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Muslim child reported to police for 'bullet' which was just piece of brass watch

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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    How is saying Islam =/= Muslims politically correct? It's fact and anyone who reads my posts knows I'm anything but politically correct.

    I don't follow your logic. Anyone who does anything inappropriate should be criticised, be they Muslim or non-Muslim. My point is that many people fear criticising Muslims for doing certain things because they're scared of how they'll be labelled, whereas they'd have no problem criticising non-Muslims for doing the same thing.
    ...Calm down and evaluate your clear change of tone. I can't go thru this all day.

    Point is: you tiptoe around here saying Islam=/=Muslim trying to convince people that you don't have an issue with Muslims, rather only an issue with their religion ("logic") simply in favour of the massive Muslim demographic here (politically correct). But now you're suddenly saying you don't get why no one insults them (180). Get it? Good night.
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    #infantile tantrum
    (Original post by Lost Her Way)
    The context matters, a kid is not going to have a gun here.
    Of course not.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...onviction.html

    Do you have anything to offer apart from unsupported assertion?
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    I mean it literally is a 180. You can get aggressive if you want to but you can't go around being politically correct for social favour memeing people with "Islam=/=Muslims" and then being indignant that no one wants to criticise Muslims. :confused:
    You are conflating two different issues.
    1. Criticising Islam is not the same as criticising Muslims.
    2. Not justifiably criticising an individual Muslim because of their actions, due to fear of being labelled a bigot.

    To clarify - you can't criticise a Muslim for simply being a Muslim, but you can criticise them if they behave in an unacceptable manner.

    Example - you can't condemn all Muslims for condoning domestic violence, but you can condemn individual Muslims if they claim that sura 4:34 is perfect, immutable, universal and timeless.
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    lol whattt
    Beef = butchers (ie. where you get beef)
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    Tbh if the kid was dumb enough to go round saying it was a bullet then quite rightly he should be reported to the police.

    The same thing would happen to me if I was to walk around with an object claiming it was a bomb. It's ****ing common sense, not islamophobia
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    ...Calm down and evaluate your clear change of tone. I can't go thru this all day.

    Point is: you tiptoe around here saying Islam=/=Muslim trying to convince people that you don't have an issue with Muslims, rather only an issue with their religion ("logic" simply in favour of the massive Muslim demographic here (politically correct). But now you're suddenly saying you don't get why no one insults them (180). Get it? Good night.
    I think the issue here is the "Muslim gets questioned for doing something dodgy (must=) Islamophobia - even though what they did was obviously dodgy.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    You are conflating two different issues.
    1. Criticising Islam is not the same as criticising Muslims.
    2. Not justifiably criticising an individual Muslim because of their actions, due to fear of being labelled a bigot.

    To clarify - you can't criticise a Muslim for simply being a Muslim, but you can criticise them if they behave in an unacceptable manner.

    Example - you can't condemn all Muslims for condoning domestic violence, but you can condemn individual Muslims if they claim that sura 4:34 is perfect, immutable, universal and timeless.
    Why?

    Is it not the same as condemning all Christians, Jews, Whites, Blacks for condoning domestic violence?
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    ...Calm down and evaluate your clear change of tone. I can't go thru this all day.

    Point is: you tiptoe around here saying Islam=/=Muslim trying to convince people that you don't have an issue with Muslims, rather only an issue with their religion ("logic" simply in favour of the massive Muslim demographic here (politically correct). But now you're suddenly saying you don't get why no one insults them (180). Get it? Good night.
    I'm perfectly calm, perhaps it's you who needs to take a chill pill and get your position clear because it's making no sense at all.

    Absolutely false. I don't tiptoe round anyone. When a Muslim does an inappropriate action I will have no problem criticising that Muslim. And I also have no problem criticising Islam.

    I am saying nothing of the sort, learn the difference between criticism and insulting. I have said already that many people fear criticising Muslims for fear of being called islamophobic when this absurd political correctness shouldn't exist. What that boy did was dumb and the school rightly reported it. The fact he's Muslim doesn't change my opinion on that.

    Note that I'm not saying Muslims should be criticised just for being Muslims nor have I ever said that.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    You are conflating two different issues.
    1. Criticising Islam is not the same as criticising Muslims.
    2. Not justifiably criticising an individual Muslim because of their actions, due to fear of being labelled a bigot.

    To clarify - you can't criticise a Muslim for simply being a Muslim, but you can criticise them if they behave in an unacceptable manner.

    Example - you can't condemn all Muslims for condoning domestic violence, but you can condemn individual Muslims if they claim that sura 4:34 is perfect, immutable, universal and timeless.
    ...

    You do understand I'm noticing contradictions in his posts...and that the whole islam=/=muslim thing is his ideology...not mine? And that the conversation was finished between me and him until you revived it? And now straight after you post to me he comes tagging along trying t get his digs in when he hasn't a foot to stand on?

    Ok.
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    ...

    You do understand I'm noticing contradictions in his posts...and that the whole islam=/=muslim thing is his ideology...not mine? And that the conversation was finished between me and him until you revived it? And now straight after you post to me he comes tagging along trying t get his digs in when he hasn't a foot to stand on?

    Ok.
    It wasn't at all finished. Just because you don't get an instant reply doesn't mean a conversation is over. I fail to see any of these so-called contradictions in my post, I only see the confusing non-sequiturs you've come up with.
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    (Original post by Cherub012)
    Why?

    Is it not the same as condemning all Christians, Jews, Whites, Blacks for condoning domestic violence?
    The Quran has a verse that specifically allows Muslims to beat their wives "if they fear disobedience" (under certain conditions).

    As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them - Quran 4:34

    One of the fundamental tenets of Islam is that the Quran is the actual word of god, dictated to Muhammad, the ultimate guide for all humanity, and is as perfect, unchangable, universal and timeless now as it was 1400 years ago.
    In fact, it is considered an act of kufr (becoming non-Muslim) to reject even a single verse.

    So not the same at all, because none of the groups you mentioned have such divine permission to use violence to discipline a disobedient wife.
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    ...

    You do understand I'm noticing contradictions in his posts...and that the whole islam=/=muslim thing is his ideology...not mine? And that the conversation was finished between me and him until you revived it? And now straight after you post to me he comes tagging along trying t get his digs in when he hasn't a foot to stand on?

    Ok.
    Seems pretty straightforward to me.
    You are attempting to conflate two different and seperate concepts.
    Just because you do not see this does not mean that it is not happening.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    Seems pretty straightforward to me.
    You are attempting to conflate two different and seperate concepts.
    Just because you do not see this does not mean that it is not happening.
    Right Idk when you and plantagenet crown started dating but if you can't see his hypocrisy I can't help you and honestly I can't be arsed either. Now my issue isn't much about muslims or islam I don't really care so continue this little chat with him since you agree with him so much :confused: And yes congrats for knowing the words "conflation" and "conflate" anything else? Hope not because I won't be reading it.
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    Anyway like I said before my opinion is this:

    he shouldn't have said it or pretended he had a bullet, just so he can cry "Islamophobia" after, end of.
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    Right Idk when you and plantagenet crown started dating but if you can't see his hypocrisy I can't help you and honestly I can't be arsed either. Now my issue isn't much about muslims or islam I don't really care so continue this little chat with him since you agree with him so much :confused: And yes congrats for knowing the words "conflation" and "conflate" anything else? Hope not because I won't be reading it.
    Yet you haven't shown any hypocrisy and anyone reading my posts can see I have said nothing inconsistent. I have been quoting all your responses to me so I'm not sure where you're getting this conspiracy that QE2 and I are out to get you. Perhaps you're seeing what you want to see, just like you're seeing things in my posts that aren't there?
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    useless post, stop trying to argue and clear off.
    If you're going to falsely accuse someone of hypocrisy then expect them to reply, duh. And you should know better by now than to think telling someone to clear off over the internet is going to work.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Yet you haven't shown any hypocrisy and anyone reading my posts can see I have said nothing inconsistent. I have been quoting all your responses to me so I'm not sure where you're getting this conspiracy that QE2 and I are out to get you. Perhaps you're seeing what you want to see, just like you're seeing things in my posts that aren't there?
    Exactly. You only came back because he whiteknighted for you which is cute on both your parts. Like aren't you an adult, you don't really need to buddy up with the 1st person who quotes me to get your point across do you? :\

    Anyway I said what I had to say. Which is that you were being hypocritical. You dont have to agree but I'm not gonna keep explaining trying to get you to agree??? So stop triple-quoting me with [u]useless posts.
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    Exactly. You only came back because he whiteknighted for you which is cute on both your parts. Like aren't you an adult, you don't really need to buddy up with the 1st person who quotes me to get your point across do you? :\
    False. Making up things again just because you didn't get an instant reply. If you must know, I was watching ITV's Black Angel that I had recorded. You really need to stop getting so paranoid.

    Anyway I said what I had to say. Which is that you were being hypocritical. You dont have to agree but I'm not gonna keep explaining trying to get you to agree??? So stop triple-quoting me with useless posts, stop trying to argue and clear off.
    Yet I wasn't being hypocritical as you have utterly failed to show where this is so. Perhaps you're the hypocritical one who's telling me to stop arguing when it was you who first quoted me in this thread with a comment you knew would start an "argument"?
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    (Original post by QE2)
    The Quran has a verse that specifically allows Muslims to beat their wives "if they fear disobedience" (under certain conditions).

    As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them- Quran 4:34

    One of the fundamental tenets of Islam is that the Quran is the actual word of god, dictated to Muhammad, the ultimate guide for all humanity, and is as perfect, unchangable, universal and timeless now as it was 1400 years ago.
    In fact, it is considered an act of kufr (becoming non-Muslim) to reject even a single verse.

    So not the same at all, because none of the groups you mentioned have such divine permission to use violence to discipline a disobedient wife.
    Yeah sure. I was referring to the bit where you said: "You can't condemn all Muslims for condoning domestic violence."

    Why not?
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    (Original post by 0to100)
    Right Idk when you and plantagenet crown started dating but if you can't see his hypocrisy I can't help you and honestly I can't be arsed either. Now my issue isn't much about muslims or islam I don't really care so continue this little chat with him since you agree with him so much :confused: And yes congrats for knowing the words "conflation" and "conflate" anything else? Hope not because I won't be reading it.
    You could have saved yourself a bit of typing and just said "Sorry, I was wrong". It would have been the grown-up thing to do.
    Oh well.
 
 
 
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