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Overmars
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#8561
Report 11 years ago
#8561
(Original post by mhsc)
Good question :teeth:

I don't even know anymore, the results are speaking for themselves right now although lets not forget only a few matches ago we dropped points against Wigan needlessly.

I leave it to Romans judgement and don't much mind either way :yy:
Joint top at the top of the league and in the CL final. You'd be an idiot to sack him.

I hope the same Chelsea fans that booed Avram and chanted "You don't know what you're doing" when they were 1-0 down to Arsenal only a few weeks ago are feeling proud of themselves. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Fickle ****s.
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kpg
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#8562
Report 11 years ago
#8562
(Original post by dfhgksjldfxcz)
Joint top at the top of the league and in the CL final. You'd be an idiot to sack him.

I hope the same Chelsea fans that booed Avram and chanted "You don't know what you're doing" when they were 1-0 down to Arsenal only a few weeks ago are feeling proud of themselves. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Fickle ****s.
Yup
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Nissay
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#8563
Report 11 years ago
#8563
(Original post by RobbieC)
No, a dodgy decision did that... Oh wait, two dodgy decisions... But YNWA right?

Wrong, YNJOA - You'll NEVER Jog-ON Aloooooone.

Karma baby. Pure karma.
rofl i guess the universe balances itself.

tough run in CL: Inter, Arsenal, Chelsea. at least a little luck's needed >_>
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mhsc
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#8564
Report 11 years ago
#8564
Hopefully next season when we have the players he's chosen himself his decisions wont seem so crazy to make people say that :yy:
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NDGAARONDI
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#8565
Report 11 years ago
#8565
(Original post by Juwel)
Hmm. This whole Avram Grant thing reminds me of the bashing of Sven Goran Eriksson druing his time at England. The most successful England manager since Alf Ramsey, guiding us to three quarter-finals. But the feeling from the fans was that England had done all this despite rather than because of Eriksson and could well have gone further under a better man. I was one of Eriksson's detractors, thinking him defecient when it really mattered, and I see the same in Grant. As I said before, maybe he's a good coach; I don't think he's a manager yet.
Which is what I've always thought. And not having a UEFA Pro License doesn't help.
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RobbieC
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#8566
Report 11 years ago
#8566
Avram is a beast... looks quite like a frog I hear?
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Juwel
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#8567
Report 11 years ago
#8567
(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
Which is what I've always thought. And not having a UEFA Pro License doesn't help.
Mm, and I think it's altogether too basic to dismiss criticism of the manager as fickle if the team's achieving. After all, Chelsea arent leading the Premiership, so they can do better. And isn't the duty of any fan to ask better of his club, players and manager alike? I for one am critical of Sir Alex Ferguson's tactics in the first leg against Barcelona and the defeat to Chelsea on Saturday. Not to mention that we could've had the title bagged up if we'd taken rather more than five in the past four games.
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Panthalic
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#8568
Report 11 years ago
#8568
(Original post by Juwel)
And isn't the duty of any fan to ask better of his club, players and manager alike?
Not when they are demanding it, especially when they are already in the best position of the club's history.

(Original post by Juwel)
I for one am critical of Sir Alex Ferguson's tactics in the first leg against Barcelona and the defeat to Chelsea on Saturday. Not to mention that we could've had the title bagged up if we'd taken rather more than five in the past four games.
Aye, criticism is fine, but if you started calling for Fergie's head? You'd be mad.
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Artemidoros.
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#8569
Report 11 years ago
#8569






:teeth:
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mhsc
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#8570
Report 11 years ago
#8570
(Original post by (>-.-)>)
Aye, criticism is fine, but if you started calling for Fergie's head? You'd be mad.
Completely irrelevant comparison :yy:
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Laevis
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#8571
Report 11 years ago
#8571
Nice

I didn't know you could do that

:teeth: :teeth: :teeth:

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Klinsmannic
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#8572
Report 11 years ago
#8572
Chelsea could function to a reasonable standard without a manager tbh, I'm just not sure what that standard is yet. The squad, with its winning mentality, is capable of a consistent level of performance especially with experienced senior pros and a good back room. The likes of Steve Clarke and co get overlooked. I'm not an insider, but from my own view of Chelsea's recent history much of this 'success' is in spite of Grant as people have already said. I'd like to see Grant strip Mourinho's squad and buy his own players, and see how he does. Instinct tells me he won't do as well with a reshaped squad.
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Juwel
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#8573
Report 11 years ago
#8573
(Original post by (>-.-)>)
Not when they are demanding it, especially when they are already in the best position of the club's history.
(Aside: I saw that I said "his" rather than the neutral "their". You know I love you girls.)

I think when the best could've been better then it's something to grumble about. Granted (hoho), "Avram out" is a tad extreme when the guy's not had his first full season.

There's a parallel with Arsenal that's a good comparison; Wenger came from nowhere and did well and enjoyed a title in his first full season. The key difference is in the ambitions of the clubs at the time. Chelsea coming from two titles in the last three years, Arsenal in the mid-table doldrums at the time.
Aye, criticism is fine, but if you started calling for Fergie's head? You'd be mad.
Exactly, but that's down in large part because Ferguson has proved himself at the highest level in the past. Grant has no such precedent, and part of the criticism of him is maybe misdirected: what's Roman Abramovich doing harbouring the ambitions he does and then appointing someone with no top-level experience?

For one thing, I just think Grant's deficient tactically. The ace up his sleeve is sticking Nicolas Anelka on from the bench, but any half-witted manager starting with on centre forward would bring on a second if looking for a goal.
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NDGAARONDI
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#8574
Report 11 years ago
#8574
(Original post by Klinsmannic)
Chelsea could function to a reasonable standard without a manager tbh, I'm just not sure what that standard is yet. The squad, with its winning mentality, is capable of a consistent level of performance especially with experienced senior pros and a good back room. The likes of Steve Clarke and co get overlooked. I'm not an insider, but from my own view of Chelsea's recent history much of this 'success' is in spite of Grant as people have already said. I'd like to see Grant strip Mourinho's squad and buy his own players, and see how he does. Instinct tells me he won't do as well with a reshaped squad.
Assistants are commonly overlooked and sometimes you don't realise how much they contributed to the success of the club until they leave, e.g. Henk ten Cate.
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Laevis
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#8575
Report 11 years ago
#8575
(Original post by Klinsmannic)
Chelsea could function to a reasonable standard without a manager tbh, I'm just not sure what that standard is yet. The squad, with its winning mentality, is capable of a consistent level of performance especially with experienced senior pros and a good back room. The likes of Steve Clarke and co get overlooked. I'm not an insider, but from my own view of Chelsea's recent history much of this 'success' is in spite of Grant as people have already said. I'd like to see Grant strip Mourinho's squad and buy his own players, and see how he does. Instinct tells me he won't do as well with a reshaped squad.
Now that's a more legitimate, well supported argument against Grant, as opposed to just blurbing out a chorus of Avram Can't
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Panthalic
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#8576
Report 11 years ago
#8576
(Original post by mhsc)
Completely irrelevant comparison :yy:
Not really, he made the point about he as a United fan criticized Fergie's tactics, I was saying how that's not the same as what Chelsea fans have been up to. :yy:
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Juwel
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#8577
Report 11 years ago
#8577
(Original post by Klinsmannic)
Chelsea could function to a reasonable standard without a manager tbh, I'm just not sure what that standard is yet. The squad, with its winning mentality, is capable of a consistent level of performance especially with experienced senior pros and a good back room. The likes of Steve Clarke and co get overlooked. I'm not an insider, but from my own view of Chelsea's recent history much of this 'success' is in spite of Grant as people have already said. I'd like to see Grant strip Mourinho's squad and buy his own players, and see how he does. Instinct tells me he won't do as well with a reshaped squad.
Mm, and the bit in bold makes me wonder, if you could run an experiment where Chelsea play the season with a "control" top-level manager. OK, bit geeky, but I think you get my point.
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mhsc
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#8578
Report 11 years ago
#8578
(Original post by (>-.-)>)
Not really, he made the point about he as a United fan criticized Fergie's tactics, I was saying how that's not the same as what Chelsea fans have been up to. :yy:
Touche :yy:
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Panthalic
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#8579
Report 11 years ago
#8579
(Original post by Juwel)
Exactly, but that's down in large part because Ferguson has proved himself at the highest level in the past. Grant has no such precedent, and part of the criticism of him is maybe misdirected: what's Roman Abramovich doing harbouring the ambitions he does and then appointing someone with no top-level experience?

For one thing, I just think Grant's deficient tactically. The ace up his sleeve is sticking Nicolas Anelka on from the bench, but any half-witted manager starting with on centre forward would bring on a second if looking for a goal.
I wasn't commenting on Grant/Fergie tbh, more the suggestion that fans are duty-bound to always demand more. Especially in the current climate of having 4 top clubs in the frame for the title and many more for the CL, it seems almost arrogant to demand the trophy. You can aim for or want the trophies and you can expect a strong challenge for them, but ultimately there's just not enough to go round and you have to be prepared to be ones of the ones that miss out.
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Laevis
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#8580
Report 11 years ago
#8580
(Original post by Juwel)
Mm, and the bit in bold makes me wonder, if you could run an experiment where Chelsea play the season with a "control" top-level manager. OK, bit geeky, but I think you get my point.
They have a lot of strong, determined characters on the pitch, so I think they would do well. Arsene Wenger said he'd review the captaincy situation at Arsenal in the Summer, and immediately fans started talking about who else could do it. The best suggestion apart from Gallas was a leaving Flamini probably. Compare that to Chelsea, who have any one of the following who would make top captains IMO: Cech, Terry, Essien, Makelelelele, Lampard (he embodied their mental strength tonight) Ballack, and even Joe Cole. Probably Carvalho, too. Jose Mourinho was definitely assembling a self-sustaining team of leaders, with great spirit.
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