Home Secretary branded "racist" for her immigration plans.

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    (Original post by queen-bee)
    I don't see why it should matter, if they're able to job well and have a good work ethic then we should be encouraging that regardless of where they may be from
    Agree, but you haven't answered my question

    It's the whole they're stealing our jobs nonsense blah blah
    Aye, bit pathetic really e.g. attempting to delegate responsibility for foreigners pervading our society/workforce, and using shame to do so. What the country wants is direct action on immigration and integration. Intention is good, policy is silly
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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    Agree, but you haven't answered my question

    Aye, bit pathetic really e.g. attempting to delegate responsibility for foreigners pervading our society/workforce, and using shame to do so. What the country wants is direct action on immigration and integration. Intention is good, policy is silly
    I have
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    (Original post by queen-bee)
    I have
    No, you have not. In what sense does such a policy constitute seeking to turn a country into a Safe Space?
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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    No, you have not. In what sense does such a policy constitute seeking to turn a country into a Safe Space?
    By babying their citizens
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    (Original post by queen-bee)
    By babying their citizens
    In what sense is getting firms to report the proportion of their workers who are foreigners 'babying citizens'? :holmes:
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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    In what sense is getting firms to report the proportion of their workers who are foreigners 'babying citizens'? :holmes:
    What if the portion is high? What next?
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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    In what sense is getting firms to report the proportion of their workers who are foreigners 'babying citizens'? :holmes:
    I also struggle to see how considering its own citizens first - as is the primary duty of any government - count as "babying" them. It's easy for middle-class, metropolitan types to say that but tell that to the guy or girl who just got undercut by people willing to work for nothing. They've just gone from supporting their family and paying off the mortgage to living like crap.*
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    (Original post by MemeworksStudios)
    and your assumption is that the people who built one of the most successful nations in human history are less intelligent, less creative and less hardworking than people from failed states. Funny that.
    Just because Britain had a successful empire doesn't mean all its citizens for the rest of eternity are intelligent and deserve credit for it :lol:
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    (Original post by Lord Samosa)
    Just because Britain had a successful empire doesn't mean all its citizens for the rest of eternity are intelligent and deserve credit for it :lol:
    You are right, but why do largely middle class White Brits think the average Brit is an idiot and that every immigrant is a hardworking doctor, lawyer or engineer? Bear in mind I am only part British by ethnicity, I'm just sick to death of the bull.
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    This is obviously just a trick to get votes back from UKIP. Businesses want to make money and do business, it's not their job to educate the country.

    Maybe just work hard and don't expect everything to be handed to you.
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    (Original post by MemeworksStudios)
    You are right, but why do largely middle class White Brits think the average Brit is an idiot and that every immigrant is a hardworking doctor, lawyer or engineer? Bear in mind I am only part British by ethnicity, I'm just sick to death of the bull.
    I think we see a lot of lazy brits these days (especially when compared to previous generations), we just don't have a hard working ethic in this country anymore. Even unskilled immigrants can be more hardworking (obviously, they appreciate the opportunity more).

    I think the government should look to provide more opportunities for young people to develop skills needed in the world of work and work experience. University isn't the only path in life and the other options need to more encouraged for people who don't want to go to uni.
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    I also struggle to see how considering its own citizens first - as is the primary duty of any government - count as "babying" them. It's easy for middle-class, metropolitan types to say that but tell that to the guy or girl who just got undercut by people willing to work for nothing. They've just gone from supporting their family and paying off the mortgage to living like crap.*
    Well said. Many foreign workers are willing to live in large shared houses, two or three to a room, and so they have very low overheads and will happily take low wages. They live in very poor conditions to save money that can be sent home to their family. Corbyn's claim that they can just raise the minimum wage and enforce it is completely feeble; firstly, the minimum wage is hardly enough to raise a family and pay a mortgage. Second, even if it was widely enforced (it never is and probably can't be) the fact that you have large numbers of foreign workers who are willing to take low wages means that you have large numbers of jobs aggregating around that minimum wage in terms of their pay. It's supply and demand. So simply raising the minimum wage and enforcing it doesn't help with the fact that the minimum wage is still **** and allowing large numbers of foreign workers to flood in increases the number of jobs that will only pay minimum wage.

    So who does this benefit? It benefits big business, it benefits slum lords, it benefits the families of these people back home... but how does it benefit ordinary Britons? Theresa May in her speech after becoming First Lord of the Treasury pointed out that the group with the lowest chance of going to university are white working-class boys. I think it's time we started looking after our own first rather than constantly being expected to put the rest of the world's interests first and then being branded racist if we even consider doing something different. The days of that tactic working are over.
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    (Original post by Lord Samosa)
    I think we see a lot of lazy brits these days (especially when compared to previous generations), we just don't have a hard working ethic in this country anymore. Even unskilled immigrants can be more hardworking (obviously, they appreciate the opportunity more).

    I think the government should look to provide more opportunities for young people to develop skills needed in the world of work and work experience. University isn't the only path in life and the other options need to more encouraged for people who don't want to go to uni.
    What does it mean to be a lazy Brit? Working 40 hours per week and expecting to be able to live with basic dignity in a safe clean house or apartment meeting the mortgage payments each month so that they can retire homeowners, is actually a very reasonable demand from life. One of the posters above me mentioned flat-sharing and whilst I respect the pluckiness these migrants show and the willingness they have to make personal sacrifices, actually I can see why Brits feel anger at being shoved down into an underclass status by big business.
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    (Original post by AlexanderHam)
    Well said. Many foreign workers are willing to live in large shared houses, two or three to a room, and so they have very low overheads and will happily take low wages. They live in very poor conditions to save money that can be sent home to their family. Corbyn's claim that they can just raise the minimum wage and enforce it is completely feeble; firstly, the minimum wage is hardly enough to raise a family and pay a mortgage. Second, even if it was widely enforced (it never is and probably can't be) the fact that you have large numbers of foreign workers who are willing to take low wages means that you have large numbers of jobs aggregating around that minimum wage in terms of their pay. It's supply and demand. So simply raising the minimum wage and enforcing it doesn't help with the fact that the minimum wage is still **** and allowing large numbers of foreign workers to flood in increases the number of jobs that will only pay minimum wage.

    So who does this benefit? It benefits big business, it benefits slum lords, it benefits the families of these people back home... but how does it benefit ordinary Britons? Theresa May in her speech after becoming First Lord of the Treasury pointed out that the group with the lowest chance of going to university are white working-class boys. I think it's time we started looking after our own first rather than constantly being expected to put the rest of the world's interests first and then being branded racist if we even consider doing something different. The days of that tactic working are over.
    Quite right. I've worked with Poles so I understand the mindset. The ones I worked with were mostly super cool but what they do is live 5 or 6 to a 2/3 bed flat because they're only doing it for a couple of years before they go home again to a mortgage mostly paid off. Good for them. But how does it help us? I'd be the best toilet cleaner Lichtenstein has ever seen if I'm getting 80k and only had to do it for / or 3 years and I'm coming back to Blighty with silly money in my bank account. I don't care if I'm sharing a room with Steve and Martin in order to minimise expenses.*

    But what about Helmut and Jurgan? They went from earning 100k for the same job to being undercut by me. In Lichtenstein 100k could maybe support themselves and their kids. How does it help them when they suddenly compete with me who's not supporting a family in Lichtenstein and lives 2/3 to a room? Answer me that.

    My analogy is extreme but I've seen it count in this country with electricians, plumbers, builders, all sorts. A guy earns 35k and now Kuba is doing it for 23. And he's supposed to be happy about this? Some fools will denounce that electrician as stupid and useless and lazy for having his job taken/wages lowered but it's incredible how these guys suddenly become CORGI qualified on the plane from Kraków if they're happy to work for far less than what Phil was supporting his family on. So now Phil has gone from 35k to 23.

    B b b bbb but Phil be wayciss if he doesn't like it.

    Again. I don't blame the immigrants themselves one bit but don't be a dickhead and tell Phil it's his fault he lost out and he's a bigot for not embracing it.

    Some people are so clueless it's unreal. You see the people espousing the view outlined above and can tell they've never had any exposure whatsoever to the realities of normal people. Then they wonder why people consider them to be elitist bell ends and vote to leave the EU in a rage quit. Or they might not be elite themselves but they're so stupid and detached from reality that they support this anyway.

    *Edit: case in point:

    *
    (Original post by Lord Samosa)
    I think we see a lot of lazy brits these days (especially when compared to previous generations), we just don't have a hard working ethic in this country anymore. Even unskilled immigrants can be more hardworking (obviously, they appreciate the opportunity more). I think the government should look to provide more opportunities for young people to develop skills needed in the world of work and work experience. University isn't the only path in life and the other options need to more encouraged for people who don't want to go to uni.
    Moron *
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    But how does it help us? I'd be the best toilet cleaner Lichtenstein has ever seen if I'm getting 80k and only had to do it for / or 3 years and I'm coming back to Blighty with silly money in my bank account. I don't care if I'm sharing a room with Steve and Martin in order to minimise expenses.*
    This, 100%. It's extremely insulting when neoliberal propaganda claims "British workers are lazy and don't want to do these jobs". The real situation is that British workers don't want to do it for that level of pay. If they were paid properly then you would have no problem finding Brits who are happy to clean toilets.

    And I agree, most of the Poles I know here are cool people. But most people on earth are okay, the question is whether this immigration policy benefits the existing inhabitants of this country? If the answer is no then it doesn't matter how cool they are; our government's first obligation is to British citizens, not Polish grannies receiving their remittances.

    How does it help them when they suddenly compete with me who's not supporting a family in Lichtenstein and lives 2/3 to a room? Answer me that.
    It doesn't help in any way. Of course the native Lichtensteinians are then accused of being lazy by the people who benefit from lower wages, from middle-class who want cheap nannies, plumbers and cleaners.

    My analogy is extreme but I've seen it count in this country with electricians, plumbers, builders, all sorts.
    The cost of labour and the price of services hasn't increased in the construction, plumbing and electrical sectors for around ten years now. These used to be one of the few ways that a working-class person could, after a suitable apprenticeship earning fairly modest wages, actually earn decent money and enjoy a middle-class lifestyle and often become business owners themselves. Now that is going, a lot of this is now done by what are basically plumbing and electrical franchises that rely on the cheap labour, not on the old system of having your local plumber or builder

    Again. I don't blame the immigrants themselves one bit but don't be a dickhead and tell Phil it's his fault he lost out and he's a bigot for not embracing it.
    Absolument. Many (maybe even most) of us who are objecting to the flood of cheap labour driving down wages and conditions are not making any moral judgment against the immigrants; they are acting perfectly rationally. But consideration has to be given to those working-class people who are being squeezed out of anything resembling a decent living.

    Then they wonder why people consider them to be elitist bell ends and vote to leave the EU in a rage quit.
    To be honest, that was one of the biggest pleasures of seeing the announcement that Leave had won; seeing the smug, patronising attitude of so many of those people being wiped off their face and replaced by fear and uncertainty of the sort that has plagued ordinary working people all over this country for years.
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    I had it good until a Polish worker that was willing to accept minimum wage stole my cleaning job. A few years later I got booted from a building site because some Indian bloke was working longer hours than myself. My hate for immigrants goes beyond skin colour, I'm an equal opportunity offender!

    This country hates the working class! Some middle class toff was telling me how I had no excuse because I had acess to free school and free university whereas the immigrants didn't have access to that advantage. I slapped that posh clown across the head, it got me in trouble but it was worth it! I don't need no education for a job, didn't need a degree to scrub toilets or lay bricks.

    All these educated young people with degrees and stuff, never scrubbed a toilet or lifted a brick in their lives, never done a real job in their lives, are ashamed of their working class heritage. They don't need to worry about immigrants coming in and stealing their jobs because they got their education or whatever so they can do their accountancy or science crap in the labs.

    This is why the middle class and the elite are fine with immigrants while leaving the working class floundering. How selfish to try to force us into either unemployment, lowered salaries or some god aweful degree course while they live sheltered lives.
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    (Original post by MasterJack)
    All these educated young people with degrees and stuff, never scrubbed a toilet or lifted a brick in their lives, never done a real job in their lives
    I agree with a lot of your comment but please don't give is this crap about professional jobs, non-manual jobs, not being "real" jobs.

    Many city lawyers will work far longer hours than someone in construction does. Many scientists and engineers do jobs that are absolutely vital, without which there wouldn't be cars and planes and televisions and the internet.

    I believe that everyone, no matter what their job, is doing a "real" job and should be accorded dignity due to them as a human being.
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    (Original post by queen-bee)
    What if the portion is high? What next?
    You don't answer my question with a question, ducks. If you can't answer, just say so
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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    You don't answer my question with a question, ducks. If you can't answer, just say so
    But i've answered your question ...
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    (Original post by queen-bee)
    But i've answered your question ...
    No you haven't, see above :yy:

    Spoiler:
    Show
    P.S. Get some sleep little one :emog:
 
 
 
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