely he vehemently protested against it and would repeal it in a heartbeat if he had the chance

    Maybe all these kids grow up to be doctors and engineers though or maybe most follow in their terrible parents footstops by making bad choices with many resorting to crime and most working low paying jobs
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    (Original post by Tsrsarahhhh)
    Everyone should have the option of having children and a family so I don't think it's selfish. I do however cringe and feel bad for children who are born into families who already have loads of children and are on benefits and the parents have no jobs.
    WHY? - Should everybody have the option of having a Ferrari or a 4 bedroom house?

    A welfare system should be a safety net for when life throws curveballs at people... Not some giant fluffy I WANT I WANT I WANT transfer of money to people who want stuff they cannot afford
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    Can't afford condoms.
 
 
 
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